Who thinks the MARTA should be expanded to include Cobb,Gwinnett, and the other metro Atlanta counties? (subdivision, income)

[atlantagreg30127]

Originally Posted by TheFuzz

Yes criminals drive cars, but what about criminals who don't have cars...ie. teenagers. Most residential burglaries are caused by teenagers who skip school during the day and enter your home while you're at work. By using mass transit, like Marta, you're giving them another way to get to your home.

I live in Powder Springs. When school is out in the summer, thefts and home break-ins by teens increase by a factor of 3, so yes, I'll give you that. When they're not in school, kids who were raised by trash do indeed feel like they have the right to take other's property. You are correct.

However, we do not have MARTA *or* CCT in my area. The kids simply walk around the neighborhoods and pick and choose what homes they're going to "hit", or, they have an older friend who has a car drive them around. So the problem with teens and crimes has nothing to do with public transportation - it has to do with incredibly bad parents, and with lax laws that treat 15 year old criminals like 9 years olds and simply release them to their crap parents, so they can break the law again the next day. Once laws are changed to that the 15 year old career criminal spends about 10 years behind bars for burglary, that is what will change their behavior - not having or not having transit in an area.

[xxman777]

Originally Posted by TheFuzz

You named the areas of "Lenox, Buckhead, and Perimeter." That's not even 1/4 of the areas that Marta goes to. Have you ridden to the other 3/4 of the stations Marta goes to?

The areas which are serviced by Marta which are distressed where already distressed or well on their way to being distressed when Marta was built. They are not examples of lower property values as a result of Marta.

TheFuzz, you are right that Marta would give criminals another option but the reality is transit doesn't really increase crime. Look at other cities around the country, there isn't a plethora of home invasions in the suburbs because of a far reaching transit system. Its just not realistic. The Atlanta metro area has about 5 million people, it is irresponsible and unsustainable to limit your transit expansion because some people in the suburbs are so afraid that they will be more likely to be a victim of crime. If somebody feels they will be so negatively effected by a transit system into the suburbs they shouldn't be living in a metro area with 5 million inhabitants.

[atlantagreg30127]

What I find so strange about these arguments are how some people here feel that Atlanta, and the people here, are so different from other cities that do have transit into the burbs. Why are we so "special"? Why would crime effect us in the burbs, but it hasn't in all the other cities that have mass transit in their burbs? Does Atlanta have an odd witch's curse we need to know about?

Comparison...

I think some folks might loosely be able to compare Dallas Texas with Atlanta. Both are growing cities. Both are business cities. Both have bad traffic.

Take a look at this flash-based video from the Dallas DART system. It's a light rail system that is rapidly expanding there - and supported. Even the Feds gave them more $$ than anyone else gets. It's a longer video, but if you stick with it, you'll see how forward thinking they are, and how the line(s) are already causing positive (and high-end) development in the areas where the rail is going to go. Video: DART.org - Green Line Video - June 2007

I see NO reason why this couldn't happen here in Atlanta - except for the fact we need to vote in new area leaders, as well as new leadership for MARTA...

[JPD]

Originally Posted by TheFuzz

I know for a fact it'll never happen in Cobb because of county commissioners.

Interesting. I had no idea present day commissioners were in charge of everything that happens until eternity.

[Noc]

Originally Posted by TheFuzz

Yes criminals drive cars, but what about criminals who don't have cars...ie. teenagers. Most residential burglaries are caused by teenagers who skip school during the day and enter your home while you're at work. By using mass transit, like Marta, you're giving them another way to get to your home.

You named the areas of "Lenox, Buckhead, and Perimeter." That's not even 1/4 of the areas that Marta goes to. Have you ridden to the other 3/4 of the stations Marta goes to? Plus condos and townhomes and high end retail aren't neighborhoods. A neighborhood home is going to be burglarized more easily than a townhome,condo, or apartment. I can go to your house during normal working hours and knock on your door. If someone answers, I just say I'm looking for Billy, and when you say that Billy doesn't live there, I just say I must have the wrong house. If no one answers, I walk around the back door, kick it in, and have my way with the interior of your home. You can't do that with a condo or townhome as easily. That's why you shouldn't bring Marta to the burbs.

Although this is part true. A burglar will do this more effectively with a vehicle and have a better chance at getting away. Also this is 2007 why doesn't every home have a security system? Door gets kicked in and police show up in 2 minutes. The worst the home owner will have to deal with is busted door.

[TheFuzz]

Originally Posted by Noc

Although this is part true. A burglar will do this more effectively with a vehicle and have a better chance at getting away. Also this is 2007 why doesn't every home have a security system? Door gets kicked in and police show up in 2 minutes. The worst the home owner will have to deal with is busted door.

LOL! (I actually really did laugh at this) Here's what happens with alarms, if you didn't know:

Alarm goes off and alarm company calls residence and any other numbers to see if its a false alarm, with 99% of the time it is. 2 Minutes

Alarm calls local police precinct to notify of the alarm, dispatcher types it in a dispatch, and its placed in the pool of calls holding. 3-4 Minutes....6 Minutes if they're training a new dispatcher.

Alarm call sits as the lowest priority of calls, only illegal parking, noise complaints and county ordinances sit lower. 2 Minutes if there are no calls holding or 3 Hours (longest I've personally seen an alarm hold).

Alarm call is dispatched to officer and the officer has to travel there. 2 Minutes if he's around the corner to 35 Minutes (about the longest time I've personally traveled to an alarm).

So lets add things up...there's a minimum of just under 10 minutes to a maximum of over 3 hours for the time it takes an officer to get to your house. Give me ten minutes in your house and I'll have a pocket full of jewelry and a backpack full of small electronics.

Most burglaries are not of large flat screen TVs being put into stolen cars...they're just the ones you hear about. Most burglaries are teens that rummage through your stuff and take jewelry, video game systems, DVDs, laptops, and other small electronics. If you don't believe me, go pull the police reports for your area (which you can due to the open records act).

To the person who made the comment about the county commisoners "controlling everything for eternity"....as long as we have the same ones, most of which are fairly young and probably won't lose their seat, I don't foresee Marta coming to Cobb anytime in the near future.

My argument is, how many times have you seen someone on Marta with a backpack and thought nothing of it? Probably several. Do you know what's in that backpack? Is it your laptop? Your digital camera? Your jewelry? Your kids PS3?

Someone gets off Marta with an empty backpack, walks to your neighborhood from a Marta bus stop, kicks in your back door, fills up his backpack, leaves and gets back on the Marta bus, you see him get on Marta as you're getting off from work and think nothing of it, you get home and realize your stuff has been stolen.

[Merin]

I read my crime reports weekly, hardly any of the suspects flee on foot. Alot of them are in stolen cars.

[atlantagreg30127]

Originally Posted by TheFuzz

LOL! (I actually really did laugh at this) Here's what happens with alarms, if you didn't know:

Alarm goes off and alarm company calls residence and any other numbers to see if its a false alarm, with 99% of the time it is. 2 Minutes

Alarm calls local police precinct to notify of the alarm, dispatcher types it in a dispatch, and its placed in the pool of calls holding. 3-4 Minutes....6 Minutes if they're training a new dispatcher.

Alarm call sits as the lowest priority of calls, only illegal parking, noise complaints and county ordinances sit lower. 2 Minutes if there are no calls holding or 3 Hours (longest I've personally seen an alarm hold).

Alarm call is dispatched to officer and the officer has to travel there. 2 Minutes if he's around the corner to 35 Minutes (about the longest time I've personally traveled to an alarm).

So lets add things up...there's a minimum of just under 10 minutes to a maximum of over 3 hours for the time it takes an officer to get to your house. .

I'm one of the luckier ones. I live only 1/4 mile from the local police station and we've got a lot of "Rambo" type officers who go for this kind of stuff. I've had 2 false alarms and one "real" alarm (they didn't actually get in, though) in 5 years and each time the neighbors said someone showed up at my house within 4 minutes or so of the alarm going off.

But I also have a ton of retired/at-home worker neighbors, too. If anyone sneaks around these houses there's a 95% chance someone will actually see them, and/or web cam record them. LOL. At one time that was considered "nosey neighbors" and people would avoid living on a street like that, but these days, I consider it a plus.

Quite a while ago I posted about alternatives to where rail stations are placed, as a compromise to those who feel it brings crime to their areas. I'll repeat it. People in the burbs already have cars. The whole points of suburban rail stations is mainly to take some of those cars off the road. You do not HAVE to put suburban rail stations in existing residential neighborhoods!

Industrial land is cheaper. MARTA (or whatever agency runs it) would buy land in those industrial areas and build rail stations with large parking facilities there. People in the surrounding burb areas drive to those stations, park, and take rail. They would not be within walking distance to existing neighborhoods. Now, later down the road some developers may wish to build NEW housing near those stations, and that's fine and dandy - they come after the fact and you can choose if you want to live near rail or not. That way, there is rail in the burbs to get cars off the road, and, it's not in someone's back yard to they can stop worrying that rail people will invade their homes.

Problem solved. Compromise.

[south-to-west]

TheFuzz,

It takes 10 minutes just to walk from a subdivision's entrance to a house. What the hell are you talking about?

There are instances where people back moving vans into driveways and rob an entire home while the occupants are gone. What are you gonna do next? Ban U-Haul?

[pirate_lafitte]

Originally Posted by south-to-west

TheFuzz,

It takes 10 minutes just to walk from a subdivision's entrance to a house. What the hell are you talking about?

There are instances where people back moving vans into driveways and rob an entire home while the occupants are gone. What are you gonna do next? Ban U-Haul?

I second that. Instead of banning transit, we need more police officers on duty and on the beat more often.