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Old 07-03-2012, 02:13 AM
 
Location: Historic West End
3,950 posts, read 3,255,546 times
Reputation: 3769

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Yes downtown Atlanta it Awesome, why live anywhere outside of 285 and deal with stupid traffic. Atlanta is sitting pretty especially with the beltline project and development. I love living downtown and not dealing with traffic.
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Old 07-03-2012, 04:50 AM
 
9,124 posts, read 32,110,748 times
Reputation: 3519
Quote:
Originally Posted by bryantm3 View Post
the problem with modern homes is that they're built with square footage and amenities in mind, and aren't built to last a very long time. the reason homes were smaller in the past was because building a solid home was a given, the money had to be there to build a solid house, size was a secondary issue. nowadays building standards are not the same.
Actually, homes today will last quite a long time, despite what people say- for every "old home that has stood the test of time, proving that old homes were built better", there are dozens that don't exist today because they literally rotted away. Bad foundations, poor water management in walls/roofs, and materials that weren't decay-resistant are prevalent in older homes.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bryantm3 View Post
age is a non-sequitur. i don't see you posting your credentials. my parents built their own home in 1998, i have first hand experience with the way modern homes are built.
So your "first hand experience with the way modern homes are built" is based on your parents building their own home when you were 8 years old- that's impressive. Mine is based on having a bachelors degree in construction management and over 25 years of experience in the residential and commercial construction industry. My dad changed his own oil and did his own tuneups when I was 8, but I don't consider that as giving me "first hand experience in the automotive industry".....


Quote:
Originally Posted by bryantm3 View Post
that's why hurricane andrew blew them all away. in the 90s they enacted more stringent building standards in florida, now they're starting to back down on them due to cost.
So Andrew blew homes away because they were built with plywood and drywall? No, actually, Andrew blew roofs off because the codes never addressed the wall-to-roof connections in a diaphragm roof system, and Andrew served as nature's testing lab, allowing that issue to be addressed in the updated codes. Plenty of older homes had the same issue in past hurricanes- the news coverage wasn't good enough at the time to make it a "national issue" though, so it never got the attention that it got when it happened in the 90's- that attention is what ended up getting the codes changed.

And if you think they're "backing down due to cost" with the building codes, you're sorely mistaken. The newest edition of the codes are being adopted in most areas as we speak, and they're only getting more stringent. We do plenty of work in South Florida, and the newest codes have much stronger requirements for wind resistance than previous editions.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bryantm3 View Post

if you don't believe me, go in any home built since the late 60s and kick the wall. i'll guarantee you'll knock a pretty sizable hole in it. kick a little bit harder and you might have a new window.

homes are built shoddily today. before the late 60s, every wall was solid, including interior walls, either with brick and mortar or a poured in material, covered by wooden slats and coated in plaster. try and kick that, you'll get a broken toe.

There's an easy solution to that issue- don't run around kicking walls. If that's really an issue for you, maybe you should install steel plate behind the drywall in your walls.

Regarding wall construction, drywall actually came into common use in the late 40's/early 50's, during the building boom that started after WWII. Before it's use, interior walls were wood framed, with lath and plaster over the wood framing. I'm not sure where you get the idea that "every wall" was brick and mortar or a "poured in material" (not sure what you might be referring to there...)- brick construction wasn't all that common, especially for interior walls of homes.

BTW- if lath and plaster is such a marvelous system, perhaps you can explain why every major renovation of an older home (other than historic preservation projects) starts with demolishing all the lath and plaster, and ends with installing drywall over both the new and the existing walls?? Maybe it's so they can tear out the lead pipe, knob and tube wiring and asbestos pipe insulation, repair all the rotted framing material, change out the inefficient, leaky windows, and install some insulation??

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryantm3 View Post

a less destructive method— stand on the first floor and jump up and down a few times and see how much stuff falls off the walls and shelves, even on the second floor.
I dunno- I've got two kids that do a pretty good job of running around our house like lunatics, and I've never had anything fall off the walls. I can tell you stories about old homes with floors that are 2" out of level because of sill plates that were placed directly on dirt, floors that squeak like crazy because they were nailed down instead of being glued and screwed, and roofs that looked like swayback mares because they were framed with 2x4's and no collar ties, though....

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryantm3 View Post
have you noticed the way they build skyscrapers today? you won't see plywood and drywall going up over the skyline because if they built them out of that cheap stuff, even with steel support girders, the whole thing would collapse and kill everyone. they don't use brick and mortar anymore because of the cost— but they used to build skyscrapers in the method i described above that are still standing solidly today.
Hmmmm.....yup- they don't use plywood and drywall on skyscrapers because it's "cheap stuff"- that's the reason......

Actually, interior walls in pretty much every building today are drywall, and plywood isn't used because it isn't needed- plywood sheathing on a house is used to provide lateral racking resistance to a wall or floor system, which is achieved by the steel or concrete frame on a high-rise building.

And the "skyscrapers" built "in the method i described above that are still standing solidly today" were not built in the method you described at all. Any building over about 4 stories has a structural frame of either concrete or steel, and the brick facade that you see is simply infill between the framing members. In the old days those walls were multiple layers of brick or terracotta, because that was the only material available at the time- today those walls are typically metal stud with gypsum sheathing and a veneer of brick, stone, stucco, or metal. Take a look at the new hotels being built in Midtown and you'll see what I'm talking about.

Anyway- what does this have to do with the inner city growing faster than the suburbs???
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Old 07-03-2012, 06:39 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
22,164 posts, read 16,163,004 times
Reputation: 4894
The northern, close-in suburbs of East and Central Cobb, North Fulton, and North Gwinnett will be fine as they are close to high paying jobs, for now. But if the Millenials do not move to the suburbs in droves, as predicted, the jobs will start returning to the city center and edge cities. The suburbs listed above are in great location if this happens. Its the exurbs that are in danger, eg: Cherokee County, South Forsyth and Hall Counties, Rockdale County, Henry County, Fayette County, and Northern Cobb County. Fayette County not so much as many people live there and work near the airport. But the far-flung suburbs will feel the effect IF jobs start to move back to the city. That is why GDOT needs to start planning for a commuter rail system that will prevent the failure of exurbs.
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Old 07-03-2012, 06:53 AM
 
9,124 posts, read 32,110,748 times
Reputation: 3519
Meh- the exurbs won't see the crazy growth that they've seen in the past, but they're not going to wither away because "jobs start to move back to the city". There are already plenty of jobs that are in the city, and people live in the exurbs just fine.
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Old 07-03-2012, 06:58 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
22,164 posts, read 16,163,004 times
Reputation: 4894
Quote:
Meh- the exurbs won't see the crazy growth that they've seen in the past, but they're not going to wither away because "jobs start to move back to the city". There are already plenty of jobs that are in the city, and people live in the exurbs just fine.
I said IF. That's why I put in CAPS so old home builders can read the IF part.
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:03 AM
 
1,250 posts, read 1,487,979 times
Reputation: 409
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlwarrior View Post
Yes downtown Atlanta it Awesome, why live anywhere outside of 285 and deal with stupid traffic. Atlanta is sitting pretty especially with the beltline project and development. I love living downtown and not dealing with traffic.
trololol.
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:27 AM
 
7,698 posts, read 9,537,430 times
Reputation: 5667
I think people are forgetting some very important things.

The assumption is that if jobs move back into the city, certain areas will suffer because commuting will be too difficult.

However, that's assuming everything else stays as it is. Which it won't.

As we move to a more 24 hour society, alternative working hours will become even more common. It's relatively easy to get around the metro area so long as you aren't doing it during peak commute times. Working from home will probably also increase in popularity. So you will still see people choosing to live where they do and not worrying about proximity to work so much.
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:34 AM
JPD
 
11,866 posts, read 14,471,844 times
Reputation: 7541
Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL View Post
I think people are forgetting some very important things.

The assumption is that if jobs move back into the city, certain areas will suffer because commuting will be too difficult.

However, that's assuming everything else stays as it is. Which it won't.

As we move to a more 24 hour society, alternative working hours will become even more common. It's relatively easy to get around the metro area so long as you aren't doing it during peak commute times. Working from home will probably also increase in popularity. So you will still see people choosing to live where they do and not worrying about proximity to work so much.
We don't seem to be moving towards a 24 hour society here in the Metro Atlanta area. Quite the opposite, actually. What am I missing?
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:54 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
22,164 posts, read 16,163,004 times
Reputation: 4894
Quote:
We don't seem to be moving towards a 24 hour society here in the Metro Atlanta area. Quite the opposite, actually. What am I missing?
There is no way my employer would allow us to work from home for a long time. How else can they keep tabs on what we are doing?
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Old 07-03-2012, 10:23 AM
 
Location: Mableton, GA USA (NW Atlanta suburb, 4 miles OTP)
11,319 posts, read 21,901,972 times
Reputation: 3848
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlwarrior View Post
Yes downtown Atlanta it Awesome, why live anywhere outside of 285 and deal with stupid traffic. Atlanta is sitting pretty especially with the beltline project and development. I love living downtown and not dealing with traffic.
Many people outside of 285 don't have to deal with traffic. Many do, or course, but it's hardly a given.
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