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The story of horus does not even come close to the details of Christ life, and if you did even a quick study, you would understand this. Also, Jesus Christ fulfilled 300 prophecies of the Old Testament, no other historical person can make that claim. And in the Old Testament it clearly states that a man would come to die for the sins of the world, He would be betrayed by a friend for 30 pieces of silver, ect. There are to many prophecies to mention, yet, Jesus Christ fulfilled everone of the Old Testament prophecies. Horus was not betrayed for 30 pieces of silver, Horus did not die for the sins of the world, and Horus did not fulfill the 300 prophecies of the Old Testament. Jesus Christ did.
Prove to me that Jesus Christ existed.
Go ahead. I'll wait. Please quote authors who specifically mention him, and NOT Bible authors. I need independent verification. And please quote people who have NOT been proven to be false identities or created well after the death of Jesus.
Assuming you do find something, I'll call National Geographic to inform them of a historical breakthrough.
...and that is why the story is found in almost every oral history spoken by every culture on the planet...
Nice job of ignoring what I had said concerning this.
As to your link...nobobdy knows what the Ararat Anomoly is. Could be an Ark, could be a rock formation. To call TRUTH to sketchy evidence is absurd. It's like Erich von Daniken assuming that the Nazca Lines in Peru are landing strips for UFOs driven by "ancient astronauts" because they "look like them".
Like I mentioned to another guy on this same topic, everyone thought that a mountain on Mars was some sort of ancient temple (Face on Mars) when in reality, it was a trick of the sun and camera angle of the satellite. Before making a conclusion about the Ararat anomoly, wait until further evidence is in so you don't look dumb. In the meantime, it might be worthwhile to read sites on the subject that don't have a religious agenda.
Lastly, even if the Ararat Anomoly turns out to be some sort of ship, there may or may not be ANYTHING that proves it is Noah's Ark. I still assert that the Noah story is nothing more than the Gilgamesh Epic told from a different cultural slant. Maybe instead of Noah's Ark, they will find Gilgamesh's Ark.
Last edited by Fullback32; 06-03-2009 at 11:06 AM..
We have messages from Noah and He states that while they lived on the river, they built their houses up off the ground in case of the rivers rising. They houses were similar to the ark. There was no flood and the rivers only flooded. The story was twisted to suit the writers of the bible.
We have messages from Noah and He states that while they lived on the river, they built their houses up off the ground in case of the rivers rising. They houses were similar to the ark. There was no flood and the rivers only flooded. The story was twisted to suit the writers of the bible.
And finally, here is our proof! I'm surprised it took this long to prove something that seemed so obvious!
The story of horus does not even come close to the details of Christ life, and if you did even a quick study, you would understand this. Also, Jesus Christ fulfilled 300 prophecies of the Old Testament, no other historical person can make that claim. And in the Old Testament it clearly states that a man would come to die for the sins of the world, He would be betrayed by a friend for 30 pieces of silver, ect. There are to many prophecies to mention, yet, Jesus Christ fulfilled everone of the Old Testament prophecies. Horus was not betrayed for 30 pieces of silver, Horus did not die for the sins of the world, and Horus did not fulfill the 300 prophecies of the Old Testament. Jesus Christ did.
First of all everything in the new testament was written years after jesus died. Jesus or "god" did not write it himself and you have absolutely no proof. The bible is an old book that the romans probably changed themselves. Its easy to write something and make it fulfill "prophecies" especially when it's written years after "jesus" death. And i like how you didnt respond to my other post. Why dont you please respond to my other post?
I can even show you tons of examples of innacuracies in the new testaments where they contradict themselves. Shall i begin?
#1 - not all Indian tribes had this story in their traditions. My nation, Comanche, certainly didn't.
#2 - You are listening to the accounts of white, Christian missionaries who had an agenda. There is ample proof of missionaries contaminating the oral histories of Indian people (North and South America), then later anthropologists and white historians reported it as fact.
#3 - It was not uncommon for missionaries, historians, and anthropolgists to talk to "less than traditional" Indians in those days (hell- even today). These people often did not really know their ways due to over exposure to white culture or knew enough to mix christian ideas with their traditional beliefs. In addition, it was not unknown for the individuals who spoke to the white people to tell them what the wanted to hear.
#4 - It was not uncommon for the missionaries, historians, and anthropologists to mistranslate, misinterpret, misunderstand, or MISREPRESENT what they were told.
#5 - Listen to Indian people about our history instead of white people. I am sick of non-Indians telling us what we believed, how we lived, etc.
Next window please.
With the Europeans that they began to meet in the 1500s they shared two and only two religious beliefs:
1. They believed in a life after death open to all ages and sexes. They referred to it as a Happy Hunting Ground. It was a place of abundant game and fruit and
was peopled only by the people they knew on earth and was never too hot or too cold and was eternal in nature. A Comanche did not have to be good or hold any beliefs to go there. The Nermenuh believed that death equalized all people. There were a few but very few exceptions. Persons scalped after death would not go there, persons dying of strangulation were forbidden entry and there were some Comanche who believed that persons who died after dark might not find their way to the Happy Hunting Ground.
2. The second belief that the Comanche shared with the invading Europeans was in the existence of a past flood that had covered the world. This belief is almost universal in some form among all of the Amerindians.
"#5 - Listen to Indian people about our history instead of white people. I am sick of non-Indians telling us what we believed, how we lived, etc." I am sick of ppl claiming something they know NOTHING about.
I AM NDN and VERY Proud of it!!! Not all white ppl are what u think. Just like not all "Indians" are drunks. Columbus coined the phrase " indians " because he thought he was in India. Actually that term is rather degrating, but since ur full blood u know that right?
Go ahead. I'll wait. Please quote authors who specifically mention him, and NOT Bible authors. I need independent verification. And please quote people who have NOT been proven to be false identities or created well after the death of Jesus.
Assuming you do find something, I'll call National Geographic to inform them of a historical breakthrough.
And now Caesar, upon hearing the death of Festus, sent Albinus into Judea, as procurator. But the king deprived Joseph of the high priesthood, and bestowed the succession to that dignity on the son of Ananus, who was also himself called Ananus. Now the report goes that this eldest Ananus proved a most fortunate man; for he had five sons who had all performed the office of a high priest to God, and who had himself enjoyed that dignity a long time formerly, which had never happened to any other of our high priests. But this younger Ananus, who, as we have told you already, took the high priesthood, was a bold man in his temper, and very insolent; he was also of the sect of the Sadducees, who are very rigid in judging offenders, above all the rest of the Jews, as we have already observed; when, therefore, Ananus was of this disposition, he thought he had now a proper opportunity. Festus was now dead, and Albinus was but upon the road; so he assembled the sanhedrin of judges, and brought before them the brother of Jesus, who was called Christ, whose name was James, and some others; and when he had formed an accusation against them as breakers of the law, he delivered them to be stoned: but as for those who seemed the most equitable of the citizens, and such as were the most uneasy at the breach of the laws, they disliked what was done; they also sent to the king, desiring him to send to Ananus that he should act so no more, for that what he had already done was not to be justified; nay, some of them went also to meet Albinus, as he was upon his journey from Alexandria, and informed him that it was not lawful for Ananus to assemble a sanhedrin without his consent. Whereupon Albinus complied with what they said, and wrote in anger to Ananus, and threatened that he would bring him to punishment for what he had done; on which king Agrippa took the high priesthood from him, when he had ruled but three months, and made Jesus, the son of Damneus, high priest. - flavius josephus-
Reference To Jesus Chris:
I do not wish, therefore, that the matter should be ignored without examination, so that these men may not be harassed, nor an opportunity given for malicious proceedings to be offered to informers. If, therefore, the provincials can clearly show their charges against these Christians, so as to answer before the tribunal, let them pursue this course only, but not just petitions, and mere outcries against Christians. For it is more fitting, if any one brings an accusation, that you should examine it. - Eusebius, Ecclesiastical History, IV
Conclusion
This reference reveals several key things:
1) Christians existed during the reign of Hadrian. 2) Christians were in conflict with society. 3) They followed Christ.
Lucian of Samosata lived A.D. 120-180. He was a satirist who was scornful of Christians. He wrote several books: The Passing Peregrinus and Alexander the False Prophet.
Reference To Jesus Christ
The Christians. . . worship a man to this day - the distinguished personage who introduced this new cult, and was crucified on that account. . . . You see, these misguided creatures start with the general conviction that they are immortal for all time, which explains their contempt for death and self devotion . . . their lawgiver [taught] they are all brothers, from the moment that they are converted, and deny the gods of Greece, and worship the crucified sage, and live after his laws. All this they take on faith . . . - The Passing Peregrinus
Oh, BTW, I have more proof if you need it. If some of the words are too bit for you to understand, I will be more than happy to explain them to you. As far as you ignorant comments, Mark Twain wrote: " It's better to be silent and let people think you're a fool than to open YOUR mouth and remove all doubt."
With the Europeans that they began to meet in the 1500s they shared two and only two religious beliefs:
1. They believed in a life after death open to all ages and sexes. They referred to it as a Happy Hunting Ground. It was a place of abundant game and fruit and
was peopled only by the people they knew on earth and was never too hot or too cold and was eternal in nature. A Comanche did not have to be good or hold any beliefs to go there. The Nermenuh believed that death equalized all people. There were a few but very few exceptions. Persons scalped after death would not go there, persons dying of strangulation were forbidden entry and there were some Comanche who believed that persons who died after dark might not find their way to the Happy Hunting Ground.
2. The second belief that the Comanche shared with the invading Europeans was in the existence of a past flood that had covered the world. This belief is almost universal in some form among all of the Amerindians.
"#5 - Listen to Indian people about our history instead of white people. I am sick of non-Indians telling us what we believed, how we lived, etc." I am sick of ppl claiming something they know NOTHING about.
I AM NDN and VERY Proud of it!!! Not all white ppl are what u think. Just like not all "Indians" are drunks. Columbus coined the phrase " indians " because he thought he was in India. Actually that term is rather degrating, but since ur full blood u know that right?
First - it's Numunu not Nermenuh, but that's some mighty fine copy and pasting you did there. BTW, the writer of that post you pasted got that info from T.R. Fehrenbach's book "Comanches". Fehrenbach is NOT Comanche (or even NDN), so what does he know?
Second - Comanche belief is hardly coherent in any way. We were the original skeptics of the plains. Belief ranged widely among bands and individuals. We do not have a lot of rituals and traditionally frown on pubic displays of spirituality. We also tend to kept our beliefs to ourselves. That being said, the scalping, strangulation, dark statements are true, though it resulted in annihilation or becoming a ghost. So is the statement about the afterlife being open to all. There is neither reward for virtue or punishment for sin. "Happy Hunting Grounds" indeed. Anymore cliches you'd like to throw out, Kemosabe? Sheez.
Third - My Uncle (Coffey) is our current tribal chairman; my grandfather (Kerchee) and great-uncle (Blackstar) were traditional Comanche elders (they've both passed). I listened to them and not some anthropologist, historian or missionary. I think I know a little more about our people than some book or YOU.
Fourth - I know that not all taibos (white people) are the same. Hell, I married one.
Fifth - How the word "Indian" came about is disputed. Some say Columbus thought he was in India; some say Columbus stated that the people he met were En Dios and was later bastardized to Indios. Doesn't really matter. The only people who seem to get bent out of shape about the word are Urban Indians, thin-bloods, and wannabes. It doesn't bother me or most people from the tribe.
Sixth - There is no Flood story among our people. I asked both Grandfather and great-uncle about that as I had heard this said before. They both said no. End of story.
Lastly - If you wish to follow the Christian god, then that is your business. I don't know what nation you are from or if you are even enrolled (nor do I really care), but do not presume to tell me about traditional Comanche beliefs. I don't like it when other NDNs do it either.
"Christian Indians make me laugh." - Jack Malotte (western Shoshone) 1995
Last edited by Fullback32; 06-03-2009 at 06:43 PM..
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