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Old 08-18-2013, 10:40 PM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
3,067 posts, read 2,106,341 times
Reputation: 3965

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As for the original post, why couldn't you post it on FB? My friend posted the same article on my wall; it's visible as the last wall post I've received. My username is not a lie; it's evidence if you need it (although there are a surprising number of Matt Marcinkiewiczes out there). So could you not post this article due to self-imposed constraints or other more insidious reasons...

As for the actual correlation between intelligence and atheism, I think it would exist across societies, but I also think the strength of the correlation would vary based on level of preexisting atheism. Higher the level of preexisting atheism, lower the correlation between intelligence and atheism.

Basically, it's a lot easier to be an atheist in Sweden than in Iran than in 4th century BC Greece...not going to go beyond that because I'm not even sure humanity was capable of conceptualizing it (not that it's "conceptualizable", but just that a physical world abiding by only physical precepts could be imagined) prior to that "golden age" (and I still don't know that an actual materialist atheist could've existed until beyond Copernicus/Galileo...Voltaire, first ever? Not Einstein, heh)
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Old 08-18-2013, 11:35 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
40,823 posts, read 18,553,245 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glacierx View Post
It is also interesting that the higher the education and income level, the more likely a person is going to vote for a right-wing party. This makes things a bit muddled because the less educated, poorer religious people are also more likely to vote for a right-wing party (or so I'm told).

BTW, I live in a city with one of the highest percentage atheist/agnostic populations in Canada, but it is also one of the most right-wing in terms of political leanings.

That higher income levels would correlate with conservative political leanings seems intuitive, but not educational levels. San Francisco and Berkeley have highly educated populations, higher percentages of atheists than most communities, yet are famously left wing. What was your source for your information?
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Old 08-19-2013, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Vernon, British Columbia
3,019 posts, read 2,692,913 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
That higher income levels would correlate with conservative political leanings seems intuitive, but not educational levels. San Francisco and Berkeley have highly educated populations, higher percentages of atheists than most communities, yet are famously left wing. What was your source for your information?
Common knowledge - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(higher education correlates with higher income)
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Old 08-19-2013, 01:32 PM
 
Location: Downtown Raleigh
1,645 posts, read 3,006,739 times
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The Conservative States of America - Richard Florida - The Atlantic
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Old 08-19-2013, 01:53 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glacierx View Post
Common knowledge - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(higher education correlates with higher income)
I asked for the specific study which reveals that higher education levels correlates with political conservatism.

You need to provide the data if you wish to be assigned any credibility. The OP information came from a consensus survey of 63 studies. "Common sense" is the source cited by people who do not actually know if what they are saying is true or not.
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Old 08-19-2013, 02:25 PM
 
Location: Vernon, British Columbia
3,019 posts, read 2,692,913 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
I asked for the specific study which reveals that higher education levels correlates with political conservatism.

You need to provide the data if you wish to be assigned any credibility. You need to provide the data if you wish to be assigned any credibility. The OP information came from a consensus survey of 63 studies. "Common sense" is the source cited by people who do not actually know if what they are saying is true or not.

I'm not sure what you've been sniffing because I have not posted anything that contradicts the OP. Here is the link you've requested anyway... https://lesacreduprintemps19.files.w...-education.pdf

BTW, There is a difference between "common sense" and "common knowledge."

Last edited by Glacierx; 08-19-2013 at 03:06 PM..
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Old 08-19-2013, 05:08 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
40,823 posts, read 18,553,245 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glacierx View Post
I'm not sure what you've been sniffing because I have not posted anything that contradicts the OP. Here is the link you've requested anyway... https://lesacreduprintemps19.files.w...-education.pdf

BTW, There is a difference between "common sense" and "common knowledge."
Okay, let us pretend that you were relying on this article when you made your first statement rather than it being the product of a search you just made today.

Now, rather than providing me with a link which is a 9 page, tiny type reading assignment, could you please provide the specific portion of that study which you believe supports your claim that higher education levels correlates with political conservatism. I mean, why should I read the whole article looking for one specific thing before you have established that you have read any of the article yourself?

And of course I didn't write that you were contradicting the OP, I mentioned the OP as an example of a post which is backed by the sources for the information being provided. My issue with you is your assertion regarding the relationship between higher education levels and tendencies toward political conservatism.

So, please provide the specific information, not a homework assignment.
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Old 08-19-2013, 06:05 PM
 
Location: Vernon, British Columbia
3,019 posts, read 2,692,913 times
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Since you've asked so nicely (and I thank you for that) I will satisfy your request. From page 35:

Quote:
This result is corroborated by an older study by Eysenck (1999/1954, p. 20) who found that amongst a UK sample, supporters of the Conservatives and Liberals had on average higher levels of education (as a proxy for intelligence — with the supporters of the Conservatives averaging slightly higher than the supporters of the Liberals) than supporters of Labour. Similarly using education in a sample from The Netherlands (Werfhorst & Graaf, 2004, p. 226) a low educational level increased the probability of voting for a left-wing party, whereas a high educational level (as indicated by university attendance) decreased it. Support for this position might also be found in the studies of Katz (1990), Kemmelmeier (2008) and Caplan and Miller (2010).
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Old 08-19-2013, 07:39 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
40,823 posts, read 18,553,245 times
Reputation: 18653
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glacierx View Post
Since you've asked so nicely (and I thank you for that) I will satisfy your request. From page 35:
Very well. I would now point out that "slightly higher" which was the description for the probability being measured, is not correlation.
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Old 08-19-2013, 09:20 PM
 
13,677 posts, read 13,579,480 times
Reputation: 39884
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Marcinkiewicz View Post
As for the original post, why couldn't you post it on FB? My friend posted the same article on my wall; it's visible as the last wall post I've received. My username is not a lie; it's evidence if you need it (although there are a surprising number of Matt Marcinkiewiczes out there). So could you not post this article due to self-imposed constraints or other more insidious reasons...

As for the actual correlation between intelligence and atheism, I think it would exist across societies, but I also think the strength of the correlation would vary based on level of preexisting atheism. Higher the level of preexisting atheism, lower the correlation between intelligence and atheism.

Basically, it's a lot easier to be an atheist in Sweden than in Iran than in 4th century BC Greece...not going to go beyond that because I'm not even sure humanity was capable of conceptualizing it (not that it's "conceptualizable", but just that a physical world abiding by only physical precepts could be imagined) prior to that "golden age" (and I still don't know that an actual materialist atheist could've existed until beyond Copernicus/Galileo...Voltaire, first ever? Not Einstein, heh)
Couldn't post it because I have a few religious people on my FB friends list and I am also known as a bit of a brainiac among my friends, not to mention the fact that I'm at a really good point in my life while a lot of (religious) friends are currently struggling. So I'd just seem like a big ******* telling my friends who are religious that it's because they're dumber than me and my atheist/agnostic friends. Hurt feelings and resentment all around.

Honestly, I think there are different kinds of intelligence (more kinds than have been classified by science), so I view this study in a very qualified way. But from a strictly IQ perspective, yeah I think people with higher IQs are more likely to be atheist/agnostic.
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