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Old 01-13-2013, 04:56 AM
 
98 posts, read 58,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Griffis View Post
For the existence of a god or gods? Please DO provide some. I'm all ears!
Thats NOT the topic of this thread. But you can read this topic:

Arguments for the Existence of God

If you want to respond to the arguments, please open a new thread, this one is to make a case for strong atheism.

 
Old 01-13-2013, 04:57 AM
 
98 posts, read 58,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nozzferrahhtoo View Post
That does not change the fact that currently it is a not just slightly, but ENTIRELY unsubstantiated answer. .
empty assertion......
 
Old 01-13-2013, 05:01 AM
 
98 posts, read 58,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaggieZ View Post
there's plenty of life out there in space, we just don't see it as such..chemicals that are needed to produce living organisms came here by comet! Right now a planet somewhere out there, may start to produce life, we just don't know it yet. There's no god needed to start anything...Space is expanding at a fascinating rate. And were learning more each day about it, no god needed. Religion has run its course I'd say.
what scientific evidence do you have to back up your claim ?
 
Old 01-13-2013, 05:18 AM
 
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Quote:
Nope. Never said that, but your invisible God who Insta-Poofed everything into place in 6 days (why did it take him that long, btw?) version is very much like a claim that we all came, one sunny Sunday, as a philosophical god-Phart issued from out of the rose-dolored rear end of a prancing unicorn. Without even a shred of evidence for such a claim, or for your god, not to mention the disconnect with all the other fairy-tale versions of Gods and Creation.
How about you answer the question of my initial post, and present POSITIVE evidence for your case ? i will help you a littlebit. Beside a intelligent , powerful creator, you are just left with chance, or physical necessity, to explain our existence. Please make a good case for these two alternative possibilities to explain how everything was created. Good luck with that. So far, no one has been able here to present good reasons why these alternatives should be good explanations.


Quote:
Plus, despite His omnipotence, He refuses to EVER show His face, but of course, He being a phartillusion, never will.
how would he have to show his face in order you to believe ? Jesus said to be the son of God, made miracles that no other human being ever made, and ressurrected........

Quote:
Meantime, we scientists plod along
Sorry to tell you, but atheists do not monopolise science. the foundation actually of modern science is based on the christian faith. There are scientists , that believe in creation, and others in other alternatives. Science is neutral in the theist x atheist debate.



Quote:
, taking intelligent and logical hypothesis testing to ever-higher planes of technical ability
So where are the good scientific proposals for chance, or physical necessity ? again : thats ALL you have left, if you exclude a intelligent creator.



Quote:
, and then we do indeed at least see consistent evidence of our ever-more plausible version.
Which is what evidence ???

Quote:
Higg's particle for example, which so many fundy Christians were told to hate! Can't have new irrefutible strong evidence (evidence that you will nonetheless then rote-chant deny exists....) all while claiming your version is robustly supported by real "evidence", the kind our findings are apparently so lacking in!
so how exactly does the higgs boson provide evidence for naturalism ??!!

Quote:
Of course, unless you live in a cave or your mother's basement and don't EVER get out or read anything, you know this relentless accumulation of real and demonstrable FACTS to be true right?: (spherical earth versus what again?
Sorry to tell you, but you make your argument based on preconceptions.

Quote:
a case of a creator, page 107

Writers of astronomy textbooks just keep recycling the myth, sort of like the flat-Earth myth, which was the idea that Columbus was told the Earth was flat and he thought it was round. That's just wrong too."
"Scholars at the time knew it was a sphere," added Gonzalez. "Even the ancient Greeks knew it was a sphere."
"They'd known it for a thousand years or more," said Richards.
I knew they were right about that. David Lindberg, former professor of the history of science and currently director of the Institute for Research in the Humanities at the University of Wisconsin, said in a recent interview:
One obvious [myth] is that before Columbus, Europeans believed nearly unanimously in a flat Earth-a belief allegedly drawn from certain biblical statements and enforced by the medieval church. This myth seems to have had an eighteenth century origin, elaborated and popularized by Washington Irving, who flagrantly fabricated evidence for it in his four-volume history of Columbus.... The truth is that it's almost impossible to find an educated person after Aristotle who doubts that the Earth is a sphere. In the Middle Ages, you couldn't emerge from any kind of education, cathedral school or university, without being perfectly clear about the Earth's sphericity and even its approximate circumference.32
Quote:
And, for the record yet again, scientist's ideas are never absolutely "For Sure", but when it walks like a platypus [Ornithorhynchus], talks like one and looks like one, and it's recently done DNA lineage map clearly shows it to be of and from known Ornithorhynchus predecessors, findable [as "evidence, btw, JAH...] located in the fossil and sedimentary record, all neatly chronologically separated, oldest being deeper, youngest, including yesterday's recent dead, then we are in a damn-site more defensible position than you are finding yourselves in as time ticks along and defensible evidence-supported knowledge goes.
Thats actually evidence for creation......


Scott M. Huse wrote1997, p.149, emp. added).

Quote:
There are several good reasons for rejecting the evolutionary interpretation of the origin of the platypus. A few of these reasons include: (1) Platypus fossils are exactly the same as modern forms. (2)The complex structures of the egg and milk glands are always fully developed and offer no solution as to the origin and development of the womb or the milk. (3) The more typical mammals are found in much lower strata that the egg-laying platypus. Thus, the duck-billed platypus appears to be a distinct kind of animal in and of itself that has been specifically designed to include a mixture of traits

Last edited by Jah888; 01-13-2013 at 05:31 AM..
 
Old 01-13-2013, 06:17 AM
 
98 posts, read 58,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arjay51 View Post
Everything begins to exist?.
Did i write that ? you should read my post more carefully.

Beside this, you are far from accepting for yourself as true, only what can be empirically proven.......Your worldview is based on faith.
 
Old 01-13-2013, 06:19 AM
 
98 posts, read 58,862 times
Reputation: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Griffis View Post
What I said was--and I was correct--is that we have no evidence for the existence of a god or gods. .
So what positive evidence do you have to back up strong atheism ? that is the question of this thread.
 
Old 01-13-2013, 06:21 AM
 
98 posts, read 58,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiker45 View Post
Sorry. I should have said that I believe the Universe has always existed.

Of course, it doesn't matter. I am just happy it exists right now.
Of course it DOES matter. That is a essential and crucial question. So what scientific evidence do you have to back up your belief, the universe has always existed ?
 
Old 01-13-2013, 06:22 AM
 
98 posts, read 58,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggy001 View Post
Nope ... I am comfortable in my disbelief. I feel no need to justify it to you or anybody else.
So i guess its sensless for you to participate at this thread ?
 
Old 01-13-2013, 06:42 AM
 
98 posts, read 58,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman View Post

√ We do not yet understand all the intricacies of the physical universe, including it's possible origins. We also now have some excellent evidence that does, howver, support the model that astronomers ( a credible and valid branch of science, bte...)
But the most renown scientists today aknowledge that most probably the universe had a a beginning.

http://www.city-data.com/forum/newre...ply&p=27723863

Quote:
Arno Penzias told me: "So what we find the simplest theory the one that the astronomers normally espouse, is a creation out of nothing, the appearance out of nothing of a universe." And in my most recent interview with Robert Jastrow, he said, "It's a curiously theological result to come out of science."
therefore it had a cause. From absolutely nothing, nothing derives.


Quote:
√ It may have pre-existed, but in another space.size and time continuum. Einstein told us such things were possible, and he had the reasonable numbers to prove it. What numbers and observations do you have, jda?
If that would be the case, than the question of the origin would be just pulled further back......
 
Old 01-13-2013, 06:45 AM
 
98 posts, read 58,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miss Crabcakes View Post
We don't know. No one knows. How would one even find that out? How are we to even pull this information together?

Its unknowable.
you admit then, that strong atheism is in the end based on nihilism. Nothing can be known for sure. thats a declaration of bankrupcy.

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