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Murder can be defined by the law of the land and/or religion. Laws are fluid.
Again that still rather fits into what I am saying. So I am not sure in your last two replies if you are agreeing with me or the opposite in those 2 posts. Perhaps if a definition of murder exists in the land where this event occurred this might be relevant? Or the definition of it in the land of the people who are calling the event murder? Or is any other definition relevant here?
But if we just throw "define murder" into google the results we get are:
"the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another."
"the crime of unlawfully killing a person especially with malice aforethought"
"Murder is the unlawful killing of another human without justification or valid excuse"
or if we go back in time somewhat:
"when a person, of sound memory and discretion, unlawfully kills any reasonable creature in being and under the king's peace, with malice aforethought, either express or implied."
So while murder might be somewhat fluid in definition I am not seeing any definitions that are helping the users above out much. Except maybe the more informal definitions of -
"a very difficult or unpleasant task or experience."
"punish severely or be very angry with."
- which I suppose could apply but are unlikely to be what the users above us meant? As Mensa says above - I would more suspect the users are drawing on the emotive implications of the word than any actual sound usage of it.
As do I. But I do so while knowing what "murder" means. I acutely had to know what "murder" means because we had an abortion referendum in my home country recently. And the anti-choice crowd insisted on calling abortion "murder". And the reasons I learned that they were wrong to call it murder there - are the same as why it is wrong to call it murder here.
Murder means "the unlawful killing". So to call what happened here "murder" one has to show it was - in fact - unlawful. No one on the thread has yet done that.
I do not think Joe has a valid point as you claim. He is trying to make this about race - which it is not. It is about society. This tribe lives outside our society. It is not part of it. Therefore we do not hold them to the standards and laws of our society. As I said before - even Prime Time television like Star Trek gets this one right with their "Prime Directive".
Even if we were to hold them to our standards - which we should not do - there has been valid "self defence" arguments made on the thread. This isolated tribe could be entirely decimated by a contagion that we in our society have natural defences against. They are well within their rights to defend themselves just like we would be if we quarantined people with a serious disease and they broke out and tried to walk into our cities. If the army at the border of such a city raised their guns and were forced to fire - they would be entirely in the right to do so.
Which brings me back to my original point, that this is little more than a zoo for "wild humans".
These people could be doing any manner of things that are a gross violation of human rights, like cannibalism, child rape, slavery etc (and I'm not saying they are), and the Indian government would just stand by, because essentially, animals are animals.
It is about race, because while India claims the right to make laws about these people and their islands, a situation exists whereby a part of their territory has consequence free killing, but only to those of a certain ethnicity
It is about race, because while India claims the right to make laws about these people and their islands, a situation exists whereby a part of their territory has consequence free killing, but only to those of a certain ethnicity
Which brings me back to my original point, that this is little more than a zoo for "wild humans".
These people could be doing any manner of things that are a gross violation of human rights, like cannibalism, child rape, slavery etc (and I'm not saying they are), and the Indian government would just stand by, because essentially, animals are animals.
It is about race, because while India claims the right to make laws about these people and their islands, a situation exists whereby a part of their territory has consequence free killing, but only to those of a certain ethnicity
So why do you think or even suggest that these islanders are committing all kinds of human rights violation? Sure you put into brackets that you are not saying so, but by mentioning it you are definitely suggesting it which is just as bad as calling it racism. Other blacks in India are not let to be isolated like these islanders who for all you know might be leaving in a very loving and equal society.
That you wish to pit these natives through the same hell as natives of other regions went through just because you don't believe in history is sad. Yes India could kidnap the children, beat and rape their language, culture, religion out of them and return "civilized " people back who cannot relate to the parents and grandparents in any meaningful manner and you would be happy because they are n9W treated as if they lived in a major Indian city and other Indians would be able to plunder or extract whatever they wanted from this island.
History is full of terrible stories of treatment of indigenous people's and you are eager to have a new chapter written simply because these people's are not of the same race.
So why do you think or even suggest that these islanders are committing all kinds of human rights violation? Sure you put into brackets that you are not saying so, but by mentioning it you are definitely suggesting it which is just as bad as calling it racism. Other blacks in India are not let to be isolated like these islanders who for all you know might be leaving in a very loving and equal society.
That you wish to pit these natives through the same hell as natives of other regions went through just because you don't believe in history is sad. Yes India could kidnap the children, beat and rape their language, culture, religion out of them and return "civilized " people back who cannot relate to the parents and grandparents in any meaningful manner and you would be happy because they are n9W treated as if they lived in a major Indian city and other Indians would be able to plunder or extract whatever they wanted from this island.
History is full of terrible stories of treatment of indigenous people's and you are eager to have a new chapter written simply because these people's are not of the same race.
The point is, that India would do nothing, even if the islanders were doing these things. That's the nature of zoos/reserves -letting wild animals, be wild animals.
Indigenous people are just people -nothing special about them.
The point is, that India would do nothing, even if the islanders were doing these things. That's the nature of zoos/reserves -letting wild animals, be wild animals.
Indigenous people are just people -nothing special about them.
You have made it clear that indigenous people can be wiped out or at least have their lands taken away because others are more powerful.
Zoos do not allow wild animals to be wild animals. You tend to try to insert loaded language to make it appear that it is an evil act to let these folks be left aline. Wild animals are treated like wild animals everywhere outside of zoos. I have deer and sometimes skunks in my yard and I am only blocks from city centre. And foxes and coyotes near by. You don't see wild animals hunting in a zoo.
You wish for the Indian government to go onto the island and destroy this society, completely even if it means the death of the bulk of the population based in the fact that they are black and that not destroying this society is being racists.
You have made it clear that indigenous people can be wiped out or at least have their lands taken away because others are more powerful.
Zoos do not allow wild animals to be wild animals. You tend to try to insert loaded language to make it appear that it is an evil act to let these folks be left aline. Wild animals are treated like wild animals everywhere outside of zoos. I have deer and sometimes skunks in my yard and I am only blocks from city centre. And foxes and coyotes near by. You don't see wild animals hunting in a zoo.
You wish for the Indian government to go onto the island and destroy this society, completely even if it means the death of the bulk of the population based in the fact that they are black and that not destroying this society is being racists.
Not just indigenous people, but any people -that's just reality.
Zoo/Reserve -both places for animals, but I can call it a reserve. Possibly more fitting, as animals can generally kill people in reserves, without consequence.
I've no view on what should happen to this society, only that no one's lives are less important than anyone else's.
Not just indigenous people, but any people -that's just reality.
Zoo/Reserve -both places for animals, but I can call it a reserve. Possibly more fitting, as animals can generally kill people in reserves, without consequence.
I've no view on what should happen to this society, only that no one's lives are less important than anyone else's.
I think you have a narrow understanding of racism
Why did you even bring up the point of racism? Would your opinion on this change if the natives are Caucasian?
Why did you even bring up the point of racism? Would your opinion on this change if the natives are Caucasian?
Racism is relevant, because how killing is treated on the island, depends on ethnicity.
Who cares what colour the islanders are?
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