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Old 02-15-2013, 10:13 PM
 
Location: Exeter, NH
5,302 posts, read 4,407,844 times
Reputation: 5708

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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuminousTruth View Post
Do any of you disagree that calling yourself an atheist is a mistake? Do any of you disagree that spreading atheism (without spreading actual good things) is meaningless EVEN if ending (current) theism is not?
I don't "call myself" an atheist; I simply admit to being one when it is pertinent to a discussion. Even admitting it in today's society is dangerous; religious nuts often consider atheists as Devil-Worshipping Sadistic Murderers.

I don't try to "spread atheism," any more than I try to "spread the theory of evolution." You can believe in unicorns or fairies; just don't try and impose your beliefs on others. When religious beliefs are used to try to limit freedom or impose restrictions, I oppose the limitations and restrictions. When religion becomes loud and active in the media, and distracts the nation from critical issues like Empire Warmongering and fiscal responsibility, I try to re-emphasize what is most important. When religion becomes active in the Republican Party, I try to get people to remember that we have freedom of religion, and catering to a religious agenda is not the place of ANY political party.

The human mind has the ability to section off beliefs like religion, and protect them from being logically thought about. Therefore, it is impossible to logically convince someone that there is no God, or no ghosts, or no fairies. If the intelligence of the population continues to degrade, religion will continue to thrive. If somehow we stop subsidizing the growth of the most intellectually challenged of us (heresy to today's liberals), religion will die out of its own accord.
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Old 02-15-2013, 10:19 PM
 
Location: City-Data Forum
7,945 posts, read 4,748,074 times
Reputation: 1333
Quote:
Originally Posted by hiker45 View Post
Yes, I disagree. I have never believed in any kind of gods, so that makes me a lifelong Atheist.
I know its "true" that you are an atheist, but why does it matter? Aren't you also other things that do matter? like Agnostic? or Compassionate?
Quote:


No, it is not meaningless to help people become Atheists.

Some people have been taught religious beliefs but later are not comfortable with those beliefs, and this causes them unhappiness. We can help them to understand that not all people need religious beliefs to have happy, fulfilling lives. We may be able to help them find their own best way to live their lives.

I have never said one word to discourage anyone, including my own two children, from believing in a god. Some people like to believe there is a god, and others of us don't. Religious people have never caused me any problems.
Interesting. So you are only interested in deconverting the unhappy theists... how secular of you. But that is the reason the problem exists. Secularism allows the fundamentalists to grow like fungus in the dark. Then they spread lies and pessimism, making their religion become the cure for a problem it itself created.

Why do you allow your children to choose their own beliefs? What if they choose falsehoods? Shouldn't you be teaching your children critical thinking and compassion and such other good things?
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Old 02-15-2013, 10:32 PM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,609 posts, read 4,117,789 times
Reputation: 1399
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuminousTruth View Post
Why do you allow your children to choose their own beliefs? What if they choose falsehoods?
I have no control what my children choose to believe. If they want to have different beliefs than I do, it is their business.

By the way, our kids are 39 and 34 and my wife and I are very, very pleased with the way they are living their lives.
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Old 02-15-2013, 10:35 PM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,609 posts, read 4,117,789 times
Reputation: 1399
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuminousTruth View Post
Secularism allows the fundamentalists to grow like fungus in the dark. Then they spread lies and pessimism, making their religion become the cure for a problem it itself created.
Why are you so hard on fundamentalists? They have never caused me a problem.
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Old 02-15-2013, 10:37 PM
 
Location: Rome, Georgia
2,706 posts, read 3,341,037 times
Reputation: 1915
Quote:
Originally Posted by NHartphotog View Post
I don't "call myself" an atheist; I simply admit to being one when it is pertinent to a discussion. Even admitting it in today's society is dangerous; religious nuts often consider atheists as Devil-Worshipping Sadistic Murderers.

I don't try to "spread atheism," any more than I try to "spread the theory of evolution." You can believe in unicorns or fairies; just don't try and impose your beliefs on others. When religious beliefs are used to try to limit freedom or impose restrictions, I oppose the limitations and restrictions. When religion becomes loud and active in the media, and distracts the nation from critical issues like Empire Warmongering and fiscal responsibility, I try to re-emphasize what is most important. When religion becomes active in the Republican Party, I try to get people to remember that we have freedom of religion, and catering to a religious agenda is not the place of ANY political party.

The human mind has the ability to section off beliefs like religion, and protect them from being logically thought about. Therefore, it is impossible to logically convince someone that there is no God, or no ghosts, or no fairies. If the intelligence of the population continues to degrade, religion will continue to thrive. If somehow we stop subsidizing the growth of the most intellectually challenged of us (heresy to today's liberals), religion will die out of its own accord.
I wonder if you meant this post to be funny? You somehow compare the existence of a god who may have created the Universe and morality to things like ghosts and fairies. When ghosts and fairies have anything to do with what might be expected of me in the theater that I exist, I might at least entertain the thought.

I also love the duality involved here. The intelligence of the population continues to degrade, yet atheism is on the rise.
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Old 02-15-2013, 11:04 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,895 posts, read 31,799,432 times
Reputation: 12640
Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgiafrog View Post
I wonder if you meant this post to be funny? You somehow compare the existence of a god who may have created the Universe and morality to things like ghosts and fairies. When ghosts and fairies have anything to do with what might be expected of me in the theater that I exist, I might at least entertain the thought.

I also love the duality involved here. The intelligence of the population continues to degrade, yet atheism is on the rise.
Actually that is untrue. IQ points of the population are increasing by three points per decade.
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:31 AM
 
Location: City-Data Forum
7,945 posts, read 4,748,074 times
Reputation: 1333
Quote:
Originally Posted by hiker45 View Post
Why are you so hard on fundamentalists? They have never caused me a problem.
Well, I suppose they have never caused me a problem either. But I am weary of what their closed-mindedness, faction-ism, and power-hunger can often do.

Also, why would you allow your children to belief falsehoods, even if you feel that as they are adults it is too late now? Do you belief that some people need theism to make them good and happy people?
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:33 AM
 
Location: City-Data Forum
7,945 posts, read 4,748,074 times
Reputation: 1333
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
Actually that is untrue. IQ points of the population are increasing by three points per decade.
I thought IQ was about the speed at which you learned, not the sum total of math and science one knows.
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:48 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,895 posts, read 31,799,432 times
Reputation: 12640
A IQ test is not something for which a person can study. The test does not measure the quantity of your knowledge but rather measures a person's general intellectual ability to understand ideas, as compared to the general population at the same developmental level. How well we reason, distinguish relationships and solve problems are the kinds of things the test aims to discern.
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Old 02-16-2013, 01:11 AM
 
Location: City-Data Forum
7,945 posts, read 4,748,074 times
Reputation: 1333
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
A IQ test is not something for which a person can study. The test does not measure the quantity of your knowledge but rather measures a person's general intellectual ability to understand ideas, as compared to the general population at the same developmental level. How well we reason, distinguish relationships and solve problems are the kinds of things the test aims to discern.
Perhaps Georgia means that the sum total of knowledge is degrading as each new generation doesn't bother to learn the knowledge gathered by previous generations, but since they are learning faster they see that it is better to be a CEO then anyone who actually know anything.
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