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I disagree. As I previously asked, why is an eyeball never where the big toe should be, or a nose where the anus is?
Because that’s not how bodies work.
Although development biologists do in fact play these kinds of games with embryos - one way to understand how a process works is to study what happens when the process is manipulated so it doesn’t work - the short explanation is that as an embryo develops, cells are constantly “talking” to and influencing their neighbors.
I could imagine a naturally-occurring scenario in which a group of cells is broken away from its original position and becomes attached to another position. The result would not be a fully developed nose arising like a hemorrhoid at a baby’s nether end, but a weird clump of cells with no function. Assuming that an embryo that screwed up would even make it to term.
But again, that poster was not talking about developmental mishaps, but normal human anatomy. When I give a pill to my cat, I do not have to worry about it winding up in her lungs no matter how far down her throat I place it. But when I give a pill to a human, I absolutely do have that worry. Because, compared to a cat and every other mammal, normal human tracheal/esophageal anatomy is defective. Now of course that defect is what allows us to speak. But if we were perfectly designed, we would be able to speak without also having to worry about aspirating things into our lungs that don’t belong there.
Anyway guys, unfortunately this thread immediately devolved into a God debate which had zero to do with the op. The point was why so many faithiests are so hostile and hateful towards believers. Although many proved my point in this very thread, many others were kind and considerate changing my perspective a bit, and for that I say thanks. I just want to leave you with this, "God loves you. There is nothing you can do to make him not love you. Denying his existence doesn't negate his love for you. You are loved". Have a great day!
Not all non believers are "hostile and hateful." It's just that when believers are confronted with contradictions to their beliefs they become offended, and they perceive the contradiction as hostility.
Here is the God of the OT in action. Is this your "God of love?"
Numbers 31
[15] And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive?
[16] Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the LORD in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the LORD.
[17] Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
[18] But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
Joshua 6
[20] So the people shouted when the priests blew with the trumpets: and it came to pass, when the people heard the sound of the trumpet, and the people shouted with a great shout, that the wall fell down flat, so that the people went up into the city, every man straight before him, and they took the city.
[21] And they utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox, and sheep, and ass, with the edge of the sword.
Joshua 11:
19 Except for the Hivites living in Gibeon, not one city made a treaty of peace with the Israelites, who took them all in battle. 20 For it was the Lord himself who hardened their hearts to wage war against Israel, so that he might destroy them totally, exterminating them without mercy, as the Lord had commanded Moses.
Ezekiel 9
[4] And the LORD said unto him, Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and set a mark upon the foreheads of the men that sigh and that cry for all the abominations that be done in the midst thereof.
[5] And to the others he said in mine hearing, Go ye after him through the city, and smite: let not your eye spare, neither have ye pity:
[6]Slay utterly old and young, both maids, and little children, and women: but come not near any man upon whom is the mark; and begin at my sanctuary. Then they began at the ancient men which were before the house.
[7] And he said unto them, Defile the house, and fill the courts with the slain: go ye forth. And they went forth, and slew in the city.
Samuel 1 15:
[2] Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.
[3] Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
Is ordering children to be hacked to death with swords an example of God's love? What sort of a God do you worship...exactly?
So you see, there are challenges to your beliefs which are not simply the result of condescension and hatred, but are actually based on genuine objections to the contradictory nonsense you (believers) are attempting to peddle. And you have no response to this accusation, do you?
Although development biologists do in fact play these kinds of games with embryos - one way to understand how a process works is to study what happens when the process is manipulated so it doesn’t work - the short explanation is that as an embryo develops, cells are constantly “talking†to and influencing their neighbors.
I could imagine a naturally-occurring scenario in which a group of cells is broken away from its original position and becomes attached to another position. The result would not be a fully developed nose arising like a hemorrhoid at a baby’s nether end, but a weird clump of cells with no function. Assuming that an embryo that screwed up would even make it to term.
But again, that poster was not talking about developmental mishaps, but normal human anatomy. When I give a pill to my cat, I do not have to worry about it winding up in her lungs no matter how far down her throat I place it. But when I give a pill to a human, I absolutely do have that worry. Because, compared to a cat and every other mammal, normal human tracheal/esophageal anatomy is defective. Now of course that defect is what allows us to speak. But if we were perfectly designed, we would be able to speak without also having to worry about aspirating things into our lungs that don’t belong there.
True story - a close family member of mine, when arriving at the Grand Canyon after a 1000-mile drive refused to get out of the car at an overlook because she was fighting with the driver and wanted to punish him.
My guess is we are now supposed to rise up and beg Mommy to stay.
Anyway guys, unfortunately this thread immediately devolved into a God debate which had zero to do with the op. The point was why so many faithiests are so hostile and hateful towards believers. Although many proved my point in this very thread, many others were kind and considerate changing my perspective a bit, and for that I say thanks. I just want to leave you with this, "God loves you. There is nothing you can do to make him not love you. Denying his existence doesn't negate his love for you. You are loved". Have a great day!
Translation: I didn't realize that you all would be so knowledgeable, articulate and prepared so I'm taking my toys and going home, convinced that *I* won.
Like we haven't seen that before either.
Like I said, you didn't think too hard, did you?
And BTW, continuing to use the made up word "faithiest" makes you just as rude and condescending. Congrats.
Jesus gave up his weekend for your sins. Well, actually, is he IS God, that means he didn't give up anything.... Hmm.... He died pretty easily to be God....
So, your believe of the universe is similar to my belief in God?
I don't have a belief, like everyone else I am guessing, but I would not attempt to market my guess as an absolute. My post was saying that guessing that matter and energy are and have been perpetual, seems more probable than making up an entity which is and always has been perpetual, and assigning it credit for creation. We have the evidence that matter and energy do exist, we do not have the same for a creator.
So at all times my actual position is....I don't know. Another of my positions is...neither does anyone else. The actual clash between theists and atheist is not god/no god, it is god/no reason or evidence to believe in a god.
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