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Old 08-23-2013, 07:42 AM
293 posts, read 212,700 times
Reputation: 181


The latest (comedic) entry, courtesy of "PullMyFinger", in the "Are atheists mentally ill?" thread in the Politics section:

This is how I feel. I don't hate atheists, I respect them but I feel bad for them at the same time. Because I know God is real, I feel it when I go to church. You have to let him in, that is his style. If you don't want him in your life that will be fine by him too. And I honestly don't think a person who chooses to not believe will be judged at all. As long as they live a positive life I think they will go on to what's next along with everyone else.

One constant throughout the universe is that energy is not used up, it just moves on to something else and eventually it returns. Even the oil we burn turns into gasses that will be taken in by plants and animals and eventually returned to the Earth (eons from now). We are all 60%+ water, water that is hundreds of billions of years old that made up the bodies of people from hundreds of thousands of years ago. Water that came from the other side of the universe eons ago. Our consciences is energy that is measurable and when we die they can measure it leaving us. It doesn't go away, it moves on. That is science, not faith or superstition.

The sheer size of the universe is beyond comprehension. It is endless in all directions. But planets like Earth with the life that is here may be so rare it is beyond calculation how any of us were lucky enough to be a part of this. But there is no God. OK, no one planned all this. That is beyond ridiculous.

Jesus Christ tried to tell people just how unimaginable creation is, but still they refused to believe. To this day people act the same exact way. No faith, just denial. Why? Why deny it? What's in it for you? Why not try to find the truth of why through some ridiculous chance you were lucky enough to experience life? What is your purpose here on this Earth?

We didn't evolve from apes. That is only a theory based on extinct animals from long ago. There is no direct link between humans and apes, there is enough difference to cast serious doubt on the entire theory. We are also very close to mice if you use their methods of proving their theories.

God put us here, I have no doubt in my mind. Maybe he combined his own DNA with apes to do it, but it was a higher intelligence that created all this.

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Old 08-23-2013, 07:56 AM
39,050 posts, read 10,831,421 times
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Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
The foundation of the thesis being presented in this thread is an assumption of the legitimacy of the resurrection story. If it is found to be without credibility, then this entire debate is rendered instantly void.

Therefore an examination of the source being replied upon is a necessary first step, otherwise this discussion would be limited only to people who accept the resurrection as well established.
Understood, but if I get started, I think we will go off - topic. You carry on.
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:40 AM
Location: Hyrule
8,398 posts, read 9,888,823 times
Reputation: 7441

I think you might be bored.

This might do well on the main religion thread. That way both sides can have at it. IMO.

It's just going to seem immature and ridiculous to have this convo on here. Everyones covered the logical already. You've shown you don't hate atheists, but you clearly aren't willing to tolerate or understand the differences either. But, you do like preaching to us. Not interested.

You can preach your views on the main forum, that is what it's for. What would be your reasoning for posting this here if it weren't to preach to atheists? Not a good idea from the start, IMO. Read the sticky's before you post.
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Old 08-23-2013, 08:23 PM
40,053 posts, read 26,735,309 times
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Originally Posted by AREQUIPA View Post
Correct. There is no 'Q' material, nor Mark/Matthew material. There is 'P' material, odd tales used by both Luke and John. Apart from that there are 4 different accounts, though there are the angels at the tomb, but John places them later than the Synoptic account - after the women had reported to the disciples.

P.s. Paul appears to endorse a lot of the Gospel story, but I am beginning to see it the other way around: many of the important gospel episodes took Paul's remarks and turned them into screenplay, as it were, just as they did with OT material which thus turned into prophetic material.

Paul appears to refer to the betrayal by Judas with references to betrayal to the forces of darkness, but 'betrayal' has the connotation more of 'handing over' and is Paul commenting on the idea (got from the apostles, no doubt) that Jesus was 'handed over' by God to the powers of darkness so that the obedience/reforging of the covenant could be done.

The Judas - figure has been been produced, like the involvement of the Sanhedrin to blame the jews for what happened to Jesus, though this produces the theological oddity (noted with Judas before now) that they were helping God's plan along and Pilate (made to look like the nice Roman who was trying to spare Jesus - not to mention Jesus himself asking for god to let him off), was trying to thwart it.
As always I appreciate your study of the Gospels and look forward to your book. You have an interesting take on many ambiguous and enigmatic issues (as currently presented by the mainstream churches).In short . . . I enjoy your posts on the subject, Arequipa. My issue with your and the mainstream church interpretation and use of the Bible rests on its focus on carnal or worldly issues . . . instead of spiritual. For our ancestors . . . who did not commonly use the idea of consciousness and cognitive constructs . . . Spiritual was the only concept that could be applied to the products of the mind. Unfortunately it was also tied to the concept of Spirits . . . and they were deathly afraid of those. This made the conveying of the truth about our purpose and what God wants from us more than a little problematic for their carnal minds. Certainly the idea that our Spirits (or consciousness/mind) is a separate form of energy and will survive our physical death . . . was a non-starter for them. Hence we have the resurrection narrative as the carnal "milk" needed. There are sufficient clues within the extant verses such that a more knowledgeable audience would be able to discern the underlying "solid food" from the "milk." Appearing in closed rooms without using doors or windows . . . is just one clue that His "physical body" was a deliberate illusion. Obviously since the physical body is not a part of the rebirth as Spirit (resurrection) . . . other methods of disposal had to be employed.
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Old 08-24-2013, 03:30 AM
39,050 posts, read 10,831,421 times
Reputation: 5083
I get you. You will probably know that I see the 'spiritual' as originating in evolved social instincts and is nothing to do with God. If there is a god of the kind you believe in and is shown through the 'spiritual fossil record', I am not unprepared for that as I believe it has nothing to do with man -made religions, including those of the book.

Mine (when it is put together - I do hope it won't vanish the the Sibelius 8th) I hope will put an end to the Gospel -based debate about what sort of person Jesus was, because it will demonstrate that anyone willing to look can find out for themselves, using rational tools rather spiritual ones.

The spiritual stuff I'll leave to others as in fact I don't have a problem with god -beliefs that don't involve a man - made religion, organized church and a lot of temporal authority and social interference. Our disagreements, though intense and heated are in fact merely 'academic' and in no way personal.
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