U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Atheism and Agnosticism
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-15-2012, 12:45 PM
 
4,953 posts, read 1,739,219 times
Reputation: 1843
Indeed, there is a few users on here I keep talking as much as I can because their nonsense, invective, hatred, lies and more show their side of the fence for what it really is. You can search my post history and see quite a few posts on the subject of keeping some people talking because they do half your work for you.

I just do not think the user we are talking about is one of them. His lies are just egregious and insane at times, and his English is so bad that most people do not bother reading his posts anyway. All his presence achieves it seems is to derail otherwise useful threads.

I prefer to focus on keeping the more disgusting, but at least partially articulate people talking and expose the more subtle tricks and lies they operate with. That at least achieves something.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-15-2012, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Dallas, Texas
1,803 posts, read 1,143,763 times
Reputation: 940
Monkey, I'd be in the same boat you are. If I were to find out tomorrow that a specific god exists, I wouldn't worship it either, because it would have, in my view, failed in doing anything worthy of worship.

So yea, life would change little, except maybe I'd join a rebellion and fight back! Take that, bad god!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-15-2012, 02:12 PM
 
Location: Sitting on a bar stool. Guinness in hand.
2,661 posts, read 3,250,022 times
Reputation: 1072
Quote:
Originally Posted by greaemonkey View Post
Wow, did I really do that poor of a job trying to make my point, or are people simply not reading? I'm not addressing the hypothetical itself as much as the lack of logic behind the assumptions some people appear to be making by foisting the hypothetical on us in the first place.
You have to be careful in giving a thread a title sometimes. Some folk will see a title of a thread and just go in guns-a-blazing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-15-2012, 02:29 PM
 
Location: Pflugerville
2,213 posts, read 2,384,395 times
Reputation: 2175
As I said in the other thread you quoted in your OP, as a person who believe in science, if proof was presented to me, and I felt it passed the smell test, then I would become a theist and absolutely nothing about my life would change. I already treat my fellow man well, give to charity, call my mom on a regular basis, am good to my husband, contribute to my community blah blah blah. If all of the sudden scientists could prove God existed, then it would be the same as if Scientists could prove that dogs could talk. I would be mildly intrested for 2 seconds, then I would move on, b/c it would not be a life changer for me. I happen to be atheist. I don't live for my atheism. Unlike a theist whose religion is sometimes the most important thing about them, I dn't really care.

The problem with this question, and it is a recurrent problem I find when people talk about atheism v/ theism is that most people have their terms wrong.

Atheism means you don't believe in god. Theism means you do believe in god. Atheism is the OPPOSITE of theism (and ONLY theism). That's it. The problem with talking to a religious person is that they are so used to the BS and mythology associated with their religion that they forget this little fact. So when I talk to my catholic relatives they say, "well, you're an atheist, so you believe the opposite of me..." and I say. "No. no no no no." I am an atheist. I don't believe in god. The opposite of me is a theist, they do believe in god.

A catholic on the other hand, is more than just a theist. A catholic believes in god, and this god created the universe, and this god wants to have a personal relationship with humans and this god is vengeful, but he has mellowed out since he had a kid, oh and that kid was named jesus and he spent some time on earth, he's a zombie now though, and there are these guys called priests that can turn bread and wine into flesh and blood, but just don't look at it under a microscope b/c it still looks like bread and wine, oh, and we eat the flesh and blood because that's what zombie jesus wants, i mean duh, he's a zombie. Also, if you don't dip your head in water with a preist there you have something called original sin and you go to hell when you die, oh, and you have to give a lot of money to the pope so he can buy lots of golden rings and blah blah blah blah blah....

Catholicism is NOT the opposite of atheism. Neither is judaism or islam or scientology or whatever. Theism is the opposite of atheism.

So it's important to remember what atheism is. And if scientists proved tomorrow that there is a god, then yes, I would be a theist b/c I am willing to accept evidence. But my life wouldn't change because there is NO mythology mixed up in my thought process. I wouldn't suddenly become a catholic, or a jew, or a muslim or anything else....I would only become a thiest. And my life would be EXACTLY the same.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-15-2012, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Dallas
160 posts, read 65,156 times
Reputation: 85
Thanks for the responses! Note that in the OP I used the term "deist" rather than "theist" mostly because "theist" tends to imply "theism" to me (a specific deity or deities). I highly doubt anyone could ever prove a specific deity, so about the best I could hope for is deism. Even in the case of Biblegod or Korangod being "proven" I'm not sure I'd make it past deist since that would imply something beyond mere belief.

I agree with a lot of the initial knee-jerk responses to the post though. The mere asking of the question by those who are incapable of even fathoming the idea that they might be wrong, or what their own response would be upon figuring out just what they are asking us to imagine is more than a little disingenuous.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2012, 12:21 AM
 
Location: Canada
3,518 posts, read 3,126,421 times
Reputation: 2880
If a creator deity were proved tomorrow? Of course I'd accept the fact if it were a clear as day fact, and I'd become intensely curious about this intelligent phenomenon! Can you honestly tell me you'd be that indifferent if this were true? I'm a scientist (and an atheist), and this would have serious implication for the nature of reality, I'd want to know as much about it as possible. I would likely treat it with the same curiosity and wonder I would treat an alien civilization with if we discovered one tomorrow. To be honest, I don't want to even consider a world where that creator is this horrible, oppressive thing that watches us every second of the day and punishes us if we don't follow poorly documented rules coming to us tenth hand from an old savage who heard about them thousands of years back. That would be too awful a world.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2012, 06:31 AM
 
4,698 posts, read 3,434,041 times
Reputation: 1641
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aganusn View Post
If I was asian, then I would be asian. If there was evidence, everything we know could be different.
Yeah, something like this. We'd need more specifics about what this god thingy is before answering.

Deist god? Nothing changes. H.P. Lovecraft's idea of the supernatural? Uh oh.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2012, 06:53 AM
 
Location: Dallas
160 posts, read 65,156 times
Reputation: 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIMBAM View Post
If a creator deity were proved tomorrow? Of course I'd accept the fact if it were a clear as day fact, and I'd become intensely curious about this intelligent phenomenon! Can you honestly tell me you'd be that indifferent if this were true? I'm a scientist (and an atheist), and this would have serious implication for the nature of reality, I'd want to know as much about it as possible. I would likely treat it with the same curiosity and wonder I would treat an alien civilization with if we discovered one tomorrow. To be honest, I don't want to even consider a world where that creator is this horrible, oppressive thing that watches us every second of the day and punishes us if we don't follow poorly documented rules coming to us tenth hand from an old savage who heard about them thousands of years back. That would be too awful a world.
As a scientist, such a discovery would probably be a real life-changer for you since you'd probably have to re-evaluate quite a bit. I like the "alien civilization" analogy you used, because that's probably about the same level I'd have ...I'd be curious, I'd probably even read voraciously about it, but it still wouldn't be any huge life-changer for me in either case. I never meant to imply I'd be utterly indifferent to it ...simply that falling down and worshiping, awe-inspired groveling or regret for not believing up to that point wouldn't be the likely course either (hence my distaste for the "oh yeah, well when you die and find out you'll be really REALLY sorry" approach we hear ad nauseum).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2012, 07:00 AM
 
Location: New Mexico
8,262 posts, read 4,766,874 times
Reputation: 3882
Lightbulb What if there were evidence

Then faith and belief would become totally irrelevant.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-16-2012, 07:25 AM
 
Location: Pflugerville
2,213 posts, read 2,384,395 times
Reputation: 2175
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIMBAM View Post
If a creator deity were proved tomorrow? Of course I'd accept the fact if it were a clear as day fact, and I'd become intensely curious about this intelligent phenomenon! Can you honestly tell me you'd be that indifferent if this were true? I'm a scientist (and an atheist), and this would have serious implication for the nature of reality, I'd want to know as much about it as possible. I would likely treat it with the same curiosity and wonder I would treat an alien civilization with if we discovered one tomorrow. To be honest, I don't want to even consider a world where that creator is this horrible, oppressive thing that watches us every second of the day and punishes us if we don't follow poorly documented rules coming to us tenth hand from an old savage who heard about them thousands of years back. That would be too awful a world.
yes, I would be honestly indifferent. There are many things in nature that I do not understand, but just accept on face value because I do not have the time and energy to invest in learning about it. If all of the sudden it went from "evolution" made this to "god" made this, then I would make a mental note, then move on with my life.

Let me give you an example. I drive a car everyday. I have NO idea how an internal combustion engine works. I just know that my car goes vroom. If a mechanic came to me tomorrow and said "Your car doesn't run on gas anymore, it runs on water" I would make a mental note on what to fill the tank up with, and move on with my life. Why? Because the purpose of my car is to get me from point A to point B. Until it stops doing that, I am not really interested in the "hows". I don't sit and think of the philisophical implications of the internal combustion engine. It is simply a tool that allows me to live my life.

To me a deity would be the same thing. If science DID discover evidence of god, I find it VERY unlikely that this god in all his/her intelligence, majesty and power would give two craps about what I think or what I am doing. I would be an ant to it. An aomeba. A speck of dust on the wind, not worth Gods time or energy. Since "god" wouldn't expect worship from me, woudln't expect anything from me, my life would largely remain unchanged. I would still find nature beautiful. I would still eat the plants and animals nature provided. The natural laws of the universe would remain in place......I would just make a mental note that God created it. Like with my car, I don't sit around and wax philosophical on the creation of the universe. For me it's enough that the universe exists, it functions the way it functions, and I have figure out how to live in it. A flower is still beautiful whether God or evolution provided it for me. My family, friends, hobbies, job, pets occupy the bulk of my time. They are what makes me happy, not pleasing some "god".

That's why I don't care if people are Theists or Deists. More power to them. I have an explanation to the origin of the universe, they have a different explanation. It's not worth an argument over because the end result is we both have a wonderful universe to enjoy in our short time occupying it. I DO CARE however when someone takes the extra step to go from Deist to Religious nut. Where it's not enough for us to just live and let live, no no no no, now a human being, with their limited mind, is trying to tell me that not only IS there a god, but they can comprehend gods vast and awesome mind, and they want to legislate their interpretation of his will. And what a SURPRISE god loves everything about them and hates everything about the rest of us....go figure.

Call me uncurious I guess. The origins of the universe DO interest me...but not so much that it would be a revelation to me or a life changer if I find out there is a universal intelligence. It would be interesting...but then the mortgage would be due and I have more important PERSONAL things to deal with.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $84,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Atheism and Agnosticism
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:46 AM.

2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top