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I wish people would stop fighting, as they seem to be doing on all the active threads. It's just such an awful bore.
In Dog Breeding which I have been active in - we select the dogs for breeding that display the traits we want - and we let the ones without live their lives happily and die off without breeding more.
Similarly I wonder if a person wants to control the content of a thread should they propagate the posts taking the form that pleases by replying to them - while simply ignoring the rest? Then they directly control the traits that propagate and work towards breeding out the rest.
For example I responded to your OP in post #48 and you simply did not reply to it or engage with it. If people engage with your OP directly and on topic and in good faith - and you then do not respond in kind then this is like simply throwing all the dogs back into the mix to breed like they want. Such a dog breeder does not then get to moan about the quality of the stock produced. They dropped the ball - they are to blame.
To repeat my points therefore which are on topic - while you are correct there is an element of mockery intended in the FSM meme there is much more to it than that including highlighting issues related to the burden of proof _and_ issues related to favoritism and special treatment received by the religious - and the idea that we should address religion while taking care not to offend the religious is a poor one because it is their choice to become offended vicariously on behalf of an idea which is their failing not ours.
I think these are interesting talking points which directly relate to your OP and can be expanded upon - but alas you have ignored these - not engaged with them - and then become upset that the topic drifted off your intentions or desires. I am happy to go back to _your_ topic if you are
The Albert Einstein - Toscha Seidel String Quartet. Quartet seated: Arthur Giskin, Toscha Seidel, Albert Einstein, Bernard Ocko. Standing: Mrs Seidel, Elsa Einstein and Emil Hilb. At Einstein's home in Princeton, New Jersey.
AE really loved violin and I believe he said that if he were not a scientist he would have liked to have been a musician. In studies of professional happiness levels, attorneys who make 100K+/year were at the bottom of the happiness scale and musicians are at the top.
Last edited by KaraZetterberg153; 11-23-2018 at 10:43 AM..
In Dog Breeding which I have been active in - we select the dogs for breeding that display the traits we want - and we let the ones without live their lives happily and die off without breeding more.
Similarly I wonder if a person wants to control the content of a thread should they propagate the posts taking the form that pleases by replying to them - while simply ignoring the rest? Then they directly control the traits that propagate and work towards breeding out the rest.
For example I responded to your OP in post #48 and you simply did not reply to it or engage with it. If people engage with your OP directly and on topic and in good faith - and you then do not respond in kind then this is like simply throwing all the dogs back into the mix to breed like they want. Such a dog breeder does not then get to moan about the quality of the stock produced. They dropped the ball - they are to blame.
To repeat my points therefore which are on topic - while you are correct there is an element of mockery intended in the FSM meme there is much more to it than that including highlighting issues related to the burden of proof _and_ issues related to favoritism and special treatment received by the religious - and the idea that we should address religion while taking care not to offend the religious is a poor one because it is their choice to become offended vicariously on behalf of an idea which is their failing not ours.
I think these are interesting talking points which directly relate to your OP and can be expanded upon - but alas you have ignored these - not engaged with them - and then become upset that the topic drifted off your intentions or desires. I am happy to go back to _your_ topic if you are
Not meaning to ignore you, just teaching in between looking at CD, and no time to engage further. But really, not aimed at any one person, it just struck me that there were arguments going on simultaneously.
I don't control anything, least of all here!! 😬
Postscript: In post #48 your remarks nos. 1 & 2 are so self-evident as not to require a response.
Thats why I rarely (have I ever?) start threads. Like Dog Breeding I think a certain responsibility comes with starting one. And like you I do not have the time to engage with any one thread at the level I Think that responsibility demands.
To give an example and expand on one of my points - that of special privilege. The religious often use religion to gain special exemption to laws everyone else has to follow. A trite but relevant example is that when taking a photo to get a passport - we are not allowed wear any head covering. Yet in some areas people of certain religions were given exemption to this rule/law.
So they get special treatment for no other reason than their pet religion of choice. To highlight how ludicrous this is the FSM followers petitioned for - and if memory serves - gained the right to wear a colander on their head in such a picture.
So this is not just making a mockery of religion - but by gaining a patently ridiculous "win" they highlight how ridiculous it was for the religious to have been given that exemption in the first place. We should note care what peoples religions are - if the law of a given country says no head gear or jewelry in such photos then leave your burka or turban or red head dot or whatever else at the door of the photo booth and take your picture like everyone else.
So that is generally why I think describing the FSM meme as just intending to be a mockery is missing some very useful and relevant points about such memes. Rather than making a mockery of religion -- it is highlighting the mockery religion is making of us!
Thats why I rarely (have I ever?) start threads. Like Dog Breeding I think a certain responsibility comes with starting one. And like you I do not have the time to engage with any one thread at the level I Think that responsibility demands.
To give an example and expand on one of my points - that of special privilege. The religious often use religion to gain special exemption to laws everyone else has to follow. A trite but relevant example is that when taking a photo to get a passport - we are not allowed wear any head covering. Yet in some areas people of certain religions were given exemption to this rule/law.
So they get special treatment for no other reason than their pet religion of choice. To highlight how ludicrous this is the FSM followers petitioned for - and if memory serves - gained the right to wear a colander on their head in such a picture.
So this is not just making a mockery of religion - but by gaining a patently ridiculous "win" they highlight how ridiculous it was for the religious to have been given that exemption in the first place. We should note care what peoples religions are - if the law of a given country says no head gear or jewelry in such photos then leave your burka or turban or red head dot or whatever else at the door of the photo booth and take your picture like everyone else.
I think I would be happier if you would find some analogy other than dog breeding. If you are comparing me to a dog, I really don't appreciate it. If you're not, still, dog breeding is kind of repulsive from an animal rights standpoint, my perspective.
And you don't get to set the standard for what OP responsibility might be. Stuffy, stuffy.
Stating the obvious is a pretentious tone does not constitute a GRAND IDEA.
Not meaning to ignore you, just teaching in between looking at CD, and no time to engage further. But really, not aimed at any one person, it just struck me that there were arguments going on simultaneously.
I don't control anything, least of all here!! 😬
But while having time to chastise others when you could simply ignore or go to another forum or do some more teaching, you also have time for posting a picture and commentary about Einstein and music when it has nothing to do with atheism/agnosticism or even the Flying Spaghetti Monster
The speck, the plank!
I think I would be happier if you would find some analogy other than dog breeding. If you are comparing me to a dog, I really don't appreciate it. If you're not, still, dog breeding is kind of repulsive from an animal rights standpoint, my perspective.
And you don't get to set the standard for what OP responsibility might be. Stuffy, stuffy.
Staying the obvious is a pretentious tone does not constitute a GRAND IDEA.
Hah! I did not expect that interpretation of the analogy when I came up with it I have to admit! No - In terms of the analogy I was describing you as the breeder and the posts on the thread as the dogs.
But thanks once again for focusing solely on the content on my post that has nothing to do with the topic of the thread - and basically ignoring the rest which very much was! That was kinda the point of the analogy!
Ascribing tone to someone who was not using that tone however - also is not likely to create any grand ideas.
I don't see how it has worked though. And I would hope that someone on the atheist side could come up with something better.
I agree with your last sentiment above, I was never impressed by the whole FSM business and have never personally made use of it for anything. Something better is needed, what would you suggest?
I think I would be happier if you would find some analogy other than dog breeding. If you are comparing me to a dog, I really don't appreciate it. If you're not, still, dog breeding is kind of repulsive from an animal rights standpoint, my perspective.
And you don't get to set the standard for what OP responsibility might be. Stuffy, stuffy.
Stating the obvious is a pretentious tone does not constitute a GRAND IDEA.
None of us -- except moderators -- get to control the flow of discussion on this or any other forum.
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