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At 14 and 15, I attended week long church camp. Vespers every evening by a lovely, peaceful lake was beautiful and tranquil.
But, my main interest was the boys that attended and one real cute camp counselor.
They aren't old enough to speak with discretion or clarity. They will be found out as atheists and singled out for shame, ridicule and bullying.
Spare me. Any chance that people who "cant speak with discretion or clarity" will not know how to behave as guests and start shaming or ridiculing their hosts?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant
I think it's right and necessary that all children have basic religious literacy and at least some low grade experience interacting with religious people. Religion has had too much influence on society and culture for too long; a child who is ignorant of these things is at a disadvantage.
Very well said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by no kudzu
I've been in churches all over the country and run into so many differences within the same demonination.
And sometimes even in the same church. My friend once went to a Presbyterian church that was essentially two congretations (progressive and conservative) in the same building. One needed to know what minister gave what service and study the bulletin to see who was leading what study or event. The spins could be very different.
This often happens at a church with a 9 o'clock sermon and a 11 o'clock sermon with associate pastor and senior pastor. When the associate pastor's services became more popular than the senior pastor's services we knew the younger one would be reassigned soon and worked to keep that from happening. We lost. The fact that the associate pastor was a young progressive woman and the senior was an old stodgy man didn't help too much.
This often happens at a church with a 9 o'clock sermon and a 11 o'clock sermon with associate pastor and senior pastor. When the associate pastor's services became more popular than the senior pastor's services we knew the younger one would be reassigned soon and worked to keep that from happening. We lost. The fact that the associate pastor was a young progressive woman and the senior was an old stodgy man didn't help too much.
I saw the same thing at a Catholic church in reverse. The senior Priest and lead assistant priest had been ordained during the turbulent 1970s. The senior priest especially was a progressive dogmatist who refused any thing that did not mirror his interpretation of Vatican II.
In contrast the newly assigned foreign priest was dynamic and charismatic. He was willing to listen to parishioners who felt that not all things created in the 1960s needed to become lasting traditions and frequently attended even minor functions when the other priests were no where in sight.
To make a long story short, the new priest's masses were moderately, but still noticeably better attended. He lasted about 14 months before being "re assigned" to a nearby parish. Four months after the transfer, there was a letter from the Bishop in the bulletin reminding us that "parish shopping" was against church rules*. Evidently the jealous progressives had noticed the that some parishioners were going to his new parish and accused him of poaching souls.
wow had no idea the CC was so set against people going to services wherever they wanted to. Kind of petty.
I can understand that it comes off as strange and petty.
The no shopping rule is only mentioned when the Bishop feels that enough people are shopping to cause a disruption. Not surprisingly, it is very hard to enforce. I have been active in my church for 25 years and have heard the rule referred to twice, or maybe three times.
The rule is designed to limit popularity contests amongst priests (rare in Catholicism, but it does happen), the concentration of all the lay talent at one parish, and / or over loading a favored parish with large numbers of people.
I think Catholics are more willing to accept and follow the rule because we, well, are accustomed to rules, and also because all the Catholic churches are part of one organization. Thus competition amongst catholic churches is a strange concept. In contrast, each say, Baptist church is independent. So competition is more natural.
I think the participatory education distinction is relevant. Participatory education for non extreme social, cultural, political and historical topics is very different from those that have the potential to be life changing in a good or bad way. Religion has this potential.
You're a non religious, mixed race family in the South, which places you in a position to be perceived as outliers. I've read enough of your posts to think you are a reasonable person and appreciate your asking for input on the matter. It struck a nerve for me because of my camp experience.
Sending your kids to this camp is a calculated risk. You need to consider the possibility of a religious conversion. While converting souls may not be the general focus of this camp, it may be on the agenda of some people there who have a leadership role.
why the preoccupation with conversion? it's day camp. it's not as if she's sending them to another state for a month to summer camp. besides, she's sending two children. neither of them will be alone.
why the preoccupation with conversion? it's day camp. it's not as if she's sending them to another state for a month to summer camp. besides, she's sending two children. neither of them will be alone.
A religious conversion is part of the spectrum, or range, of religious experience. The camp she describes looks to be more of a secular camp with a religious tradition than a camp whose main purpose is to evangelize while giving kids a fun camp experience.
I pointed it out because parents who send their children to a camp with religious activities need to consider the possibility of a conversion. If a parent is an atheist, I think it would merit some extra consideration. Of course anyone can end up being converted just by living on this planet, but the odds increase when one is part of a religious institution, even when it's just temporary.
A religious conversion is part of the spectrum, or range, of religious experience. The camp she describes looks to be more of a secular camp with a religious tradition than a camp whose main purpose is to evangelize while giving kids a fun camp experience.
I pointed it out because parents who send their children to a camp with religious activities need to consider the possibility of a conversion. If a parent is an atheist, I think it would merit some extra consideration. Of course anyone can end up being converted just by living on this planet, but the odds increase when one is part of a religious institution, even when it's just temporary.
Should parents of religious persuasion be concerned about sending their children to a secular camp?
Broadening the experience, and basically getting kids outdoors in the summer, would seem to be the more important aspect.
Should parents of religious persuasion be concerned about sending their children to a secular camp?
Broadening the experience, and basically getting kids outdoors in the summer, would seem to be the more important aspect.
Of course not, which is not what I said or think. The OP was talking about a camp affiliated with the Methodist Church, not a secular camp. From previous posts it sounds like it is closer to a secular camp than many religious camps are.
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