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Old 07-22-2012, 07:13 PM
 
Location: Kirkwood
22,157 posts, read 16,157,856 times
Reputation: 4894

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Quote:
Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
Here's a question I have about the TSPLOST:

Are we going to have pay MORE if this thing doesn't pass? According to this, "Today, local governments must provide a local match in order to receive their state local maintenance grants. If the voters turn down the transportation referendum in 2012, the local match increases to 30%. If the project list is adopted and the voters pass the transportation referendum in 2012, the local match drops to 10%."
That is 100% correct. There are repercussions if the transportation referendum does not pass.
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Old 07-22-2012, 07:30 PM
 
Location: Mableton, GA USA (NW Atlanta suburb, 4 miles OTP)
11,319 posts, read 21,899,233 times
Reputation: 3848
Quote:
Originally Posted by PKCorey View Post
Yea, that's the penalty built into the bill.
That seems like a really stupid thing to put in a bill, at least to me.
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Old 07-22-2012, 07:37 PM
 
Location: East Side of ATL
4,143 posts, read 5,737,020 times
Reputation: 1758
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcsteiner View Post
That seems like a really stupid thing to put in a bill, at least to me.
I guess, its to cover the gas tax shortfall on funding?
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Old 07-22-2012, 07:38 PM
 
28,129 posts, read 24,652,789 times
Reputation: 9534
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcsteiner View Post
That seems like a really stupid thing to put in a bill, at least to me.
I think the legislature was sending a clear message:
"This is it, folks. It took 10 years to get enough votes to pass this bill, and now you've got 2 more years to decide on your project list.

We're not going to play that game where you reject it and keep coming back with list after list."

In other words, time to quit the squalling and put on your big boy pants.
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Old 07-22-2012, 09:18 PM
 
Location: Mableton, GA USA (NW Atlanta suburb, 4 miles OTP)
11,319 posts, read 21,899,233 times
Reputation: 3848
Quote:
Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
I think the legislature was sending a clear message:
"This is it, folks. It took 10 years to get enough votes to pass this bill, and now you've got 2 more years to decide on your project list.

We're not going to play that game where you reject it and keep coming back with list after list."

In other words, time to quit the squalling and put on your big boy pants.
In other words, we're too lazy to try to provide you with real choices, so either vote for this bill or we'll ********* for not complying.

Wow, the filter here is sensitive. There was no profanity in my above sentence.
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Old 07-23-2012, 08:34 AM
 
28,129 posts, read 24,652,789 times
Reputation: 9534
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcsteiner View Post
In other words, we're too lazy to try to provide you with real choices, so either vote for this bill or we'll ********* for not complying.
Well, once the Georgia legislature gets around to doing something they don't have much tolerance for further gee-hawing.

The notion that metro Atlanta would somehow come up with a better plan 4 or 5 years from now or suddenly become more cooperative is pretty far-fetched to begin with.

We can choose to go forward, or opt to languish in the past. That's about the size of it.
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Old 07-23-2012, 08:41 AM
 
28,129 posts, read 24,652,789 times
Reputation: 9534
From the ARC. That second point is really telling. Without additional funding, about 70 percent of metro Atlanta’s scheduled transportation dollars for the next 30 years will be spent simply on maintaining our current transportation network.
10 Facts about the Regional Transportation Referendum

Low spending and high congestion: Georgia ranks 48th in the nation in transportation spending per capita, and ranks 4th in total hours the average commuter spends in on the road each day.

Little room for expansion: Without additional funding, about 70 percent of metro Atlanta’s scheduled transportation dollars for the next 30 years will be spent on maintaining our current transportation network, leaving little room for expansion.

Congestion will increase as revenues decrease: Congestion will get worse as the region continues to grow – by some three million more people in the next 25 years. Meanwhile, gas tax revenues will continue to decline as cars become more fuel-efficient.

Money stays here: All monies generated here by the 10-year, regional transportation referendum would stay in metro Atlanta and be invested in high-priority projects throughout our 10 counties, from interchange improvements at I-285 and GA 400, to road and safety improvements, to a new light rail line from the Lindbergh MARTA station to the Clifton Corridor.

Positive return on investment: The economic impact over time on the Atlanta region would be far greater than the 1996 Olympics. The referendum investment would result in a $34.8 billion increase in gross regional product in the Atlanta region by 2040. That’s a 4-to-1 return on investment.

Job creation and retention: Some 200,000 jobs would be created or retained through the build-out of these new transportation projects. The positive economic effect equates to approximately 7,100 jobs each year from 2013 through 2040.

Business and workforce development opportunities: Policies for strong small business and minority contracting and workforce development efforts have been developed and adopted by key agencies responsible for the project build-out.

Cost savings to commuters: Commuters spend an average of $924 each year due to traffic congestion. Collectively, the time and fuel savings generated by referendum projects would allow residents to save $9.2 billion by 2040.

Decrease in travel delays: Travellers will enjoy a 24% average decrease in future travel delays on roadways improved through road widening, new construction and improved interchanges.

Air quality benefits: Air quality improvement would be equal to taking 72,000 vehicles off the roads daily.


Consider the facts and please vote on July 31.
Visit TIA Tsplost - One Percent Sales Tax Referendum to Fund Transportation Projects in the Atlanta Region for more detailed information.
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Old 07-23-2012, 09:16 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
22,157 posts, read 16,157,856 times
Reputation: 4894
Quote:
Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
From the ARC. That second point is really telling. Without additional funding, about 70 percent of metro Atlanta’s scheduled transportation dollars for the next 30 years will be spent simply on maintaining our current transportation network.
10 Facts about the Regional Transportation Referendum

Low spending and high congestion: Georgia ranks 48th in the nation in transportation spending per capita, and ranks 4th in total hours the average commuter spends in on the road each day.

Little room for expansion: Without additional funding, about 70 percent of metro Atlanta’s scheduled transportation dollars for the next 30 years will be spent on maintaining our current transportation network, leaving little room for expansion.

Congestion will increase as revenues decrease: Congestion will get worse as the region continues to grow – by some three million more people in the next 25 years. Meanwhile, gas tax revenues will continue to decline as cars become more fuel-efficient.

Money stays here: All monies generated here by the 10-year, regional transportation referendum would stay in metro Atlanta and be invested in high-priority projects throughout our 10 counties, from interchange improvements at I-285 and GA 400, to road and safety improvements, to a new light rail line from the Lindbergh MARTA station to the Clifton Corridor.

Positive return on investment: The economic impact over time on the Atlanta region would be far greater than the 1996 Olympics. The referendum investment would result in a $34.8 billion increase in gross regional product in the Atlanta region by 2040. That’s a 4-to-1 return on investment.

Job creation and retention: Some 200,000 jobs would be created or retained through the build-out of these new transportation projects. The positive economic effect equates to approximately 7,100 jobs each year from 2013 through 2040.

Business and workforce development opportunities: Policies for strong small business and minority contracting and workforce development efforts have been developed and adopted by key agencies responsible for the project build-out.

Cost savings to commuters: Commuters spend an average of $924 each year due to traffic congestion. Collectively, the time and fuel savings generated by referendum projects would allow residents to save $9.2 billion by 2040.

Decrease in travel delays: Travellers will enjoy a 24% average decrease in future travel delays on roadways improved through road widening, new construction and improved interchanges.

Air quality benefits: Air quality improvement would be equal to taking 72,000 vehicles off the roads daily.


Consider the facts and please vote on July 31.
Visit TIA Tsplost - One Percent Sales Tax Referendum to Fund Transportation Projects in the Atlanta Region for more detailed information.
Thank you for providing those facts. When you look at in a list, it makes sense to vote YES. We would gain a lot more than new interchanges and transit lines.
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Old 07-23-2012, 10:45 AM
 
Location: Marietta, GA
7,844 posts, read 14,519,804 times
Reputation: 3484
Quote:
Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
From the ARC. That second point is really telling. Without additional funding, about 70 percent of metro Atlanta’s scheduled transportation dollars for the next 30 years will be spent simply on maintaining our current transportation network.
10 Facts about the Regional Transportation Referendum

Low spending and high congestion: Georgia ranks 48th in the nation in transportation spending per capita, and ranks 4th in total hours the average commuter spends in on the road each day.

Little room for expansion: Without additional funding, about 70 percent of metro Atlanta’s scheduled transportation dollars for the next 30 years will be spent on maintaining our current transportation network, leaving little room for expansion.

Congestion will increase as revenues decrease: Congestion will get worse as the region continues to grow – by some three million more people in the next 25 years. Meanwhile, gas tax revenues will continue to decline as cars become more fuel-efficient.

Money stays here: All monies generated here by the 10-year, regional transportation referendum would stay in metro Atlanta and be invested in high-priority projects throughout our 10 counties, from interchange improvements at I-285 and GA 400, to road and safety improvements, to a new light rail line from the Lindbergh MARTA station to the Clifton Corridor.

Positive return on investment: The economic impact over time on the Atlanta region would be far greater than the 1996 Olympics. The referendum investment would result in a $34.8 billion increase in gross regional product in the Atlanta region by 2040. That’s a 4-to-1 return on investment.

Job creation and retention: Some 200,000 jobs would be created or retained through the build-out of these new transportation projects. The positive economic effect equates to approximately 7,100 jobs each year from 2013 through 2040.

Business and workforce development opportunities: Policies for strong small business and minority contracting and workforce development efforts have been developed and adopted by key agencies responsible for the project build-out.

Cost savings to commuters: Commuters spend an average of $924 each year due to traffic congestion. Collectively, the time and fuel savings generated by referendum projects would allow residents to save $9.2 billion by 2040.

Decrease in travel delays: Travellers will enjoy a 24% average decrease in future travel delays on roadways improved through road widening, new construction and improved interchanges.

Air quality benefits: Air quality improvement would be equal to taking 72,000 vehicles off the roads daily.


Consider the facts and please vote on July 31.
Visit TIA Tsplost - One Percent Sales Tax Referendum to Fund Transportation Projects in the Atlanta Region for more detailed information.
In my opinion, these "facts" assume some items not necessarily in evidence.

They assume that the projects in this TSPLOST will fundamentally alter the travel experience for most commuters, and they assume that commuting patterns and needs will not change over the next 20 to 50 years.

Where is the improvement for suburban or even urban residents who live very close to where they work (as the mantra has been preached) but encounter local traffic on side streets that need to be widened or have their lights better timed? Will a light rail line to Emory help me when Whitlock Ave is backed up? Typically, any delay I hit is after I exit the Interstate, not while I'm on it. This plan doesn't really affect either my trip up I-75 or my trip on local roads.

I'm asked to believe that a huge number of people will abandon their cars and take the express bus or light rail when it's eventually completed in 10 to 20 years. How does that improve traffic on a clogged Whitlock Rd (or any other local road) as I either make my way to the transit or to the Interstate?
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Old 07-23-2012, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Kirkwood
22,157 posts, read 16,157,856 times
Reputation: 4894
Quote:
Typically, any delay I hit is after I exit the Interstate
You've said it yourself, 75 backs up north of the perimeter.
Quote:
I'm asked to believe that a huge number of people will abandon their cars and take the express bus or light rail when it's eventually completed in 10 to 20 years. How does that improve traffic on a clogged Whitlock Rd (or any other local road) as I either make my way to the transit or to the Interstate?
This isn't just about you, it will help people from Cobb get to downtown, midtown, or buckhead for work easier than driving. It will allow for them to get to the airport on transit. It will allow them to attend sporting events downtown without getting caught in traffic or dealing with outrageous parking fees. It will allow them to visit the downtown and midtown cultural centers without having to deal with finding parking, avoid parkAtlanta, or traffic.
There is more than just commuting M-F, 8-5.
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