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Old 05-12-2011, 05:23 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
2,567 posts, read 3,309,081 times
Reputation: 1377
Quote:
Originally Posted by muxBuppie View Post
I don't see to many of any race at Atlantic Station. Besides that who cares if only white or black people care to go in a place if it is safe?
And it's making good money.
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Old 05-12-2011, 08:47 PM
 
8,682 posts, read 11,629,785 times
Reputation: 1924
Quote:
Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
...I read that but am not sure I'm following you.

...closing down bars and restaurants. I'm not sure why you'd consider that as part of a solution but simply don't see the need to do that at this point.


I don't understand what is hard to follow about the simple, clear, and straightforward flow chart I made.


I would never (have never) consider(ed) closing down bars/clubs as part of a solution--that's the whole reason I've even been participating on this thread. Have you read my posts? Have you read the posts from the few other posters that have suggested bar/club closings? Did you see the ten-point plan that suggested bar/club shut downs?


It seems to me that you don't really want to take into account what it would take to run a society/city--our society is full of humans, you know. To sit back and just moralize that everyone should just be responsible and mature--and then all will be dandy...well, that's just not grounded in reality or pragmatism.
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Old 05-12-2011, 10:00 PM
 
14,204 posts, read 8,706,956 times
Reputation: 3354
Quote:
Originally Posted by aries4118 View Post
It seems to me that you don't really want to take into account what it would take to run a society/city--our society is full of humans, you know. To sit back and just moralize that everyone should just be responsible and mature--and then all will be dandy...well, that's just not grounded in reality or pragmatism.
Aries, consider that most nightlife centers in Atlanta tick along just fine and don't experience late night cruising, loud stereos, fighting, shootings, trashing, etc. I have personally lived in close proximity to two of the most popular nightlife areas and can tell you from direct experience that it was not a problem.

Special intensive policing was not required. Why? Simply because the patrons decided to act like big boys and girls and did not engage in abusive behavior.

This goes on today throughout Atlanta and in other big cities around the US and the world. That is why I believe it is better than a top down approach that relies on law enforcement to force people to behave.

I'm sorry if I misinterpreted your flow chart. It may have been clear and simple to you but I wasn't sure. So I gave you my read and asked you if I was getting it right. It wasn't my intent to make you mad but I don't know how else to proceed.

Peace, okay? I always enjoy and respect your posts and don't want you to feel angry.
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Old 05-12-2011, 10:43 PM
 
8,682 posts, read 11,629,785 times
Reputation: 1924
Quote:
Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
Aries, consider that most nightlife centers in Atlanta tick along just fine and don't experience late night cruising, loud stereos, fighting, shootings, trashing, etc. I have personally lived in close proximity to two of the most popular nightlife areas and can tell you from direct experience that it was not a problem.

Special intensive policing was not required. Why? Simply because the patrons decided to act like big boys and girls and did not engage in abusive behavior.

This goes on today throughout Atlanta and in other big cities around the US and the world. That is why I believe it is better than a top down approach that relies on law enforcement to force people to behave.

I'm sorry if I misinterpreted your flow chart. It may have been clear and simple to you but I wasn't sure. So I gave you my read and asked you if I was getting it right. It wasn't my intent to make you mad but I don't know how else to proceed.

Peace, okay? I always enjoy and respect your posts and don't want you to feel angry.
I'm not angry, Brother Arjay. I apologize if I came off that way.

But, I think I've had an "ah-ha" moment in our discussion.

Look at the highlighted above...

You're right. Atlanta does have decent nightlife centers--VaHi, North Grant Park/Memorial Drive, etc, etc.

However, I feel (strongly) that Atlanta's nightlife is not complete/full/thorough-enough at all. Since 2004, Atlanta does not have an urban/city oriented club scene with clubs/discoteques/dance halls that stay open until at least 4am. The city needs this. Extra/special policing may be required (in the initial stages) to establish/maintain it. Trust me, brother.

Sit-down bars, outdoor cafes open to 11pm, maybe 12am, maybe even 1am or 2am does not make for a vibrant, international city--imo.

Atlanta needs more (much more) than what it has right now. Atlanta had it prior to 2004. The story is even sadder because Atlanta's scene really did not start to mature/reach the higher levels until mid-1998. The city only had five good years before...

Last edited by aries4118; 05-12-2011 at 11:03 PM..
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Old 05-13-2011, 01:19 AM
 
1,498 posts, read 1,611,814 times
Reputation: 536
Quote:
Originally Posted by aries4118 View Post

Atlanta needs more (much more) than what it has right now. Atlanta had it prior to 2004.
Alright, you've been spewing your b.s. in this thread long enough. Atlanta had it prior to 2004? Everyone knows what that year correlates to. Sorry, but no one wants Buckhead to return to the murder district that it was pre-2004.

Your suggestion that the city pay for more police so we can bring back Buckhead because Atlanta "needs a place" where people can blast music, cruise, and shoot and stab each other "in order to add to its vibrancy and urbanism, brother," is actually somewhat scary. Hey, as long as we can bring Buckhead back, who cares if taxes go up, people get killed, and home values plummet?

The ideas you have been espousing in this thread have no rational basis (although that is usually the case) and defy logic (yeah, not enough police is the problem). Atlanta's nightlife is fine. It's no Buenos Aires or Rome, but if you're expecting it to be, that's your problem.

Quote:
The story is even sadder because Atlanta's scene really did not start to mature/reach the higher levels until mid-1998. The city only had five good years before...
What a surprise that you pick 1998 as when Atlanta's nightlife "matured."

Why don't you just say what you really want to say. It has nothing to do with vibrancy. I bet you got off to the fact that Buckhead (of all places) had became a hip-hop club district, and it bothers you to this day that those toms down at city hall put a stop to it.
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Old 05-13-2011, 06:20 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
2,567 posts, read 3,309,081 times
Reputation: 1377
Just paying attention to how many other cities manage their night life a couple of conclusions become apparent to me.

First of all it was a mistake to make Buckhead village into a major party district in the first place. Other cities have successfully placed party centers in warehouse districts and near major college campus' like Austin, Denver's LoDo, Columbus' High Street, the Flats in Cleveland, etc. but I don't know of any cities that have successfully placed a hopping night life scene right in the middle of a wealthy residential area (except maybe Miami Beach but that's very different). Something more low key like the bar life in Georgetown, D.C. for instance is usually found in these areas.

(A side Note) The huge amount of money infused into Atlanta's nightlife and the celebrity connections of BMF caused things to blow up in Atlanta for a while. But unlike that other M that brought prosperity to New Yorks club scene (and Atlanta's for a while), BMF's don't give a /@$%, wild west attitude doomed that era from the start.


Second. In all the places I listed above a heavy police presence has been used and needed and has kept those area's peaceful and relatively trouble free. Don't believe me, check out Minneapolis' Downtown club district or LoDo in Denver, or High Street in Columbus. Those places are crawling with police in comparison to Atlanta's past party districts.
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Old 05-13-2011, 07:40 AM
 
8,682 posts, read 11,629,785 times
Reputation: 1924
Quote:
Originally Posted by BringBackCobain View Post
Alright, you've been spewing your b.s. in this thread long enough. Atlanta had it prior to 2004? Everyone knows what that year correlates to. Sorry, but no one wants Buckhead to return to the murder district that it was pre-2004.

Your suggestion that the city pay for more police so we can bring back Buckhead because Atlanta "needs a place" where people can blast music, cruise, and shoot and stab each other "in order to add to its vibrancy and urbanism, brother," is actually somewhat scary. Hey, as long as we can bring Buckhead back, who cares if taxes go up, people get killed, and home values plummet?

The ideas you have been espousing in this thread have no rational basis (although that is usually the case) and defy logic (yeah, not enough police is the problem). Atlanta's nightlife is fine. It's no Buenos Aires or Rome, but if you're expecting it to be, that's your problem.



What a surprise that you pick 1998 as when Atlanta's nightlife "matured."

Why don't you just say what you really want to say. It has nothing to do with vibrancy. I bet you got off to the fact that Buckhead (of all places) had became a hip-hop club district, and it bothers you to this day that those toms down at city hall put a stop to it.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

Not even talking about Buckhead--at all.

Carry on though--your posts are entertaining.
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Old 05-13-2011, 07:43 AM
 
8,682 posts, read 11,629,785 times
Reputation: 1924
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galounger View Post
...
First of all it was a mistake to make Buckhead village into a major party district in the first place. Other cities have successfully placed party centers in warehouse districts and near major college campus' like Austin, Denver's LoDo, Columbus' High Street, the Flats in Cleveland, etc. but I don't know of any cities that have successfully placed a hopping night life scene right in the middle of a wealthy residential area (except maybe Miami Beach but that's very different). Something more low key like the bar life in Georgetown, D.C. for instance is usually found in these areas.

...


Second. In all the places I listed above a heavy police presence has been used and needed and has kept those area's peaceful and relatively trouble free. Don't believe me, check out Minneapolis' Downtown club district or LoDo in Denver, or High Street in Columbus. Those places are crawling with police in comparison to Atlanta's past party districts.
This.
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Old 05-13-2011, 07:59 AM
 
14,204 posts, read 8,706,956 times
Reputation: 3354
Quote:
Originally Posted by aries4118 View Post
However, I feel (strongly) that Atlanta's nightlife is not complete/full/thorough-enough at all. Since 2004, Atlanta does not have an urban/city oriented club scene with clubs/discoteques/dance halls that stay open until at least 4am. The city needs this. Extra/special policing may be required (in the initial stages) to establish/maintain it. Trust me, brother.

Sit-down bars, outdoor cafes open to 11pm, maybe 12am, maybe even 1am or 2am does not make for a vibrant, international city--imo.

Atlanta needs more (much more) than what it has right now. Atlanta had it prior to 2004. The story is even sadder because Atlanta's scene really did not start to mature/reach the higher levels until mid-1998. The city only had five good years before...
aries, you have often alluded to the mid-1998 to 2004 period as being the time when Atlanta had a vibrant nightlife. You've also said you're not talking about Buckhead.

Could you be more specific about what you're referring to? In particular, what was going on then that stopped in 2004?

I'm honestly not understanding the changes you're talking about. What are some examples of the nightlife we used to have that we don't have now? And what happened?

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Old 05-13-2011, 09:27 AM
 
14,204 posts, read 8,706,956 times
Reputation: 3354
Georgia tavern owners form new association | Atlanta Business Chronicle

Quote:
In the city of Atlanta, bars must close at midnight on Sundays, Bruno [president of the Tavern Owners Association] added.

“I don’t think anyone wants to revisit 4 a.m. closings, but Sunday night the restaurants should open regular hours,” he said. “Now everyone goes over to DeKalb County [which allows longer Sunday hours].”

“It has to be frustrating for the legislators, too, because they do something and no one helps, but then everyone comes screaming,” Bruno said. “We want to help them craft legislation, or be considered, for things that affect our livelihood.”

There is a Savannah chapter of the Georgia Licensed Beverage Association getting started, and Cobb and Gwinnett are looking at forming chapters of the new association, he said.

Entertainment zones

Wolf would also like to take the lead to have a dialogue about an entertainment zone in the city.

“The area around the Georgia Aquarium and World of Coke is a family-friendly entertainment zone,” he said. “Why not have an entertainment zone that has quality night clubs?”

aries, does this address your concerns?
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