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View Poll Results: What is your opinion on expanding MARTA?
Yes, we need MARTA to be expanded and I will use. 173 73.62%
I probably won't use it, but expanding MARTA is a good idea. 24 10.21%
I don't care. 6 2.55%
I don't want MARTA to be expanded. 32 13.62%
Voters: 235. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-26-2007, 08:36 AM
 
Location: ITP
2,133 posts, read 5,619,095 times
Reputation: 1347

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gt6974a View Post
That's the point, many Cobb residents moved here when it was 'Mayberry', including my family.
I think gt6974a brings up a very interesting point. A lot of people out in the suburbs of Atlanta still believe that they live in a "rural" setting that really isn't tied into Metro Atlanta. Many folks moved out there for a "Mayberry" atmosphere, and dammit, they want to preserve what they paid for. However, because of many people's determination to preserve their own perceptions of their community, they ignore the rampant suburban development popping up around them like thousands of more tract homes and hundreds of thousands addtional square feet of retail space. Look at Cherokee County for example, many folks out there still believe they live in the country, despite the fact that areas like Hwy 92 have experienced rampant development.

When MARTA comes in, it's as if that picture-perfect image of living in the country has been destroyed in one stroke of the pen once the legislation is signed. Accepting MARTA to many people out there is to "throw in the towel" and throw away their dream of living in the countryside.

For Metro Atlanta to survive as a world-class metropolis, this mindset needs to be overcome and replaced with a mindset of people feeling like their part of the Metro Atlanta region in order to ensure sound comprehensive urban and transportation planning.

Last edited by south-to-west; 07-26-2007 at 09:01 AM..
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Old 07-26-2007, 08:50 AM
 
823 posts, read 1,991,672 times
Reputation: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by atlantagreg30127 View Post
I'm afraid that would NEVER fly in Georgia.

Atlanta is already considered the "evil child" by most of the rest of Georgia. Technically they need Atlanta for the state's overall economic prosperity, but they hate it at the same time. There are constant complaints that Atlanta gets all the money while the rest of the state is ignored (which of course isn't true).

While places like Atlanta, Savannah, Columbus, and perhaps Macon would benefit from such a tax for their public transit systems, all of the little "Cooterville" type towns throughout the state would rant and rage about how they're paying a tax for something (transit) that will never exist in their communities.

So it's going to depend on getting more Federal money (which will never happen under the current administration), or block grant type funds from the state (which again, won't happen with this governor), or raising fares and getting more money from the cities themselves (hard to do for cash-strapped cities). Not a rosey picture.
It flies in PA which like GA has one major city, several smaller cities, and then vast nothingness. The problem this plan has is that the Atlanta suburbs would be against it. In PA the Philly suburbs are for it which means that they have the population to push it through.

As the first post on Page 11 rightly points out, it is an attitude thing. Once the suburbs accept that they are part of Metro Atlanta and not just their own
thing then we will dominate Georgia politics (after all Metro Atlanta has more than half of the state's population last I checked). Until then it will be a struggle. Of course this is easier said than done and will probably never happen. Just look at how downstate NY dominates politics there. We could have the same thing here if people would get over themselves.
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Old 07-26-2007, 09:42 AM
 
Location: West Cobb County, GA (Atlanta metro)
9,188 posts, read 30,231,422 times
Reputation: 5131
Quote:
Originally Posted by south-to-west View Post
I think gt6974a brings up a very interesting point. A lot of people out in the suburbs of Atlanta still believe that they live in a "rural" setting that really isn't tied into Metro Atlanta. Many folks moved out there for a "Mayberry" atmosphere, and dammit, they want to preserve what they paid for. However, because of many people's determination to preserve their own perceptions of their community, they ignore the rampant suburban development popping up around them
I fully understand people not liking change ( I don't ). I also understand that small towns want to preserve their "way of life" ( what exactly that is though, varies on who you ask ).

But the thing is, Atlanta has had super rapid growth for decades. Since the mid-1970s, there have been anywhere from 55,000 to 90,000 people per year, every year, moving into the metro area. That's 30 years of growth like that, and it's widely known and published and discussed on the media and everyone is fully aware of the growth. When I moved out to Powder Springs 12 years ago to "get away from it all", I was still aware that eventually it WOULD catch up to me - and it has. So, once I can't deal with the growth anymore, I have two choices - move yet further out, or, leave the metro area altogether and go to an area with slower growth.

I'm not saying people need to submit and allow a Super-Walmart to open on every corner in their towns. Sometimes there are "causes" that you should fight for, and every now and then, you win. However, anyone who thinks they're going to move to a "Mayberry" that's anywhere close to Atlanta, and that Atlanta's growth won't eventually read that Mayberry, is being incredibly naive. If someone hates change THAT much, they really do need to just consider moving to a completely different, and slower-growth, metro area.
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Old 07-26-2007, 11:19 AM
 
Location: Atlanta,Ga
826 posts, read 2,786,578 times
Reputation: 242
I know I keep asking the same question, but would people be against a commuter rail? The previous poster mentioned a mode of transportation that did not run on the weekends and was meant specifically for people to get to and from work. Would this be a compromise? Does the Atlanta Are already have railways in place that could accommodate such?
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Old 07-26-2007, 11:44 AM
 
Location: ga
985 posts, read 5,295,914 times
Reputation: 492
Currently, there are a couple of projects on the table (one is Atlanta Macon commute train and another is Brain train project from Atlanta to Athens). In fact, Atlanta Macon commute train project already got $87 million federal money, but the project is stuck in Georgia houses with lack of support from Governor Purdue.
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Old 07-26-2007, 11:50 AM
 
Location: West Cobb County, GA (Atlanta metro)
9,188 posts, read 30,231,422 times
Reputation: 5131
Quote:
Originally Posted by jxu66 View Post
Currently, there are a couple of projects on the table (one is Atlanta Macon commute train and another is Brain train project from Atlanta to Athens). In fact, Atlanta Macon commute train project already got $87 million federal money, but the project is stuck in Georgia houses with lack of support from Governor Purdue.
Yep, and a reminder in case folks missed the comments - Perdue pretty much told the media plain and simple that mass transit isn't on his agenda at all. His last budget allocated money for lots of new road projects, but nothing at all for any kind of transit. Until he's out of office you won't see anything move forward along these lines at all, unless it's done via the private sector (which would be nearly impossible due to the costs to start up and operate).
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Old 07-26-2007, 11:51 AM
JPD
 
12,159 posts, read 15,066,795 times
Reputation: 7906
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merin View Post
I know I keep asking the same question, but would people be against a commuter rail? The previous poster mentioned a mode of transportation that did not run on the weekends and was meant specifically for people to get to and from work. Would this be a compromise? Does the Atlanta Are already have railways in place that could accommodate such?
I would support this. I believe the tracks are already in place. We have a lot of rail lines running through the area.
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Old 07-26-2007, 09:40 PM
 
1,020 posts, read 2,258,811 times
Reputation: 540
Quote:
So if the taxpayers can't vote, who's going to pay for this and how, are you proposing just forcing another tax on people?
_________________

My reply: Actually - yes. If given a choice, people will NEVER "vote" for change. Heck they won't even accept switching from a dollar bill to a dollar coin for crying out loud - why? Because they have a choice. Stop printing dollar bills, and say, "this is your new dollar coin - that's it!". Likewise, the region needs MORE transit options. Just build it, tax it, and if folks think 1% on their cigs and beer is going to bankrupt them, then yes, they can move.
_________________


The I-75 proposal has 2 HOV lanes, and 2 Truck lanes going through Cobb County on 75. The bus would be in one of these or have their own. Yes, the bus doesn't save much time now, but if that HOV lane went from 285 to 92 North, I'd save alot of time everyday.
_________________

My Reply: This doesn't take away from the fact that whenever there is a traffic accident (which is daily), many times ALL LANES are blocked and backed up - including HOV lanes, and including any express buses that are on those lanes. Now, one proposal shows lanes that ONLY allow express buses on them, and are elevated and separated from regular traffic lanes - similar to a raised rail track only paved for buses only. Sounds good, but such a thing would cost so much you might as well do a light or heavy rail system.

__________________

Marta can't even keep up with it's current costs much less expansion.
___________________

My reply: There's no doubt (and I've made the comment before) that MARTA is run by morons. In the past we've seen corruption investigations, money mismanagement, and even a CEO get arrested for "acts" in a public bathroom at the airport. They're run by idiots, and yes, a change in leadership is in order... or for that matter, a whole new secondary rail system under different leadership and authority, etc.
So, what you're saying is that we should abandon one of America's core values, controlling the government over us, to expand a transit system?

You know, they built an empire on that belief, and it faltered horribly (USSR anybody?). I do want MARTA expanded, but I would NEVER sacrifice government control to do such a thing. Maybe it's because I come from a strong, anti-communist background (some 1950s Russian in my family influenced that). I just think it's better to have some say in my government and sit in traffic than it is to zoom by on MARTA while living in any place which remotely resembles a tyrannical state.
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Old 07-26-2007, 09:53 PM
 
Location: West Cobb County, GA (Atlanta metro)
9,188 posts, read 30,231,422 times
Reputation: 5131
Quote:
Originally Posted by runningncircles1 View Post
I just think it's better to have some say in my government and sit in traffic than it is to zoom by on MARTA while living in any place which remotely resembles a tyrannical state.
Well, we will have our say then, and traffic will get worse, the air quality will get worse, and we'll do our good old American part in destroying the environment. But hey, at least the government won't control transit.

I stick by my belief that sometimes, change just has to happen without any input. Left to ourselves, people would never vote for change - they hate it. Sometimes things just have to be done. This is why we still spend extra millions of extra dollars printing dollar bills in stead of minting dollar coins (cheaper, last longer)... because we give people a choice and they refuse to use the coins. This is why we are one of only a handful of countries in the world that don't use the metric system - because we gave people a choice in stead of teaching it, and JUST it, in schools. Sometimes you just have to say, "this is it, folks - a new thing. Take it or don't, but it's here".

Last edited by atlantagreg30127; 07-26-2007 at 10:03 PM..
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Old 07-27-2007, 12:05 AM
 
1,020 posts, read 2,258,811 times
Reputation: 540
Quote:
Left to ourselves, people would never vote for change - they hate it. Sometimes things just have to be done.
I disagree strongly with that. Usually, when people don't vote for change, they're:

a) Content
b) Letting others vote for them.
b.1) Those others are getting their agendas pushed through while those who didn't vote are probably getting the shaft, and becoming more complacent. Look at the city of Atlanta.

Look what happened on Capitol Hill recently: after 12 long years of GOP dominance, the Democrats finally gained a slight edge. Why? People got tired of bull****, plain and simple.

Look what happened in Cobb County to their school board. They were upset at the superintendent for allowing the "Power to Learn" laptop scandal go through, and demanded his resignation. They now have a new superint..

The people of Sandy Springs, Johns Creek, and other newly incorporated cities of Fulton County became upset at the poor county-level governing, so they decided they could do a better job as independent cities, and to boot this resulted in tax hikes. The tax hikes hardly phased these people as they strongly believed they could improve their communities.

Now, would you like to know why politicians aren't trying to force MARTA on citizens? Because they know if they tried, their asses would be out of office faster than electioneers could count the votes.

Instead of forcing a currently undesired system on people, try convincing them. Show them the economic feasibilities; show pictures of people relaxing, reading, listening to music while riding MARTA (these are some of the reasons I enjoy riding it... sometimes I don't even go anywhere, I just ride back and forth, LOL). I've converted more people doing that than merely trying to get politician to force it.
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