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Old 08-13-2013, 04:44 PM
 
Location: Lakewood OH
21,695 posts, read 28,442,276 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
Huh? I am a deeply religious nonbeliever - this is a somewhat new kind of religion.
Albert Einstein.
Kinda don't understand what you are saying. I didn't mean to argue one way or another. I just meant that Einstein was a believer and he was very intelligent. So there is an exception to every rule. I don't really hold much with this kind of data gathering on any subject but I can understand why the conclusions were drawn here.
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Old 08-13-2013, 07:47 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,909,665 times
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Of course, the study (metastudy) has been debunked by PZ Myers as well as others.

Y’all can stop patting yourselves on the back now » Pharyngula

Quote:
After reading the paper, I’m reasonably confident that they processed the data competently. However, I’d add a fourth interpretation that they don’t take seriously enough: that there was systematic bias in the intelligence studies they analyzed. I’m actually personally put off (bias alert!) by any study that attempts to reduce something as complex as intelligence to a simple number amenable to statistical analysis. The various studies measure intelligence by GPA (grade point average), UEE (university entrance exams), Mensa membership, and Intelligence Quotient (IQ) tests. Can you say apples and oranges? Yeah, I thought so. And anyone who has spent any time with Mensa people knows they aren’t particularly shining examples of crystal clear analytical intelligence, for instance.
But I would agree with the conclusion that studies have found an inverse correlation between religiosity and something they’re calling intelligence. But that doesn’t mean much.
This was a meta-analysis of 63 studies done on the corelation of intelligence and religiosity. Meta-analysis is a legitimate statistical approach, but it’s just as likely that what they’re detecting is a consistent pattern of abuse of the data, rather than that they’re actually observing a true psychological property of religious people. They’re using a grab-bag of studies; the first warning should be that work by Satoshi Kanazawa, Richard Lynn, and Arthur Jensen are tossed into the statistical stewpot. It cites Herrnstein & Murray’s The Bell Curve.
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Old 08-14-2013, 12:12 AM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minervah View Post
Kinda don't understand what you are saying. I didn't mean to argue one way or another. I just meant that Einstein was a believer and he was very intelligent. So there is an exception to every rule. I don't really hold much with this kind of data gathering on any subject but I can understand why the conclusions were drawn here.
Einstein wasn't a believer. Do more research if you think he was.
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Old 08-14-2013, 12:15 AM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
5,480 posts, read 3,919,685 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Data1000 View Post
In addition to being an agnostic, you are also either a theist or atheist.
Not true. If you are an agnostic, then those terms don't apply. I'm here to engage that misconception
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Old 08-14-2013, 12:19 AM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
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Re: Einstein:

Einstein writes of 'childish superstition' | Science | The Guardian

being conflicted is....
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Old 08-14-2013, 12:19 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
33,532 posts, read 37,132,711 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minervah View Post
Kinda don't understand what you are saying. I didn't mean to argue one way or another. I just meant that Einstein was a believer and he was very intelligent. So there is an exception to every rule. I don't really hold much with this kind of data gathering on any subject but I can understand why the conclusions were drawn here.
That was a quote from Albert...He was an atheist, not a believer. Here are a couple more quotes from Einstein...

“... The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish." Einstein.

It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it. (Albert Einstein, 1954) From Albert Einstein: The Human Side, edited by Helen Dukas and Banesh Hoffman, Princeton University Press.
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Old 08-14-2013, 12:26 AM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
5,480 posts, read 3,919,685 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
That was a quote from Albert...He was an atheist, not a believer. Here are a couple more quotes from Einstein...

“... The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish." Einstein.

It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it. (Albert Einstein, 1954) From Albert Einstein: The Human Side, edited by Helen Dukas and Banesh Hoffman, Princeton University Press.
That doesn't say he was an atheist. He professed to believe in Spinoza's god...I don't think he knew what to say, ultimately, just as I don't. He obviously was not a theist. The best lack all conviction...right, Yeats


God of Spinoza - YouTube
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Old 08-14-2013, 08:04 PM
 
Location: Lakewood OH
21,695 posts, read 28,442,276 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Marcinkiewicz View Post
Einstein wasn't a believer. Do more research if you think he was.
Here are some references for you. I have highlighted those than pertain but they are all informative as to Einstein's later thinking. He rejected the idea of Christ as a deity but the concept of a deity was not rejected.

Some of Einstein's Writings on Science and Religion


Short Comments on Religion

Atheism


Jesus


Spinoza and Einstein
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Old 08-18-2013, 03:32 AM
 
Location: Vernon, British Columbia
3,026 posts, read 3,645,815 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
I was going to post that this was nothing new, that the matter had been the subject of numerous studies which established a correlation between IQ and religious belief, and between education levels and religious belief. The higher the IQ or educational level, the less likely the person was to hold religious beliefs.
It is also interesting that the higher the education and income level, the more likely a person is going to vote for a right-wing party. This makes things a bit muddled because the less educated, poorer religious people are also more likely to vote for a right-wing party (or so I'm told).

BTW, I live in a city with one of the highest percentage atheist/agnostic populations in Canada, but it is also one of the most right-wing in terms of political leanings.
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Old 08-18-2013, 09:00 AM
 
Location: Downtown Raleigh
1,682 posts, read 3,448,245 times
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Even if Einstein WERE a believer, he is one individual. Statistics aren't personal.
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