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funerals are closure for the living. The "ritual" is just time to allow that process to happen. Heck, funerals are times to catch up with old friends and chew some time talking about past events. Sometimes we even include the dead guy.
Yes, funerals are for the living. And from what I know, a Catholic funeral is rather impersonal, mostly a church service, more about God than the deceased. (And of course it would be impersonal in hub's case, because whatever priest I would find would have never met hub.)
There wouldn't be a lot of old friends there; we move every year or two so we don't have a lot of rock-solid long-term friends. Not the kind of friends who would fly across the country to our funeral. We have each other, which is another reason why this recent revelation is upsetting.
Oh, I agree 100% about the whole embalming process. And the whole $$$ funeral costs for a casket, etc. Trust me, I am in total agreement.
I did not mean to beat you up on this. I apologize. I was just floored that anyone would question their spouse's last wishes. And to be honest, I would ask my spouse those very pertinent questions you posed such as why would a non-practicing catholic want a catholic funeral? Most likely he still believes in a God, he just doesn't like the catholic church for whatever reason. I myself do not care for organized religion, but I sure do pray a lot.
Funerals are for the living anyway, aren't they? Maybe the thought of reconciliation is on his mind in his later years? Not to the point of going to mass, but to the point of making peace with his God?
Thanks for your apology. I did ask him why he, a non-practicing "recovered Catholic" would want a Catholic funeral, and his only reason is that he thinks his kids would want that (I don't think he has ever told his kids the extent of his falling away from the church).
I do understand that, in general, it is expected that one's last wishes be respected. We just have so many extenuating circumstances (some is explained in my most previous post). Our whole life* is each other (and his job), so I was thinking that each other's preference for dealing with the process was pretty important.
*Ok, I don't literally have no life outside of him, but we are as close as any two people could be, and with our frequent moves to places where we know no one else, we truly lean on each other for just about everything. We are still crazy, madly in love, and to lose him would be so devastating I would want to do nothing more than crawl in bed and not get out for weeks. I cannot fathom arranging a Catholic funeral and getting all of his kids here for it and going through something that has no meaning or comfort for me, when I just want to grieve in peace.
Last edited by kayanne; 07-25-2016 at 07:32 AM..
Reason: Edited because I'm anal about correct spelling & punctuation and I left out an apostrophe!!
So the fact that he is no longer Catholic, has not attended mass in all the time I've known him, and he only thinks this is "what his kids want," is reason enough?
The fact that he's requested his final service to be what he wants is reason enough.
Quote:
Based on responses here, it's clear I am seeing this differently than most, but I would think "what would be the least distressful to my wife during the most painful thing she's ever gone through" would be more important than "what I think my kids want," (the grown kids who live far away and rarely come visit, and then only if we pay for it.)
Additionally, I happen to think our culture's ritual of embalming and putting makeup on the corpse is weird and creepy.
But I did come here seeking help and opinions, and I try to be open-minded in all things. So I would love to hear more from atheists/agnostics....but can everyone discuss rationally without beating me up?
Alright, consider it from the opposite angle...
What if you go before your husband and he ignores your wishes and gives you a Catholic funeral?
So, it's ALL about YOUR stress, and nothing for the last wish of the deceased?
Quit with the absolutizing. It isn't ALL about her, but she certainly has an important say.
Funerals are for the living, not the dead. I have my own preferences in this regard (no funeral) but once I'm dead I won't give a hoot and if any of my survivors care enough to have some sort of pomp and circumstance they can knock themselves out. My wife gets first say; she won't want a ceremony either. So then if my children or stepchildren were to want one it should be a their own expense and effort and still respectful of my wife's needs.
Applying that to the situation here, it's clearly that hubby wants a Catholic ceremony not because he personally cares for his own sake but because his extended family will throw a rod if they don't have this outlet. It is common for Catholic families to be scandalized if they can't go through the reflexive oblations that they expect to. I would say if they want the ceremony they can organize and pay for it (or maybe as a compromise a small term life policy can be in place to foot the bill). The problem is that this puts the widow in the awkward position of having to attend this formalized breast-beating ceremony or be thought of as disrespectful of her husband's memory. The only thing that can counteract this is clearly set expectations in advance. If I had Catholic relatives to accommodate but my wife wasn't into it, I would explain to them my wishes -- that I want no funeral but if they chose to have one they can have a memorial service but he does not expect his wife to participate and she should not be ill treated if she doesn't.
I do understand that, in general, it is expected that one's last wishes be respected. We just have so many extenuating circumstances (some is explained in my most previous post). Our whole life* is each other (and his job), so I was thinking that each other's preference for dealing with the process was pretty important.
That would be my preference as well. But I would ultimately do what I know my spouse's wishes were...just to honor them in my own mind, and to feel I did what they asked of me. It wouldbe pointless and morbid for no good reason to me, but it would be a matter of conscience that I'd do it.
Maybe it's something you need to discuss again. And maybe there are compromises he'd be OK with, such as no embalming or open casket stuff, but perhaps there is a Catholic priest for his kids benefit.
And maybe there are compromises he'd be OK with, such as no embalming or open casket stuff, but perhaps there is a Catholic priest for his kids benefit.
Yes, they can have a memorial service without the body. It is not typical but not unheard of.
The fact that he's requested his final service to be what he wants is reason enough.
Alright, consider it from the opposite angle...
What if you go before your husband and he ignores your wishes and gives you a Catholic funeral?
He knows I absolutely want him to do whatever will bring him comfort at the time. He knows my preference (donate my body to science), but he has my permission to do whatever feels best when the time comes.
Quit with the absolutizing. It isn't ALL about her, but she certainly has an important say.
Funerals are for the living, not the dead. I have my own preferences in this regard (no funeral) but once I'm dead I won't give a hoot and if any of my survivors care enough to have some sort of pomp and circumstance they can knock themselves out. My wife gets first say; she won't want a ceremony either. So then if my children or stepchildren were to want one it should be a their own expense and effort and still respectful of my wife's needs.
Applying that to the situation here, it's clearly that hubby wants a Catholic ceremony not because he personally cares for his own sake but because his extended family will throw a rod if they don't have this outlet. It is common for Catholic families to be scandalized if they can't go through the reflexive oblations that they expect to. I would say if they want the ceremony they can organize and pay for it (or maybe as a compromise a small term life policy can be in place to foot the bill). The problem is that this puts the widow in the awkward position of having to attend this formalized breast-beating ceremony or be thought of as disrespectful of her husband's memory. The only thing that can counteract this is clearly set expectations in advance. If I had Catholic relatives to accommodate but my wife wasn't into it, I would explain to them my wishes -- that I want no funeral but if they chose to have one they can have a memorial service but he does not expect his wife to participate and she should not be ill treated if she doesn't.
If they don't like that, then it's their problem.
Thank you Mordant. You seem to completely get what I'm asking about.
And to others, the conversation is not over. Hub and I tabled it yesterday so we could return to our carefree floating in the pool without deep, depressing topics. We will absolutely discuss this more. I just wanted some others' opinions before we talk about it again.
Funerals are definitely for the living, not the dead. The first thing I'd do in this situation is delicately sound out the kids - do they REALLY care? It is very likely not as much as he thinks. If they all have families of their own and jobs and the usual over-scheduled family life, the time and energy and expense involved is high. Sure, a memorial service and the time to mourn the person who has passed, to get closure, is a good thing. The real difference between a funeral and a memorial service is that a funeral involves a dead body and a fairly set timeline for when said body has to go into the ground. A memorial service involves the same aspects of the funeral, just without the dead body and the time crunch.
As far as when the OP dies, her husband giving her a Catholic funeral (this was a hypothetical, posited a couple posts back) - the OP wouldn't actually be around to care.
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