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Old 05-31-2019, 09:45 AM
 
2,978 posts, read 1,008,225 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian658 View Post
That anyone would actually debate that is a joke. Why bother? What is the point?
I'm with Trans on this (as with most things); it's like that woman who only listens to conservative news outlets and thus was not aware, until she heard Mueller himself say it, that Trump was not innocent. People need to be exposed to views alternative to their own little bubble of perception, however tiresome it is to keep it going on.

You can't assume everyone knows what seems pretty obvious. People can and do change their views over time, if they have more exposure to wider viewpoints.
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Old 05-31-2019, 11:37 AM
 
16,088 posts, read 17,880,433 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian658 View Post
I would never debate a true believer because logic cannot be used. It is really futile!

However, as many ex-evangelicals in this forum they may become atheists on their own. I would ask the ex-evangelicals how they changed.
That's a great idea. On another forum, we have a thread right now asking people who were pro-life and are now pro-choice, what changed their minds. The answers are interesting and for many it was the realization that other things their religions told them did not make sense. Quite a few changed their minds after listening to people outside of their own world view in college or by seeing what people said on the forum in various debates.
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Old 05-31-2019, 12:53 PM
 
39,028 posts, read 10,819,276 times
Reputation: 5082
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaraZetterberg153 View Post
I'm with Trans on this (as with most things); it's like that woman who only listens to conservative news outlets and thus was not aware, until she heard Mueller himself say it, that Trump was not innocent. People need to be exposed to views alternative to their own little bubble of perception, however tiresome it is to keep it going on.

You can't assume everyone knows what seems pretty obvious. People can and do change their views over time, if they have more exposure to wider viewpoints.
I'm with Kara on this (as with a lot of things, including the Brandenburgs) as i do believe that people can and do change their views. Otherwise, where do atheists come from?

No -that's where they go to.
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Old 05-31-2019, 11:48 PM
 
40,043 posts, read 26,720,362 times
Reputation: 6048
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaraZetterberg153 View Post
I'm with Trans on this (as with most things); it's like that woman who only listens to conservative news outlets and thus was not aware, until she heard Mueller himself say it, that Trump was not innocent. People need to be exposed to views alternative to their own little bubble of perception, however tiresome it is to keep it going on.
Why is it that Mueller said the Russians he indicted were to be considered innocent until PROVEN guilty but he demands that Trump who he did NOT indict should be considered "NOT NOT guilty" (not innocent or exonerated)? In America, EVERYONE is considered innocent until PROVEN guilty.
Quote:
You can't assume everyone knows what seems pretty obvious. People can and do change their views over time, if they have more exposure to wider viewpoints.
Apparently, you can't assume everyone knows what has always been true in America, EVERYONE is presumed innocent until PROVEN guilty which Mueller FAILED to do. Prosecutors do NOT exonerate anyone, they are tasked to prove guilt, period.
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Old 05-31-2019, 11:54 PM
 
39,028 posts, read 10,819,276 times
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Folks, this will be Jumped on as 'Politics'.
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Old 06-01-2019, 12:16 AM
 
Location: Valencia, Spain
15,310 posts, read 10,333,893 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian658 View Post
I would never debate a true believer because logic cannot be used. It is really futile!

However, as many ex-evangelicals in this forum they may become atheists on their own. I would ask the ex-evangelicals how they changed.
As Trans and Kara have already said, it's not about the 'victim', it's about trying to prevent others from becoming victims. If someone has cancer, the chances of curing them are slim but it is possible to educate other in how to reduce their risk of getting cancer
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Old 06-01-2019, 12:50 AM
 
40,043 posts, read 26,720,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER View Post
Folks, this will be Jumped on as 'Politics'.
Agree, but I could not let such blatant unAmerican thinking go unrebutted. Our education system has been criminally negligent in preparing our young'uns to be knowledgeable citizens.
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Old 06-01-2019, 12:26 PM
 
9,758 posts, read 6,721,123 times
Reputation: 2484
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaraZetterberg153 View Post
I'm with Trans on this (as with most things); it's like that woman who only listens to conservative news outlets and thus was not aware, until she heard Mueller himself say it, that Trump was not innocent. People need to be exposed to views alternative to their own little bubble of perception, however tiresome it is to keep it going on.

You can't assume everyone knows what seems pretty obvious. People can and do change their views over time, if they have more exposure to wider viewpoints.
That sounds like politics.
Count me out!
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Old 06-01-2019, 12:28 PM
 
9,758 posts, read 6,721,123 times
Reputation: 2484
Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
That's a great idea. On another forum, we have a thread right now asking people who were pro-life and are now pro-choice, what changed their minds. The answers are interesting and for many it was the realization that other things their religions told them did not make sense. Quite a few changed their minds after listening to people outside of their own world view in college or by seeing what people said on the forum in various debates.
Sounds like politics! Sorry about that.
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Old 06-01-2019, 12:33 PM
 
9,758 posts, read 6,721,123 times
Reputation: 2484
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER View Post
Like Raffs says - if you need to ask that question, you need to learn what's going on in the US right now.
Believers in the South are pursuing their religious agenda. They want to save lives. This dilemma has no solution and smell like a political issue.
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