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I ask this because although I still consider myself a believer, I have become very disenfranchised with Christianity over the past year, mostly due to hypocrisy and the evangelical response to the SCOTUS decision on same-sex marriage. I can really feel the draw of atheism/agnosticism because it seems like a much more authentic way to live and my atheist friends are far "nicer" than my Christian friends. Christianity is about conformity and presenting an image of yourself that isn't real. In every conversation with my Christian friends, I have to think how I want to be perceived and whether what I am saying will help or harm your image of being a "good Christian." With my atheist friends, I can be myself, say what I really think, and there is no judgment.
In addition, the Bible is an ancient collection of writings, many of which I can't believe is literal history (like the talking donkey or Jonah). Don't get me started on young-earth creationism. One of the draws of Christian fundamentalism is the fact they think they have all the answers and take the Bible literally, but in doing so they take it way out of context. You have thousands of Christian denominations all preaching a different message interpreted from the same source material. Anybody who claims they have the answers and their way is correct without any doubt is very, very prideful.
So my question...for those raised Christian..what drew you to atheism or agnosticism? Was it science/reason, a bad experience in the church, or a combination?
I ask this because although I still consider myself a believer, I have become very disenfranchised with Christianity over the past year, mostly due to hypocrisy and the evangelical response to the SCOTUS decision on same-sex marriage. I can really feel the draw of atheism/agnosticism because it seems like a much more authentic way to live and my atheist friends are far "nicer" than my Christian friends. Christianity is about conformity and presenting an image of yourself that isn't real. In every conversation with my Christian friends, I have to think how I want to be perceived and whether what I am saying will help or harm your image of being a "good Christian." With my atheist friends, I can be myself, say what I really think, and there is no judgment.
In addition, the Bible is an ancient collection of writings, many of which I can't believe is literal history (like the talking donkey or Jonah). Don't get me started on young-earth creationism. One of the draws of Christian fundamentalism is the fact they think they have all the answers and take the Bible literally, but in doing so they take it way out of context. You have thousands of Christian denominations all preaching a different message interpreted from the same source material. Anybody who claims they have the answers and their way is correct without any doubt is very, very prideful.
So my question...for those raised Christian..what drew you to atheism or agnosticism? Was it science/reason, a bad experience in the church, or a combination?
When I was 13 I came to the conclusion that Christianity is nonsense. I didn't feel "burned" though. I just realized that it was too silly to be true.
So my question...for those raised Christian..what drew you to atheism or agnosticism? Was it science/reason, a bad experience in the church, or a combination?
Heh... Yes?
Seriously, all of the above. But I think you will find a common thread with many of us former devout. For me first came disillusionment. When I started comparing what my faith and the Bible said should be happening with reality, when I kept wondering why no matter how much I sought God in study, worship and prayer I felt like I was talking to a wall, when I was just burnt out from doing what I believed God wanted, eventually it forces the blinders off. I was confronted with a reality that was contrary to my belief, that no matter how much I sincerely desired to follow God, he wasn't there for me. It was a shock, it hurt, and I tried for years to find a theology that would help me deal with it.
Eventually, in desperation, I threw my hands up a prayed one last prayer. I told God that I couldn't do this anymore, that I was totally and utterly broken, and that I needed help. I asked that He somehow intervene and take the initiative to meet me where I was, reach out to me, do what he did for Peter when he calmed the sea of Galilee. Then I got up off my knees, closed my Bible, put it on the shelf, and went about my business.
Day after day, I waited for God, but in the resounding silence that followed, eventually I realized that I could wipe my own tears away, I didn't have to wait hopelessly on Him. I found that over time, I was ok without the marathon prayer sessions, without pouring my heart out in worship, without agonizing over my failures and shortcomings. I found that I was able to put my broken self back together on my own.
I tried for a while to find some concept of God that made sense ot me, because I didn't want to face up to the fact that I didn't believe any more. None of it made sense, and I found that I was at peace when I let it all go, belief in God, viewing myself as a wretched sinner, all of it.
Once I got to this point I was able to examine my former faith, and my current lack of beliefs with a reasoned perspective, and found that logic, reason, science, all of that made sense now in a way it didn't before.
It was a step by step process, and I could not have evaluated my situation reasonably and rationally until I had come through the emotional turmoil, but my current views are more informed by rational analysis than by some gut rejection of God...
I don't feel particularly "burned". I don't feel that theism provided explanation or predictions about reality that were reliable, and like you with the marriage equality thing, aspects of it disappointed me and I did not want to be associated with those aspects. But like NoCapo, really "all of the above" had a role to play.
So my question...for those raised Christian..what drew you to atheism or agnosticism? Was it science/reason, a bad experience in the church, or a combination?
I was not at all burned by religion. I wasn't angry, bitter or whatever "at god." It's often assumed that an individual's nontheism is the result of being burned by other followers (their behavior and attitude > "Christians are so hypocritical and religion perpetuates X, Y Z [which it can/does], so I left because I couldn't stand it.") or by the religion itself, or their understanding of it, etc. That's not skepticism. That's being angry or disillusioned.
Speaking for myself, I did not have a bad experience, and I was exposed to a very fundamentalist cult growing up. The fact that my mother had primary custody, and isn't religious, helped to limit my exposure. My father was an Independent Fundamental Baptist deacon and youth preacher. He was/is a Jack Hyles fanguy, and used to regularly attend HAC pastors school. He lives, breathes, eats, preaches the IFB way/theology. (though at times was backslidden) For the most part, he is a champion for all things very far right/conservative evangelical. When I lived with or visited him I received this religious instruction, but I more or less went through the motions. I was naive to the inner-workings of this cult, and evangelicalism altogether.
When I didn't live with my father, I occasionally visited non-denominational churches with friends and family. That was the gist of it. Late in my upbringing I toured various bible colleges, which my father encouraged.
I did eventually become active in the IFB cult/movement, and became a carbon copy of my father. I was... awful. I was prejudiced, bigoted, xenophobic, misogynistic, sexist, racist, etc. So, basically, the folks who make up the GOP. I was a very proud and fervent bible-thumper. I also studied theology and doctrine, of the IFB variety. These studies are what eventually led to my deconversion. I started studying more of IFB/Baptist history and doctrine, which led me down a path of researching and studying beyond what I set out to study.
It was a definite process, and very uncomfortable, because my faith was my identity. I was heading down the rabbit hole and could not unlearn the information I acquired. It kept going. I tried on other labels, identified as other flavors of Christian (pluralist/monist/universalist/panentheist), but after over a year of careful study, I renounced my faith. And my studies continued. I eventually developed a passion for ANE history, biblical hermeneutics, literary criticism, ancient history, comparative religion, and philosophy. (before my deconversion I was studying theology, but after my deconversion, after I dedicated years to studying comparative religion, I got my undergrad in religion (and psychology). Despite being a skeptic/nontheist, I absolutely love studying religion -- mostly comparative.)
One of the books that was a major turning point for me, as someone who identified as a YEC, completely ignorant of evolution, and resistant to science, was Francis S. Collins' The Language of God, which presents the concept of theistic evolution.
So, for me, skepticism was/is an intellectual, academic process. It wasn't about feelings, what other people did or how they behaved, it center around my studies, my findings, as I examined my presuppositions and entire world view. It wasn't Dawkins style or any of that. The writers/books I took an interest in were written by former apologists, like myself, people I can identify with, unlike Dawkins. I couldn't get into his book at all.
Oh, and the process went something like this:
Nondenominational born again Christian with moderate to slightly new age leanings --> hyper-fundamentalist --> conservative/mainstream Christian --> liberal Christian monist/mystic --> deist --> ignostic/relative atheist (pandeist with Buddhist, Taoist and Vedantist leanings).
Last edited by Metaphysique; 01-23-2016 at 05:32 PM..
I didn't feel "burned" either. Mine was STRICTLY intellectual, however, it was only AFTER I made the intellectual decision to break away from Christianity did I then feel like an idiot.
I was never bothered by the hypocrites nor did some scandal in the church rattle me. That is something Christians love to hear because they will then tell you that you were NOT in the right church or you just never got the correct teachings. This then gives them the chutzpah to suggest THEIR church or to try THEIR version of Christianity.
If one leaves the Christian faith because of the actions of other people, then that person will always be open to returning. If, like many of us here, you left it or never believed it for intellectual or common sense reasons, then you are likely to have a more solid and valid reason to discard or not regard it and be an atheist or agnostic.
i didn't feel "burned" either. Mine was strictly intellectual, however, it was only after i made the intellectual decision to break away from christianity did i then feel like an idiot.
I was never bothered by the hypocrites nor did some scandal in the church rattle me. That is something christians love to hear because they will then tell you that you were not in the right church or you just never got the correct teachings. This then gives them the chutzpah to suggest their church or to try their version of christianity.
if one leaves the christian faith because of the actions of other people, then that person will always be open to returning. if, like many of us here, you left it or never believed it for intellectual or common sense reasons, then you are likely to have a more solid and valid reason to discard or not regard it and be an atheist or agnostic.
if you leave for rational reasons you treat people rationally. it's that simple. rationally speaking a group of people that gets very large acts exactly like a large group of people. That includes the good, bad, and ugly.
There were a couple of occasions in my young in life which various organized religions didn't come out well.
Such as the fundamentalist church missionaries that convinced my grandmother to leave her rather middle-of-the-road church and then convinced her that the power of prayer - not insulin - was how she should treat her diabetes, causing her to go into diabetic coma, which it took her second husband two days to recognize. She was never a competent adult after that, the only person she recognized was me because she thought I was my mother and her young daughter.
My parents were "weddings and funerals" religious and agreed that their more religious siblings could take me to church and let me make my choice. Which resulted in being dragged to church by my aunt and my grandmother (before her medical mishap). One was Southern Baptist, the other was Roman Catholic. In Sunday School we'd learn that the people I had visited the week before were apostates and unbelievers and doomed wicked people.
Or the time my neighbor convinced me to join the Methodist girl's choir (I was maybe 10 and was hugely impressed by the long deep blue silk robes). The choir director was horrified to find out that I had been baptized as an infant in the Roman Catholic church and pitched a huge fit, demanding I leave immediately (during the service).
Once you notice that three or four of the major churches are flat-out wrong in what they believe about each other (and the world in general), it isn't much of a stretch to realize that they are all some flavor of wrong. So it wasn't God - or the lack thereof - that made me leave the fold, it was the actions and beliefs of organized religion.
I have friends who believe in the "Church of the Blue Dome" - that there is a major entity in nature, surrounding us. I have no problem with that but then I don't think the entity is something I have to pray to - or, really pay a lot of attention to. I could be wrong but changing my beliefs because I think there is something out there lurking to punish me because I don't toe the line seems preposterous. If I am going to be judged, it will be for who I am and what I do.
Being atheist or agnostic or whatever someone wants to call it is not something that shapes my life or steers my actions, nor is it something that I talk about much. I believe in being a good person. I believe in helping others.
So my question...for those raised Christian..what drew you to atheism or agnosticism?
Reality.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bawac34618
Was it science/reason, a bad experience in the church, or a combination?
Science and reason and all the contradictions and errors in the Old and New Testaments.
I should probably write a book about it.
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