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Old 01-09-2013, 03:47 PM
 
98 posts, read 58,999 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kentmum View Post
Please could you expand on what you mean by 'nothing beyond the "natural" universe exists'. I genuinely don't understand the sentence. Are you saying that God is beyond the natural universe?
yes, i believe in a transcendent God, which exists above his creation.

 
Old 01-09-2013, 03:49 PM
 
98 posts, read 58,999 times
Reputation: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by purehuman View Post
The lack of presence of a God, for one...have you ever seen him/her?
have you ever seen your thoughts ? do you have any ?
 
Old 01-09-2013, 03:54 PM
 
98 posts, read 58,999 times
Reputation: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by hiker45 View Post
No one created Earth. When the sun was forming, it shot atoms into space. The force of gravity caused these atoms to come together and form the planets.

It seems very natural to me.
oh sure. And why are there atoms ? why is there a universe, which is able to host life ? the formation of planets is a mistery, no scientist has been able to present a reasonable explanation.

Discovery Adds Mystery to Earth's Genesis | Earth & Terrestrial Planets | The Sun & Solar System Formation | Space.com

Quote:
Scientists examined solar particles snagged in space by NASA's Genesis probe, whose return capsule crash-landed on Earth in 2004. These salvaged samples show that the sun's basic building blocks differ significantly from those of Earth, the moon and other denizens of the inner solar system, researchers said.
 
Old 01-09-2013, 03:59 PM
 
Location: Richland, Washington
4,145 posts, read 5,114,467 times
Reputation: 2540
You seem to be confused on what sttrong atheism is. Strong atheism is the position that the existence of any sort of deity is absolutely impossible. A strong atheist may still believe in all sorts of weird claims, just not god. What you're referring to is naturalism or materialism which is a nontheistic philosophy that asserts there is nothing supernatural and that the natural world is all there is. The reason this position is the most rational is because there's no evidence that supports the existence of anything supernatural. This is analogous to how you probably don't believe in the existence of werewolves. There's no evidence that supports the existence of werewolves so there's no reason to accept the belief in werewolves is anything more than nonsense.
 
Old 01-09-2013, 04:59 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
41,200 posts, read 18,619,681 times
Reputation: 18758
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jah888 View Post
I believe in a eternal God, without beginning , without a end.
From absolutely nothing, nothing derives. Therefore, there was never a moment when absolutely nothing existed. Something must have existed beyond time.
Swell, there is better evidence that matter and energy are eternal than there is for an eternal god. At least we can see, feel, drink, smell, throw, reshape or accordion pleat matter, we enjoy no such evidence for a god. We know matter and energy are here now, we don't know that a god has ever been around.

Which has been around forever? My money would be on the one that we at least know is around at the moment.
 
Old 01-09-2013, 05:06 PM
 
1,646 posts, read 1,571,010 times
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The classic burden of proof cop out by sophomoric atheist debaters is getting tired.

Of course you can prove a negative. Example: I can prove that there are no Muslims in the senate.

There is evidence for a creator. People who deny this, just refuse to accept said evidence. I do acknowledge that faith is involved. But, believing that stars exploding and things colliding together could bring forth the world around us, takes much more faith imo.
 
Old 01-09-2013, 05:16 PM
 
Location: Boone, NC
1,047 posts, read 1,976,457 times
Reputation: 1046
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdaelectro View Post
The classic burden of proof cop out by sophomoric atheist debaters is getting tired.
Christians ignoring the very plain "**** off" post stickied at the beginning of this sub-forum is getting tiresome. This is our section, the debating can happen in the general religion section, you have no right to come on here and berate us. As for the burden of proof argument I think it's very valid. We have nothing to gain by converting you to atheism. You're the one spending your time trying to convert us.

I'm not going to fall down and worship a deity whose existence can't be proven. Plain and simple. Maybe the big bang theory takes faith, but at least there's science behind it, we're always searching for the answers. We, unlike you, accept that we can't be 100% certain, there's always more to discover. As it stands, actual scientific evidence of a deity hasn't been part of that discovery.
 
Old 01-09-2013, 05:17 PM
 
1,646 posts, read 1,571,010 times
Reputation: 1206
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
Swell, there is better evidence that matter and energy are eternal than there is for an eternal god. At least we can see, feel, drink, smell, throw, reshape or accordion pleat matter, we enjoy no such evidence for a god. We know matter and energy are here now, we don't know that a god has ever been around.
Except, you can't have an infinite amount of finite things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
Which has been around forever? My money would be on the one that we at least know is around at the moment.
If time were infinite, there would be no "moments" just an everlasting now.
 
Old 01-09-2013, 05:20 PM
 
Location: Boone, NC
1,047 posts, read 1,976,457 times
Reputation: 1046
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdaelectro View Post
If time were infinite, there would be no "moments" just an everlasting now.
The theory is that time did not proceed as it did now before the big bang. Your god is the one who claims to exist outside time.
 
Old 01-09-2013, 05:23 PM
 
1,646 posts, read 1,571,010 times
Reputation: 1206
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSS94 View Post
Christians ignoring the very plain "**** off" post stickied at the beginning of this sub-forum is getting tiresome. This is our section, the debating can happen in the general religion section, you have no right to come on here and berate us.
There is no conversion attempt in what I said. I am within the lines of the OP and the OP is directed at a certain kind of atheist. So be it, if the thread needs to be moved.
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