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If you were in monk in a Shaolin Temple, what teachings might your master employ here...?
"Master, what is an Agnostic Atheist"...?
"Excellent question LateGreatApostate. As you might view the voids or spaces between the tree trunks and branches instead of the trunks and branches themselves, so too you must ponder if an Agnostic is a less committed and sure Atheist, or an Atheist a more committed and sure Agnostic"
Quote:
Originally Posted by L8Gr8Apsot8
I have no education on the subject so I wouldn't feel comfortable speculating. It's not much of a curiosity for me either, there's other things I'm interested in. If I really was interested in it I could start studying now and never even come close to bumping up against the edge of what we already know. I don't know what you mean by "just happened". Maybe it was inevitable given the way the universe works?
LOL... This very "Yin And Yang" as well, it at once appears both a lack of interest and a curiosity. Although the curiosity may be rhetorical, I will give my pared down basic view as an explanation in the event you sought an answer. We don't want to get too deep or serious here on the Joke Thread...
"Life Happens": What is left as a theory for the existence of life when you take "Creationism By Diety" or "Design By Intelligent Other" (not to be confused with "Significant Other") off the table.
If you were in monk in a Shaolin Temple, what teachings might your master employ here...?
"Master, what is an Agnostic Atheist"...?
"Excellent question LateGreatApostate. As you might view the voids or spaces between the tree trunks and branches instead of the trunks and branches themselves, so too you must ponder if an Agnostic is a less committed and sure Atheist, or an Atheist a more committed and sure Agnostic"
LOL... This very "Yin And Yang" as well, it at once appears both a lack of interest and a curiosity. Although the curiosity may be rhetorical, I will give my pared down basic view as an explanation in the event you sought an answer. We don't want to get too deep or serious here on the Joke Thread...
"Life Happens": What is left as a theory for the existence of life when you take "Creationism By Diety" or "Design By Intelligent Other" (not to be confused with "Significant Other") off the table.
I always ying when I should yang. I see it as theist on one end and atheist on the other end. Agnostic is the dial as in "how sure" are you of your conclusion. I have failed to be convinced of the existence of a deity. I'm not willing to say that there is no possible way there is one so I'm agnostic in a sense. Some theists are absolutely sure of their convictions so they aren't agnostic, some atheists might be just as sure they have it right so they are not agnostic on the matter either.
Edit: It's not "off the table", it's just is starting to look unlikely.
I always ying when I should yang. I see it as theist on one end and atheist on the other end. Agnostic is the dial as in "how sure" are you of your conclusion. I have failed to be convinced of the existence of a deity. I'm not willing to say that there is no possible way there is one so I'm agnostic in a sense. Some theists are absolutely sure of their convictions so they aren't agnostic, some atheists might be just as sure they have it right so they are not agnostic on the matter either.
Edit: It's not "off the table", it's just is starting to look unlikely.
Devout Theists would no doubt claim they are going to heaven while stating Devout Atheists may be going somewhere less pleasant. They might likely assume Agnostics may go there too, or may allow that Agnostics may wind up in Purgatory until they come to their senses...
Additionally, a Devout Atheist may get nervous nearing the end of their life may wish to "hedge their bet" just in case while not wishing to go full on Theist. So, in keeping with the Joke Thread, imagine you are a New York advertising firm hired by Theists to do a couple of commercial spots to "sell" Agnosticism to Atheists in hopes they could at least get them out of a "sure" position, and possibly get them to eventually "cross over" completely....
OK... cameras rolling, in five, four, three, two...
"Agnosticism... because isn't Purgatory better than the alternative?"...
PERFECT... that's a wrap, second commercial spot rolling in five, four three, two...
"Agnosticism... because Florida is NOT God's only waiting room"...
Devout Theists would no doubt claim they are going to heaven while stating Devout Atheists may be going somewhere less pleasant. They might likely assume Agnostics may go there too, or may allow that Agnostics may wind up in Purgatory until they come to their senses...
Additionally, a Devout Atheist may get nervous nearing the end of their life may wish to "hedge their bet" just in case while not wishing to go full on Theist. So, in keeping with the Joke Thread, imagine you are a New York advertising firm hired by Theists to do a couple of commercial spots to "sell" Agnosticism to Atheists in hopes they could at least get them out of a "sure" position, and possibly get them to eventually "cross over" completely....
OK... cameras rolling, in five, four, three, two...
"Agnosticism... because isn't Purgatory better than the alternative?"...
PERFECT... that's a wrap, second commercial spot rolling in five, four three, two...
"Agnosticism... because Florida is NOT God's only waiting room"...
I have no idea what's going on here. There's no bet to hedge. Only sufficient reason could sway me. I already know that my mind seeks to form patterns under stress and those patterns are usually of the agency kind. Sometimes I think it would be nice if I wasn't aware of that tendency and thought it was real but there it is. I already peeked behind that curtain and it can't be unseen. That only means I can't use my perception to confirm the existence of an intelligent designer. There may be other ways and I'm open to that.
Agnostic theist I know better than to close myself off and make statements I can't falsify.
Agnostic atheist I know better than to close myself off and make statements I can't falsify.
I have no idea what's going on here. There's no bet to hedge.
LOL... Remember that you are on the Joke Thread, I have been qualifying my posts by making statements like "in keeping with the Joke Thread", etc. and you have to allow some leeway...
An Agnostic might state: "I will not be hedging any bets because I take the stance no Casino exists, but if one day evidence of said Casino is presented I might get some chips and hit the "craps" table!
Quote:
Originally Posted by L8Gr8Apst8
Agnostic theist I know better than to close myself off and make statements I can't falsify.
Agnostic atheist I know better than to close myself off and make statements I can't falsify.
Notice how in each case here Agnosticism is a sub-belief or "type" to the main belief (Theism and Atheism). What statement would you make if the situation was reversed, with Agnosticism the anchor belief. Could it logically be reversed in this manner in both or either case...?
"Ahtheistic Agnostic"...? "Theistic Agnostic"...?
LateGreatApostate, IMO you have the makings of a thread here, I think the subject matter is too sober to play the hand out here on the Joke Thread (no Casino pun intended).
Devout Theists would no doubt claim they are going to heaven while stating Devout Atheists may be going somewhere less pleasant. They might likely assume Agnostics may go there too, or may allow that Agnostics may wind up in Purgatory until they come to their senses...
Additionally, a Devout Atheist may get nervous nearing the end of their life may wish to "hedge their bet" just in case while not wishing to go full on Theist. So, in keeping with the Joke Thread, imagine you are a New York advertising firm hired by Theists to do a couple of commercial spots to "sell" Agnosticism to Atheists in hopes they could at least get them out of a "sure" position, and possibly get them to eventually "cross over" completely....
OK... cameras rolling, in five, four, three, two...
"Agnosticism... because isn't Purgatory better than the alternative?"...
PERFECT... that's a wrap, second commercial spot rolling in five, four three, two...
"Agnosticism... because Florida is NOT God's only waiting room"...
I don't think these last jokes are terribly funny. True, it is an ongoing chuckle that such discussions begin with the assumption that Theism is faith in God, atheism is faith in No God (it isn't - atheist are agnostic, too, as are Theists, who just won't admit that they can't be sure) and agnostics are the only rational ones because they admit they aren't sure. The debate then is then whether they are are going to hell with the atheists because they don't have godfaith or not.
Probably they are, because those who have Faith in God often seem to believe that those who have the wrong kind of faith in God are also going to hell.
I have no idea what's going on here. There's no bet to hedge. Only sufficient reason could sway me. I already know that my mind seeks to form patterns under stress and those patterns are usually of the agency kind. Sometimes I think it would be nice if I wasn't aware of that tendency and thought it was real but there it is. I already peeked behind that curtain and it can't be unseen. That only means I can't use my perception to confirm the existence of an intelligent designer. There may be other ways and I'm open to that.
Agnostic theist I know better than to close myself off and make statements I can't falsify.
Agnostic atheist I know better than to close myself off and make statements I can't falsify.
Yes, that's better. Everyone is in fact agnostic as nobody really knows for sure. Atheists may be more or less certain about Some kinds of God -claims but would probably be non -committal about some kind of cosmic mind.
There is however the very familiar Gnostic theist who insists that they Know God is real, and moreover that the particular God, religion and kind of religion they have faith in is the right one.
Ask them how they know and you will either get appeal to faith (which is, I am sure, a conviction that God is putting the Right Answer into their head) or providing evidence, which turns out to be Interpretation of the evidence to suit the faith.
The only question then is just who is going to burn....
I don't think these last jokes are terribly funny. True, it is an ongoing chuckle that such discussions begin with the assumption that Theism is faith in God, atheism is faith in No God (it isn't - atheist are agnostic, too, as are Theists, who just won't admit that they can't be sure) and agnostics are the only rational ones because they admit they aren't sure. The debate then is then whether they are are going to hell with the atheists because they don't have godfaith or not.
Probably they are, because those who have Faith in God often seem to believe that those who have the wrong kind of faith in God are also going to hell.
Maybe it is quite a funny joke after all.
Duly Noted...!
But also understand the following:
A. The joke thread is likely 95% or greater Atheists (who are also Agnostic by your definition) poking fun at Theists, which of course makes sense. But it is a rare bird indeed to see a self proclaimed "Agnostic" poke fun laterally at fellow Atheists and Agnostics.
B. The jokes were borne of a more serious and sobering exchange with LateGreatApostate to help lighten the mood and maybe create some mutual "learning with levity" if you will. Maybe not the best of circumstances for jokes, but my goal was to keep the joke thread true to it's initial purpose.
So it sets up an environment where there's a finer line to toe, there's a burden on the jokes to serve a dual purpose, the jokes are moving "laterally" or "in house" if you will, and the multiple compounded combination may make it easier to get into "hot water" so to speak in one form or another.
Yes. While I can't be dogmatic about the initial purpose of the Joke thread (I thought it was for atheists to post religious jokes) It has become a discussion thread at times, and I'm one of the worst offenders.
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