How does an atheist define morality? (Isaiah, trinity, Lord, verse)

[ainulinale]

Originally Posted by RoaminRed

LOL I see I've made a special friend! I find humor in your hostility. Means I've hit the mark more than once when responding to your attacks on logic, reason, and science. Then again, I find humor in everything.

I would hardly call the truth hostile.

[RoaminRed]

Originally Posted by ainulinale

I would hardly call the truth hostile.

Oh aren't you just the cutest thing, stamping your little feet and yelling "Because I said so!" I just want to ruffle your hair and send you off to play with Legos or something!

[chielgirl]

Watch out, though. Legos are probably made in China and have magnetic, lead paint on them.

[ainulinale]

Originally Posted by RoaminRed

Oh aren't you just the cutest thing, stamping your little feet and yelling "Because I said so!" I just want to ruffle your hair and send you off to play with Legos or something!

I love red...give me some of dat red...oh I bet you'd look pretty in pink too. Let's elope. We can have atheist dreams together. They always say opposites attract...

[b. frank]

Originally Posted by chielgirl

Watch out, though. Legos are probably made in China and have magnetic, lead paint on them.

Godless bastards...

[tic_constant]

Originally Posted by chielgirl

JViello, you keep trying to bait people who are atheists. If you're so interested in basic atheist philosophy, why not read a book. You refuse to accept anyone's opinion, and argue their responses.

At best you're disingenuous, at most the type of christian that makes people like me run from all things religious.

I disagree with your comment. If someone has questions about atheism, where better to ask them than an atheists forum? This is meant to be a discussion where ideas can be challenged, not a bunch of christians or atheists or agnostics sitting around patting each other on the back for points they all agree on.

I think he is persisting because he has not received an answer that seems to coinside with what reality is. You say he is baiting and being disengenuous, maybe, but his points still stand.

[chielgirl]

tic, obviously you're new. If a person behaves the same way time and again, simply because they don't get the answer they want (without having anything to do with reality), it is baiting.

You tell me, then, what is reality?
Atheists simply don't believe in a god thing.
That is it, that is all.
There is nothing more to it.
We are not a club, we are not a religion. We simply don't believe in a god thing.

How difficult is it to understand? Really.

[tic_constant]

Originally Posted by chielgirl

tic, obviously you're new. If a person behaves the same way time and again, simply because they don't get the answer they want (without having anything to do with reality), it is baiting.

You tell me, then, what is reality?
Atheists simply don't believe in a god thing.
That is it, that is all.
There is nothing more to it.
We are not a club, we are not a religion. We simply don't believe in a god thing.

How difficult is it to understand? Really.

Cheilgirl, Thanks for your response, you responded to another one of my questions that I haven't had a chance to rebuttle on yet, but plan to when i get the chance. And yes, I am new, how could you tell? Always wierd being the new guy. Thanks for endulging my questions, I'm sure you have heard them all before as well as some thoughtful responses, so my purpose in these forums is to understand the atheistsic mindframe and how you all answer tough questions. There is a surprising lack of atheists in my life. Where do you all hide?

Getting back to your response, I'm not sure I'm clear on the point you were trying to make with the first two questions. If you could elaborate I'll respond.

I will grant you that any people group can live by a moral code, regardless of religious beliefs. However, in the absence of a transendent being, any moral code is either utilitarian, subjective, emotive or pragmatic. There could be no talk of doing what is right "because it is the right thing to do."

In regards to your question, what is reality? I think that is an excellent question. Before I answer that realtiy I would like to ask you what would happen when your reality is breached by another free-willed human who forces their reality upon you? To what higher moral code will you point to to say what is being done to you is wrong? You cannot. You can only retaliate and force your reality upon the other, or live under the reality forced upon you. In a subjective system your reality is just as valid as the other.

[coosjoaquin]

Originally Posted by tic_constant

However, in the absence of a transendent being, any moral code is either utilitarian, subjective, emotive or pragmatic. There could be no talk of doing what is right "because it is the right thing to do."

Sorry for my butting in but why? Where does the transcendental anthropomorphic being get it's morality? Or is it just arbitrary? Isn't arbitrary morality worse than relative morality?

[forkpower]

Originally Posted by tic_constant

Cheilgirl, Thanks for your response, you responded to another one of my questions that I haven't had a chance to rebuttle on yet, but plan to when i get the chance. And yes, I am new, how could you tell? Always wierd being the new guy. Thanks for endulging my questions, I'm sure you have heard them all before as well as some thoughtful responses, so my purpose in these forums is to understand the atheistsic mindframe and how you all answer tough questions. There is a surprising lack of atheists in my life. Where do you all hide?

In plain sight.

Originally Posted by tic_constant

Getting back to your response, I'm not sure I'm clear on the point you were trying to make with the first two questions. If you could elaborate I'll respond.

I will grant you that any people group can live by a moral code, regardless of religious beliefs. However, in the absence of a transendent being, any moral code is either utilitarian, subjective, emotive or pragmatic. There could be no talk of doing what is right "because it is the right thing to do."

Why do morals only become such with the absence of some transendent being? If morals only have a sound basis when they are attributed to a being that is outside our understanding, how can one know that validity of that basis? Say one defines their morality in God, but since God is outside ones understanding how could one have a firm udnerstanding of what God thinks our morals should be? And anthor aspect is say God has a defined set of morals that i should live by, or a plan for me if you will. What is to say that Gods morals and plans in my best interest?

Originally Posted by tic_constant

In regards to your question, what is reality? I think that is an excellent question. Before I answer that realtiy I would like to ask you what would happen when your reality is breached by another free-willed human who forces their reality upon you? To what higher moral code will you point to to say what is being done to you is wrong? You cannot. You can only retaliate and force your reality upon the other, or live under the reality forced upon you. In a subjective system your reality is just as valid as the other.

Very true, your reality is just as valid as mine. And since they are equally valid neither holds any presedence over the other.

I think that morals are primarly formed by two factors. One's personal insight and reasoning, and society. What is moral and common in one society is not the same in another.

In a society where we are free to choose how we live our life and the choies we make, I think forcing ones morals or reality upon another individual goes against that society. I also see basing my morals and beliefs in tradition, ancient creeds of thought, and "divine" books as a breach against my reality, my free will, and my individualism. As these things are somehting i have chosen specifically not base my identity in. While i respect everyones right to do/think/believe what they want, that dosent mean i have to agree with it