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Old 07-31-2013, 09:52 AM
 
39,211 posts, read 10,895,806 times
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Thank you. While I would rear up and whinny with alarm at the idea of an atheist 'Chrutch', an atheist 'clinic' might be more the idea...except that it would enable the theists to observe, sourly, that we were all having heart transplants.

But there has been a long -felt need for help centres...I like that Help centres...Like AA, except that a deconvert who feels themselves slipping down the slippery slope to backsliding calls a couple of members who come around and get him drunk instead (1).

(1) if its a woman they take her shopping.
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Old 07-31-2013, 12:30 PM
 
Location: WA
4,246 posts, read 7,845,224 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AREQUIPA View Post
Thank you. While I would rear up and whinny with alarm at the idea of an atheist 'Chrutch', an atheist 'clinic' might be more the idea...except that it would enable the theists to observe, sourly, that we were all having heart transplants.

But there has been a long -felt need for help centres...I like that Help centres...Like AA, except that a deconvert who feels themselves slipping down the slippery slope to backsliding calls a couple of members who come around and get him drunk instead (1).

(1) if its a woman they take her shopping.
As a woman, I'd rather have a few beers than go shopping.
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Old 07-31-2013, 02:32 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlenextyear View Post
As a woman, I'd rather have a few beers than go shopping.
Second that, Seattle, LOL>
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Old 07-31-2013, 03:49 PM
 
243 posts, read 389,935 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlenextyear View Post
As a woman, I'd rather have a few beers than go shopping.
Quote:
Originally Posted by trobesmom View Post
Second that, Seattle, LOL>
Me three
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Old 08-01-2013, 03:20 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlenextyear View Post
As a woman, I'd rather have a few beers than go shopping.
Thanks for the correction
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Old 08-01-2013, 03:43 AM
 
Location: Montreal, Quebec
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I know plenty of female atheists, but them, I live in a very secular society.
I do have a theory. Maybe women in other parts of the world hang on to religion more because they're more "connected" to their families and not because they're less analytical. Maybe the thought of not being with their children in the afterlife is more than they could bear.
Just a thought.
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Old 08-01-2013, 05:47 AM
 
243 posts, read 389,935 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bulmabriefs144 View Post
That's why besides being a joke, an Atheist "church" (it'd have to be called assembly or center or meeting house or something not connected to the worship of God/gods) would be a good thing. People can attend and talk about social problems, such as child care or providing shelter for battered/abandoned women, or organizing programs to deal with drug/alcohol addiction. If atheism lost some of its hard edge against religion (the whole trying to disprove other religions thing, which just makes enemies), and simply became a "caffeine-free" version of what most religions do (helping communities) without the heavy moral imperative of "you're going to hell if you don't do it" but rather to do it if/because you want to, I'd think this is a welcome step.

Hell, if they stopped trying to anti-proselytize, I might even attend one Sunday. In terms of religion, the need to "convert" people to your line of thinking, is the only thing stopping me from attending whatever temple I want. Well, that, and I dunno of any Buddhist or Hindu temples nearby. If Christians could also stop trying to convince other religions they're wrong, atheists would probably be more welcome in Church too (that is, if they'd attend given all the incense, candle lighting, and God talk). Debate and winning the religious argument is an exercise in irrelevancy, since no matter who wins, anyone who strongly believes in their point is unlikely to accept your belief system, and vice versa (and they often resent you for trying). Only rational people do that, but the world is filled with irrational people. The true test of a worldview is how it treats the community, not whether it's "right".
A few things came to mind when you said you felt a need for community that's not necessarily tied to religion or anti-religion.

One, The American Humanist Association, which is admittedly is somewhat militant on advancing the separation of Church and State, but they also do a lot of charity work through Humanist Charities. You can find local chapters and affiliates through their locator. Local groups "...engage in social activism, philosophical discussion and community-building events."

Second, is the Unitarian Universalists, who accept pretty much any worldview at their church. Their services can be as diverse as their members, and many churches practice volunteerism and serve as a place for open minded people to congregate.

Third, you can go to meetup.com or just google "secular humanist" groups in your area. You can also try searching for "freethinker", "humanist" or "atheist". Meetup lists 16 groups in my area, including a secular parents group, a volunteer and community service group, a discussion and philosophy group, and a bar hopping social group.

Not that anyone asked me, but as a women, one of the reasons I initially hesitated to completely leave church behind (even though I was done believing in a god) was the sense of tradition and community. Even though I disagreed with most of the members on political, religious, and social issues, it was still nice to go and sing songs, have potlucks, Christmas plays, Easter service, etc. The women only groups (formal and informal) were nice too if you got past the conservative mindset when talking about current events. Oftentimes the older women helped us younger women out by passing on recipes and cooking tips (Amish friendship bread was rife in our area), showing us how to knit or sew, talked about gardening and home decorating/repair, talked about books, played euchre together, griped about men, etc. So....pretty much what others have said on this thread. Social reasons.
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Old 08-01-2013, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
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That's a great list of options, OH. I have one more to add - there are non-theist Quakers (aka Society of Friends). They usually go by the name "Friends Meeting" rather than "Friends Church".

Nontheist Quakers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 08-01-2013, 04:12 PM
 
354 posts, read 246,115 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohio Hello View Post
NOTaTheist.....I know you didn't mean it to be, but that was a bit insulting. I do see how you could have come to that generalization, I just don't think it's accurate.
This is a good place to start hanging myself again

First of all, I don't believe this has anything to do with raw intelligence. Let's get that out of the way. In fact, I would tend to generalize women as typically more intelligent than men. That said, raw intelligence is something that is extremely difficult to quantify. In my family however, the women tend to disregard reason and skepticism at a much higher rate than the men do, which is somewhat consistent because most of them compartmentalize with emotion.

Fifty years ago, this next statement would probably have been taken with a much worse degree of insult. I don't think people come to god belief (remember, that's what we're talking about in this thread) for rational reasons. Basically that leaves us with just emotional reasons for true belief. IF (big if) it's true women are more easily swayed by emotional reasons, then it stands they'd be more likely to accept a proposition which is entirely based on emotional reasoning.

Do you find it inaccurate to hold the proposition that women seem more easily swayed by emotional reasoning than men? If so, why? Understand this is a generalization and does not apply to every single instance in either subgroup. If it's true that it's easier to sway women with emotional reasoning based upon some innate biological trait, then the women who overcome god belief are exemplary individuals. And the ones who are open about it, even more so.

Quote:
I could easily make a comment stating that men can't wholly and faithfully
commit to something that requires devotion, love, and sacrifice; whether that be
a relationship or something like being a practicing Christian/Jew/Muslim etc.
Football excluded, of course . I kid, I kid.
First of all, I don't think you're completely wrong here. I would say it a bit differently. Women probably are better at these things than men are. That's not saying all men can't accomplish these things nor all women will always accomplish these things better.

I heard this on the Bill Maher show the other night, it seems intuitively correct so I'll just run with it. What relationships do you think are most monogamous?

From most to least

Female homosexual
then
Heterosexual
then
Male homosexual

You throw men in the mix and what you've noted above seems to have lower chance of being successful.


It should be noted, that as a man, I'm not easily insulted. In fact, I'm not sure I've ever taken something as an insult. This probably had something to do with my poor choice of wording in the original post on this subject. I can see how the use of the two words I choose to describe emotion (touchy/feely) could be seen as a pejorative. For that I do apologize.
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Old 08-01-2013, 04:26 PM
 
354 posts, read 246,115 times
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Great post as always mordant
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant
This ability to personally reject a belief without it necessarily implying
that one most then be cut off from others based on that unbelief is something
worth pondering.
Yes, I agree. In fact, my second, less controversial post in this thread tends to suggest I think the same way.

It should also be noted that I do not believe the only reason women seem to be disproportionality represented in the atheist community is solely due to emotional reasons. I'm sure there are many factors that are causing this.
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