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There has been quite a bit discussion on this topic in another thread already, and i thought there might be some bennefit in making this topic a thread of its own.
Also what gave me the idea to start this topic in its own thread was an episode of The Simpsons. Through some rather zany events Lisa and another women ended up at the base of Springfields local volcano just as it was erupting. Lava encircled them and Lisa hid in the trunk of a car. When the other women she was with asked her what she was doing Lisa replied "I'm praying to Jesus, Buddha, and Sponge Bob. There's no time to be picky".
This irked me a little on two main points:
1) The rather ignorant view that there are no "atheists in foxholes". The idea that everyone, no matter who or where, will eventually "find God", who ever that God may be.
2) The complete under representaion of those without faith, atheists. I guess this one really isn't that suprising as The Simpsons airs on the Fox network. But this one irks me on a broader sense, not just with The Simpsons. It seems everywhere in the media atheists are under represented, misunderstood, or just simply ignored.
It was in another thread that atheists are the 3rd largest group in terms of religous view in America. (correct me if im wrong, it's been a while since i read the thread where this was stated)
I really feel that if this under representation and misunderstanding continues that things could be come very bad for atheists. I mean people always fear what they dont understand, and fear can make people do some very drastic things.
I've known several Atheists in foxholes, what you don't see are Orphans in foxholes, when the world is coming down hard and heavy, the cry is for "Momma!!!!!"
The fact is that there were "godless' nations like USSR / Russia, China etc where, for whatever reason, a large section of the polulation did (still does) not believe in god. It is a safe guess they had numerous soldiers that were atheists in foxholes. "There are no atheists in foxholes" is popular expression in the US and it is quite wrong and a lot of Russians, Chinese and some even in the US would agree.
Basically, a large percentage of people in the US are dogmatic about religion that the country is actually to the "right" of most of the Western countries (religion-wise). Only middle-East seems to have more dogmatic people - and sometimes, after looking at Palin's church and witchcraft and visiting more liberal countries like Turkey, I am not sure even that is true for certain sections of US.
Regarding Simpsons, I always was amused that FOX allows the writers to poke fun at Simpson's Wingnut neighbor.
I would say what about cultures that don't really have god, say a Buddhist for example if they are faced with death do they prey to god?
But really the premise is shaky if you think about it. When you are shot to hell or waiting for the enemy to kill you how rational will we really be? The moment of any confrontation where you are about to kill, you aren't that rational - you obviously aren't thinking about rules that are obviously right (the taking of another's life).
At that moment the person would be absolutely in their natural state, all rational thinking is cast aside and really you will do anything to still be alive - you would burn a flag, shoot off your toe or just about anything for your life...
I thought it was pretty funny. If I remember correctly right at the credits, we see god buddha and spongebob in heaven looking at lisa. Either god or buddha say "should we help her?" and then spongebob says "screw her!" followed by a spongy, maniacal laugh.
I thought it was pretty funny. If I remember correctly right at the credits, we see god buddha and spongebob in heaven looking at lisa. Either god or buddha say "should we help her?" and then spongebob says "screw her!" followed by a spongy, maniacal laugh.
For some reason if there were a diety that was just abuslutly made of nothing but evil i could see it being sponge bog square pants. he is insanly ammusing, and i think that woul play well with zany world domination.
on onther note this subjet has been a getting a little bit of attention in other forums, and i found that obviosuly there are people that are willing to stat that in a situation such as a "foxhole' a divine objects is the least of our concerns. and for as much as i like The Simpsosn, i find it a allittle saddening that the atheist mindset is completly ignored. But in the shows defence, Lisa has defined her self as Buddhist, so that right there is a religous aspect to the show.
I really didn't find anything wrong with what happened and rather I found it to be a message against Christians who say their god shows up to people in need while simultaneously ignoring all the other people who found Allah or Vishnu.....or even spongebob in this case(there's no time to be picky). Lisa also never made any other mention of the deities at the end of the episode showing that "converts" will most likely drop their newfound belief the moment they step out of danger(with the irony being that all the people she mentioned did in fact exist)...or quite possibly to keep in line with their trademark "everything and everyone goes back to the way they were before the episode began".
When I do find statements of behaviours that misrepresent my views or others that I know of, I remember that it's just the Simpsons. Their purpose isn't so much to educate us as it is to entertain people. I mean just looking at that episode there were some jokes and situations which couldn't possibly have accurately represented the feminist movement.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coo's crappy recollection of the episode
Homer:Ok marge, you stay here and do nothing while I go and rescue Lisa
Crowd of feminist women: BOOOO!!!
Homer: ...Ok, you go rescue Lisa and I'll stay here with the women
Crowd of feminist women: BOOOO!!!
Homer: Whaaaat do women waaaannnt!?!?!?
Then again maybe they did
Oh and yes spongebob as a god is pretty comical. An evil, absorbent, talking sponge who is most likely gay(Asexual I'm lead to believe) is the last thing I expected to see in any representation of heaven.
I dunno about the Simpsons, but the whole 'no atheists in foxholes' really fries my husband to bits, man. He's a volunteer firefighter - and an atheist. When everybody else is running out of a burning building, he runs in. One afternoon he was approached at the store by a man who started up on the Firefighter's Prayer, and going on about how you had to 'have a real fath in God to be a firefighter'. When my husband told him he was atheist, the guy went off. They ended up having to get security to escort him out.
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