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Old 01-21-2013, 11:49 AM
 
Location: southern california
55,659 posts, read 74,604,692 times
Reputation: 48166

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the possibility that someone could make a large boat/raft from primate materials and get some animals on it and a few people and survive a major flood does not stretch my imagination. to say it encompassed all mankind all animals might be taken in context of what the author perceived as all mankind and all animals.
to say that someone with psychic ability fortold a flood or disaster nobody listened and then most perished does not stretch my imagination, i watched that this morning on TV, the inauguration. see my posts since 2007. hey and i am not even pyschic.

 
Old 01-21-2013, 11:56 AM
 
16,092 posts, read 17,888,868 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wretched.elect View Post
It's funny that when arguing against creationism, and all of the things that go along with it, the only possible explanation, other than pure mental illness, is that it all happened by magic. And yet that is exactly what the 'theory' of evolution wants everyone to accept, that it was 'magic' that caused the first 'accidental' organic creature to come about. Then, magically, fish began to breath air and moved to land. Then, magically, they grew legs and began walking on them. Then, magically, those legs became wings and birds suddenly came into being. Then, that cow that grew out of the fish, with all of it's 'magical' evolutionary jumps, walked back into the water and became whales and dolphins! That's not even mentioning the 'magical' appearance of complex organs (liver, stomach, kidney, eye, lungs, brain, etc.) All of these 'magical' biological developments within the various creature are explained as some kind of intelligence that the evolutionary process has in order to able to make these evolutionary advances. And this has to be done over and over and over again hoping that each new genetic mutation doesn't actually kill the the new species. But hey, it's 'magic', it can happen.
There is no magic involved in evolution, just natural processes that work over a long period of time.

For example, the evolution of breathing air is explained here:
http://www.iab.uaf.edu/news/news_rel...release_id=104

and here:

What caused the evolution of air-breathing animals? | Machines Like Us

Quote:
In order to explain the existence of air-breathing adaptations in a marine lungfish, the researchers looked to environmental factors other than habitat. They turned to existing knowledge about global oxygen levels in the Devonian, which fell as low as 12 per cent of the total atmosphere. Today oxygen levels are at 20 per cent.

“This plunge in global oxygen levels would have been a strong selection pressure on lungfish and other animals, including the tetrapods – the fish-like ancestors of land animals,” explains Professor Long. “This makes us believe that breathing air arose twice at this early time in vertebrate evolution: once in lungfishes, and once in the fish lineage leading to land animals, and ultimately to us.”
 
Old 01-21-2013, 12:44 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
3,334 posts, read 5,260,050 times
Reputation: 2056
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texan2008 View Post
The problem that the fundies have is that they intuitively know that if certain parts of the Bible can be shown to be metaphor or allegory, then it calls into question as to what verses are literal and what verses are not. To me, it doesn't take a whole lot before the Bible ends up falling like a house of cards. Nowhere in the intro to the Bible does God say what verses to take literally and which verses to take allegorically. That's the huge problem with this supposed communication tool from this God and one of it's most fatal flaws. You would think that the almighty creator of the universe can do better than this. Apparently not. Man made book is what I say.
What I've never quite understood is the absolute refusal on the part of Fundamentalists to examine or give consideration to Jewish thought on Old Testament Scriptures. Afterall, Jews wrote those books, so it would stand to reason that they would have a much greater insight as to meaning, context (both literary and cultural), what is considered allegory and so on.
 
Old 01-21-2013, 12:49 PM
 
Location: Someplace Wonderful
5,178 posts, read 3,897,593 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamplight View Post
My dear Texan, you're missing the most obvious explanation: MAGIC! Anything can be explained with enough magic and the desire to believe in it!
LOL....

I've been watching Doctor Who episodes on Netflix the past few days. Maybe the Ark was like the TARDIS: looks like an old Brit police box on the outside, but step inside and you have space the size of a great manor house.

Maybe ARK is an acronym for something I am not clever enough to invent.
 
Old 01-21-2013, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Someplace Wonderful
5,178 posts, read 3,897,593 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fullback32 View Post
What I've never quite understood is the absolute refusal on the part of Fundamentalists to examine or give consideration to Jewish thought on Old Testament Scriptures. Afterall, Jews wrote those books, so it would stand to reason that they would have a much greater insight as to meaning, context (both literary and cultural), what is considered allegory and so on.
I agree with your thought. I have expressed this before over on the Christianity forum, where it went over like a lead balloon.

I once tried to initiate a conversation with someone who claimed that every single word in the bible is literally true, even the parables. Despite that fact that in the bible the clear implication is that a parable is a story created to illustrate a point. Kinda like Aesop's fables. what I got in response was 30-40 quotes from 30-40 different places throughout the bible lifted from a period of over 1500 years.

I do not apologize for my own Christian faith. And even for you atheists, there is much to take to heart from the message of Jesus, whether you believe in God or not. But I do agree that the hardcore fundamentalists have made it difficult for those of faith and those who are secularists to have meaningful conversation.
 
Old 01-21-2013, 01:26 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
40,892 posts, read 18,562,052 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckmann View Post

Maybe ARK is an acronym for something I am not clever enough to invent.
Aquatic Rescue Ketch?


Of course back then "ark" would have been referenced in the local language, so it could mean something we could not guess.
 
Old 01-21-2013, 01:28 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
40,892 posts, read 18,562,052 times
Reputation: 18660
Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckmann View Post
And even for you atheists, there is much to take to heart from the message of Jesus, whether you believe in God or not. .
What would that be?
 
Old 01-21-2013, 05:11 PM
 
Location: St. Pete, FL
733 posts, read 1,300,468 times
Reputation: 656
"Believe in me or go to hell."
 
Old 01-21-2013, 05:26 PM
 
7,378 posts, read 6,730,396 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wretched.elect View Post
And yet that is exactly what the 'theory' of evolution wants everyone to accept, that it was 'magic' that caused the first 'accidental' organic creature to come about.
.
You obviously have no knowledge of the word "theory" in scientific terms. "a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment." The "theory of evolution" is not magic, you're thinking of a hypothesis.
 
Old 01-21-2013, 08:01 PM
 
Location: Deep Dirty South
5,192 posts, read 4,387,730 times
Reputation: 3821
Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckmann View Post
I once tried to initiate a conversation with someone who claimed that every single word in the bible is literally true, even the parables. Despite that fact that in the bible the clear implication is that a parable is a story created to illustrate a point. Kinda like Aesop's fables. what I got in response was 30-40 quotes from 30-40 different places throughout the bible lifted from a period of over 1500 years.
Yeah, that's the scam:

"We know The Bible is 100% historically accurate and valid and every word of it is completely, literally true."

"How do you know this?"

"Because it says so in The Bible!!!"

"Oh."

Quote:
And even for you atheists, there is much to take to heart from the message of Jesus
I agree there is much beauty and wisdom in The Bible, and in the alleged words of Jesus. Much of what is attributed to Jesus isn't original to Jesus or to Judaism or Christianity, but that doesn't lessen the essential message or the fact that (even though I'm not a believer) the ancient story of sacrifice, forgiveness, redemption, etc. is a powerful and worthwhile one.
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