Yet another thread on the "morality" of atheists (baptize, Christ)

[fnord]

I usually avoid debates like this, but I see so many ignorant comments and threads here, so I'm starting my own.

I'm an atheist. I have been since "birth", I suppose. I was raised by an atheist father and and agnostic mother. While emotionally distant, they instilled fair and sensible values toward me. To this day, I do not have a racist, criminal, or cruel bone in my body - I will accept anyone regardless of what they look like, until they personally do me wrong. In my youth, I was surrounded by (and almost smothered by) Mormons who tried to get me to join their church to no end. I did attend church with a few of my friends here and there, but honestly, I just never believed in a "god", so that was that. When I was 13, there was another non-Mormon girl in my neighborhood. She got hooked, and her parents allowed her to be baptized. She never talked me after that. What's the sense in that? By age 14, they gave up and I was isolated to the point that likely many other non-Mormon youths in Utah can attest to.

In retrospect, I really like Mormon people. Awfully friendly! I visited SLC in 2006 and it was delightful. I support many of the values they live by. Just yesterday I checked out some Mormon TV ads from the 70s and 80s (the ones that were plastered on my TV as a child) and some of them made my eyes water. Strong family values, honorable fundamentals, helping others, the importance of working hard to get ahead in life. These are great qualities. But again, I don't believe in a "god", so...

I also have great interest in Amish way of life. Strong family ties, hard work, simple living. But again, I don't believe in a "god", so...

To me, hurting children is one of the greatest atrocities of mankind. I read a lot of genocides and also various crimes (pedophilia, etc) involving indiscriminate killing or harm, and to murder a child face-to-face takes a special kind of monster.

I was involved in a few "youth counseling groups" as a teen due to depression (labeled "depression", but probably pretty typical in the grand scheme of things, just precocious for a 14 yr old). I had several experiences of being lambasted because I was not religious or followed some prescribed faith. On one occasion, I actually left the group and sat in a closet because I didn't agree with what was being discussed - a group of women followed me and broke down the closet door while shouting "But why don't you believe in god? God loves you!" I almost pooped my pants out of fear and defense.

So where am I now? Well, I'm a prosperous mid-30s person who keeps progressing because of what's around me. Rather than thanking some mystical being up in the sky, I am thankful for the opportunities I've been offered, the skills I taught myself, the simple life I lead, the food I grew myself and worked for, and the people around me who bring pleasure to my life. I live small and I respect my environment as much as possible. I do not believe in a mystical being who controls such things. The fact that there are so many religions in the world kind of cancels all of them out, and I'm a firm believer in nature and proven science. I have no interest or intention of hurting any person, place, or thing around me. And a few generations from now, people are going to idolize the few of us who didn't pop out 4 kids (and the exponential amount of descendants) just because we could and the "church" told us to. Procreating is nothing special, really - it's not a "miracle". Almost everyone can do it, but very few choose not to.

I do not denounce religion as a whole, because if such beliefs make someone stronger or helps them through tough times - fine. But I am bothered by having someone else's beliefs shoved down my throat and being outcast if I don't follow. That is not progressive behavior. This is still a big world with many, many different cultures and beliefs. It's this that makes our human world so interesting - and at the same time so negative and deadly. I'm somewhat torn over this, as it seems people just won't get along, even now in the era of globalization. Maybe it's made it worse, who knows.

[Goodatheist]

I applaud your nobility in speaking good of the Mormons and clearly one can sense in your writing that irrespective of the treatment they bestow on you you still have respect for them and is indicative of the decency of Atheists and that because we choose reason over faith doesn't make us evil. I think religious people in general have low tolerance for Atheists, they cannot accept our disregard for a god!

The shunning we endure from the religious tells me that if their opinions are not accepted then they will show their unfriendly side. The excuse commonly used here is there is a divide between God's children and those who are not. They are prone to all the temptations, trials and tribulations suffered by all human beings throughout the centuries and evidently don't get the protection they proclaim to have under God.

[arod0331]

Ah yes, the "morality" of atheists.

Let me tell you about this one family:
This family has 3 kids.....they all graduated as valedictorians of their class, none of them have ever used drugs or had a problem with alcohol, or unwanted pregnancies, or been in jail...etc.
The oldest is a doctor and in a loving marriage.
The middle works hard is about to graduate from college with a degree in business.
The youngest is an environmentalist and wants to become a social worker so she can help people.
They have loving parents who have encouraged and supported all 3 of them.

And yes....they are a family of atheists.

[Roxolan]

Originally Posted by arod0331

Let me tell you about this one family: [...]
And yes....they are a family of atheists.

If I was anti-atheist, I'd say "Anecdotal evidence!".
(then again, since there is no obvious reason to link atheism and immorality, the burden of proof is on them...)

[Mattie Jo]

I have known alot of atheists, and they are very moral.

I am not a believer of the Bible or Christianity, but I used to be, and I have alot more morals now then I did then.

[Dusty Rhodes]

OK guys and gals, lets fess up!!! It's about time we told those christers just what we really do for fun and games, not to mention food---- let's do the food first, shall we? OK, now.... we all know just how good a freshly made batch of Nun Stew is on those chilly winter mornings. Yup one medium sized nun can feed six or eight of us for several days, stewed up with parsnips, onions, garlic - a little hot sauce gives some spice, cause, some nuns are spicier than others. We all have our individual styles, some use potatos, some use yams, or turnips, sometimes I use various dried beans, a nice plump nun imparts a delicate flavor. Yes, I know, there has, historically speaking of course, been a bit of a controversy over wheather the orgy should begin before the feast, or four or five hours afterward, I have always been of the opinion it should be both.

[Heracles]

Originally Posted by Dusty Rhodes

OK guys and gals, lets fess up!!! It's about time we told those christers just what we really do for fun and games, not to mention food---- let's do the food first, shall we? OK, now.... we all know just how good a freshly made batch of Nun Stew is on those chilly winter mornings. Yup one medium sized nun can feed six or eight of us for several days, stewed up with parsnips, onions, garlic - a little hot sauce gives some spice, cause, some nuns are spicier than others. We all have our individual styles, some use potatos, some use yams, or turnips, sometimes I use various dried beans, a nice plump nun imparts a delicate flavor. Yes, I know, there has, historically speaking of course, been a bit of a controversy over wheather the orgy should begin before the feast, or four or five hours afterward, I have always been of the opinion it should be both.

How do you get the bitterness out of the nun? I tried a light, sweet baby roux to offset it, but to no avail. I know if you can score a good Belgian monk caught in the wild, one can feed a family all season if you stick to soups and light sausage.
I prefer the orgy before, personally, as nun fills me up and makes me sleepy.

[ConeyIsBabe]

Originally Posted by fnord

I usually avoid debates like this, but I see so many ignorant comments and threads here, so I'm starting my own.

I'm an atheist. I have been since "birth", I suppose. I was raised by an atheist father and and agnostic mother. While emotionally distant, they instilled fair and sensible values toward me. To this day, I do not have a racist, criminal, or cruel bone in my body - I will accept anyone regardless of what they look like, until they personally do me wrong. In my youth, I was surrounded by (and almost smothered by) Mormons who tried to get me to join their church to no end. I did attend church with a few of my friends here and there, but honestly, I just never believed in a "god", so that was that. When I was 13, there was another non-Mormon girl in my neighborhood. She got hooked, and her parents allowed her to be baptized. She never talked me after that. What's the sense in that? By age 14, they gave up and I was isolated to the point that likely many other non-Mormon youths in Utah can attest to.

In retrospect, I really like Mormon people. Awfully friendly! I visited SLC in 2006 and it was delightful. I support many of the values they live by. Just yesterday I checked out some Mormon TV ads from the 70s and 80s (the ones that were plastered on my TV as a child) and some of them made my eyes water. Strong family values, honorable fundamentals, helping others, the importance of working hard to get ahead in life. These are great qualities. But again, I don't believe in a "god", so...

I also have great interest in Amish way of life. Strong family ties, hard work, simple living. But again, I don't believe in a "god", so...

To me, hurting children is one of the greatest atrocities of mankind. I read a lot of genocides and also various crimes (pedophilia, etc) involving indiscriminate killing or harm, and to murder a child face-to-face takes a special kind of monster.

I was involved in a few "youth counseling groups" as a teen due to depression (labeled "depression", but probably pretty typical in the grand scheme of things, just precocious for a 14 yr old). I had several experiences of being lambasted because I was not religious or followed some prescribed faith. On one occasion, I actually left the group and sat in a closet because I didn't agree with what was being discussed - a group of women followed me and broke down the closet door while shouting "But why don't you believe in god? God loves you!" I almost pooped my pants out of fear and defense.

So where am I now? Well, I'm a prosperous mid-30s person who keeps progressing because of what's around me. Rather than thanking some mystical being up in the sky, I am thankful for the opportunities I've been offered, the skills I taught myself, the simple life I lead, the food I grew myself and worked for, and the people around me who bring pleasure to my life. I live small and I respect my environment as much as possible. I do not believe in a mystical being who controls such things. The fact that there are so many religions in the world kind of cancels all of them out, and I'm a firm believer in nature and proven science. I have no interest or intention of hurting any person, place, or thing around me. And a few generations from now, people are going to idolize the few of us who didn't pop out 4 kids (and the exponential amount of descendants) just because we could and the "church" told us to. Procreating is nothing special, really - it's not a "miracle". Almost everyone can do it, but very few choose not to.

I do not denounce religion as a whole, because if such beliefs make someone stronger or helps them through tough times - fine. But I am bothered by having someone else's beliefs shoved down my throat and being outcast if I don't follow. That is not progressive behavior. This is still a big world with many, many different cultures and beliefs. It's this that makes our human world so interesting - and at the same time so negative and deadly. I'm somewhat torn over this, as it seems people just won't get along, even now in the era of globalization. Maybe it's made it worse, who knows.

Well written..... well said... you got my rep point !

[fnord]

Thanks for the replies, everyone - didn't really write my post to gather responses. Mostly just more of a statement, as I sometimes feel overwhelmed and saddened to have such a scary & negative label on me simply because I don't believe in a God (or the Flying Spaghetti Monster). Provide concrete, scientific proof of either and you'll make me the fool!

It's been my experience that the least-religious or non-religious people are also the most tolerant and open-minded people.

[ShepsMom]

Originally Posted by fnord

Thanks for the replies, everyone - didn't really write my post to gather responses. Mostly just more of a statement, as I sometimes feel overwhelmed and saddened to have such a scary & negative label on me simply because I don't believe in a God (or the Flying Spaghetti Monster). Provide concrete, scientific proof of either and you'll make me the fool!

It's been my experience that the least-religious or non-religious people are also the most tolerant and open-minded people.

I don't see atheism as a scary and negative label. And i am proud to be one, so should you!