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Old 06-21-2014, 03:23 PM
 
7,802 posts, read 5,286,683 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by modernist1 View Post
Ridiculous question.
It really REALLY is. But at the same time I can put myself into the theist position and understand why they ask it.

After all most religions are.... at the end of the day.... personality cults. Some revere sons of carpenters who were fathered by someone else other than that carpenter but who was dumb enough to accept the canard of "I never cheated on you.... I was impregnated by a spirit". Some revere illiterate paedophiles suffering from Cynophobia who managed to write a book while no one was looking.

But at the end of the day they all reduce down to personality cults. So the idea that a theist would expect us to revere a personality and convert WITH them..... if they converted is... while ridiculous from our perspective..... not actually ridiculous from their perspective at all. To them it makes perfect sense.

What theists need to realise is that the majority of atheists do not care WHO says something. They do not care if they are big.... strong.... intelligent.... famous.... rich.... qualified.... unqualified..... poor.... unknown..... stupid.... weak.... or small.....

What the average atheist wants to know boils down to two things and two things only. As follows:

"What are you saying exactly?"
and
"upon what substantiation basis are you saying it?"
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Old 06-23-2014, 02:04 AM
 
Location: Caverns measureless to man...
7,248 posts, read 4,686,590 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nozzferrahhtoo View Post
It really REALLY is. But at the same time I can put myself into the theist position and understand why they ask it.
Me, too. It's an interesting and (I'm sure) unwitting insight into the way the mindset of a lot of religious people works. Someone who sounds as though they know what they're talking about says something, so they believe it, because they sound authoritative. They have a great deal of difficulty understanding that for a lot of other people in this world, it takes more than that to change our minds - we need to hear an actual persuasive argument, not just a directive from someone we think is smarter than we are telling us to "believe this because I say so."

To a lot of religious people, that approach to life - actually thinking for yourself, and making your own decisions based on what you think makes the most sense - is literally incomprehensible. If the OP is even a serious question, it says a lot about the difference between the way the two groups of people tend to think.
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Old 06-23-2014, 07:05 AM
 
39,217 posts, read 10,895,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
Indeed -- specifically to Deism, and his god is aristotelian. It is almost a technical position, as such a god would not be palatable to most theists. Plus, the only sort of god I could conceivably be persuaded of is a deist god, but that god is so ineffable, so esoteric and uninvolved and unknowable, that I see no point in applying the label "god" to it. It would impact my life and thoughts exactly as much as no god at all.

While some Christians spread rumors in the early part of the last decade that Flew had converted to Christianity, Flew himself has repeatedly denied that and reaffirmed his Deism. He has also reaffirmed his distaste for Christianity, and, especially, for Islam. So this conversion is not the Damascus Road sort of event that most Christians would fantasize about. Nor does it represent a way-station en route to such an event.
I remember seeing a Yu tube produced by some Christian group or other interviewing Flew. When he explained his position and why he adopted -as you say, aristotlean deism, the film was fine. But when it got onto the subject of Christianity and they were trying to make it look like he was one or a case was being made for it, it became incoherent through cutting and editing with mentions of Paul (from the interviewer) and I can recall that any of it made sense.
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Old 06-23-2014, 11:46 AM
 
Location: North by Northwest
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I don't even like Richard Dawkins.
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Old 06-23-2014, 11:52 AM
 
39,217 posts, read 10,895,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeavenWood View Post
I don't even like Richard Dawkins.
If you locate 'Dawkins reads his hate mail', you will find youa re not the only one.
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Old 06-23-2014, 12:02 PM
 
Location: North by Northwest
7,442 posts, read 9,893,589 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AREQUIPA View Post
If you locate 'Dawkins reads his hate mail', you will find youa re not the only one.
LOL I'm well aware. I wouldn't say I hate him though (nor would I give him the satisfaction of sending him hate mail).
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