U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Atheism and Agnosticism
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-06-2012, 07:53 AM
 
16,105 posts, read 17,923,003 times
Reputation: 15897

Advertisements


Richard Dawkins - Absolute Morality - YouTube
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-06-2012, 09:24 AM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
8,410 posts, read 9,157,087 times
Reputation: 13120
So you believe that under certain circumstances it is OK to sexually molest or physically abuse young children? Or is it never right?.

That my friend is an example of absoute morality versus situational morality.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-06-2012, 09:35 AM
 
Location: Rivendell
1,387 posts, read 2,167,439 times
Reputation: 1650
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
So you believe that under certain circumstances it is OK to sexually molest or physically abuse young children? Or is it never right?.

That my friend is an example of absoute morality versus situational morality.
Of course in these modern times everyone would agree with you. It is never right.

But if you were in ancient Rome, having sex with a child was not uncommon.
They apparently had no problem with it. They also thought slavery was a good thing. Fights to the death with wild animals in the arena was a form of public entertainment.

Sounds pretty situational to me.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-06-2012, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Missouri, USA
4,404 posts, read 2,985,173 times
Reputation: 2040
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
So you believe that under certain circumstances it is OK to sexually molest or physically abuse young children? Or is it never right?.

That my friend is an example of absoute morality versus situational morality.
May I answer this as well as the instigator of the thread?

Christianity has followed secural reasoning, lagging behind society somewhat. Islam and Judaism may be different...I don't know much about them.

The Catholic church has changed policy regarding slavery, heliocentricism, and there is no way the modern Pope would condone a new crusade like those of old. Why else would they do this if not for secular reasoning?

Protestant churches split, as they've split into thousands of segments, thereby changing through secular reasoning as well. There don't seem to be many fire and brimstone threateners any more...it's mostly about love and forgiveness. Why would this be if not for it not being as socially acceptable during modern times?

People don't follow religion...at least Chrisianity, Christianity follows people. It is the morality of old.

If we are progressively collapsing into immorality, religion could be a good thing, but if we are getting better, religion could slow us down.

Unless one doesn't think about morality at all, in which case religion would be vastly preferable, why not follow one's own judgements? The church does the same thing...it just takes longer.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-06-2012, 03:52 PM
 
16,105 posts, read 17,923,003 times
Reputation: 15897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
So you believe that under certain circumstances it is OK to sexually molest or physically abuse young children? Or is it never right?.

That my friend is an example of absoute morality versus situational morality.
I don't believe either is right, but that is NOT based on the absolute morality of religion (actually religion has condoned both depending on the time frame). Morality and ethics based on reasoning would say that we should not harm others whether they are children or adults. Think it through.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-06-2012, 06:50 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
8,410 posts, read 9,157,087 times
Reputation: 13120
Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
I don't believe either is right, but that is NOT based on the absolute morality of religion (actually religion has condoned both depending on the time frame). Morality and ethics based on reasoning would say that we should not harm others whether they are children or adults. Think it through.
Reasoning said jews were inferior and a danger to society in Nazi Germany. So it was OK to get rid of the Jew.

And where has Jesus, Paul or Moses ever said it is OK to sexually abuse young children?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-06-2012, 07:11 PM
 
2,447 posts, read 2,681,857 times
Reputation: 2203
This is common sense. Just because many of us agree there are things that are wrong, doesn't mean they are always wrong everywhere in the entire universe.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-06-2012, 07:46 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
8,410 posts, read 9,157,087 times
Reputation: 13120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aganusn View Post
This is common sense. Just because many of us agree there are things that are wrong, doesn't mean they are always wrong everywhere in the entire universe.
So do you think under some cicumstances sexually molesting six year old kids is fine?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-06-2012, 07:53 PM
 
3,404 posts, read 2,252,936 times
Reputation: 1317
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
Reasoning said jews were inferior and a danger to society in Nazi Germany. So it was OK to get rid of the Jew.

And where has Jesus, Paul or Moses ever said it is OK to sexually abuse young children?
As far as sexual abuse, I would have to place the contents of Number 31:15-18 on display.
15 “Have you allowed all the women to live?” he asked them. 16 “They were the ones who followed Balaam’s advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the LORD in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the LORD’s people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.
It seems pretty clear that God himself is recorded as commanding, through Moses, that virginal and prepubescent girls be spared and kept, "...for yourselves..." To suggest that there is no sexual intent here, when virginity is the criterion, seems pretty intentionally blind, but as further evidence, we find a passage in Judges 21 using the same language where it s clear that these women and girls are captured to be used sexually with no regard for their consent.

I also noticed that you left out phyiscal abuse portion of your previous assertion. Without filling this post with Bible quotes, we can just look throughout Numbers and Joshua to see God directly commanding children murdered. That has to count as abuse!

So at this point we have God, through Moses and Joshua, condoning the murder and rape of children.

This is why those of us who do not believe, are so resistant to using the God described in the Bible as some sort of absolute standard of morality. Based on the absolute morality you seem to be espousing, God is immoral. It just makes no sense.

NoCapo
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-06-2012, 08:00 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
8,410 posts, read 9,157,087 times
Reputation: 13120
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoCapo View Post
As far as sexual abuse, I would have to place the contents of Number 31:15-18 on display.
15 “Have you allowed all the women to live?” he asked them. 16 “They were the ones who followed Balaam’s advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the LORD in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the LORD’s people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.
NoCapo
I seemed to have missed something. Can you point out where Moses says it is OK to sexually abuse young children?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Atheism and Agnosticism
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top