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I'm not attacking you dear. It just seems MARTA needs to be more focused on providing better transit service than sandwiches and electronics. And more revenue means nothing if it's not being used to that end.
With what money??? The money they're about to get from the TSPLOST? Oh wait....
You must mean the money they get from the state of Georgia? Oh wait....
Can't provide better transit service if no one is trying to pay for it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cqholt
Five Points is not rough. There are no homeless in the station that did not pay the fare. That station is crawling with MARTA police and MARTA officials. My wife rides the train by herself, transferring at Five Points, and she never gets scared.
Have you been to other cities transit systems?
No they haven't. I'm a little ashamed of myself because I used to look down on the conditions of MARTA. Then I visited Chicago: Their stations are and trains were TERRIBLE, old, cramped, smelly. Then I visited D.C.: I was so shocked to see HOMELESS PEOPLE SLEEPING AND ASKING FOR MONEY AT THE ENTRANCE TO MCPHERSON STREET STATION 2 BLOCKS FROM THE WHITE HOUSE! I swear some of the people that dog MARTA out would have passed if they'd seen that! I've never been to NYC, but I've heard stories about their subway and the way people talk about MARTA and homelessness/sketchy people in this forum, they wouldn't ride it no matter how extensive it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by readyset
I often wonder with the posts in the Atlanta forum if some of these people have ever been outside the state of Georgia. "Marta mismanages funds" etc etc where does this come from? These people obviously haven't been to or read up on whats going on at the transit agencies in other cities. $2.50 for where ever you want to go? I could only wish D.C. metro was that cheap! Or the hunting and targeting practice that San Fransico's BART police do on innocent patrons, killed for no reason.
They're just repeating what they see others say. MARTA barely has any funds to mismanage! D.C. metro is WAY more expensive and honestly, I had to get help to even figure out how much to pay lol.
've never been to NYC, but I've heard stories about their subway and the way people talk about MARTA and homelessness/sketchy people in this forum, they wouldn't ride it no matter how extensive it is.
I'll be going in 3 weeks, so I'll let you know. Pictures of stations, cars, and weirdos will be posted to compare to MARTA.
Seems like the biggest difference isn't the different agencies around the country, it's the people and the culture of the cities. Atlanta does not have a transit culture. They have a car culture. It's the south and there is a stigma about taking the train for most people in Atlanta. In cities like DC and NYC, everyone and anyone takes the train. It's just apart of living in the city. If they don't take the train, they ride bikes or walk. Many take a taxi or town car to get around too. People just walk past homeless people in major cities like DC or NYC. It's just apart of living in the city. When people living in the south drop the stigma associated with mass transit and the racial stigma many times associated with mass transit, people in the south will be fine taking transit with everyone else.
The catch 22 is in the south, there is an entitlement to not have to pay for anything. This TSPLOST is the perfect example. People hate taxes in the south being a republican stronghold, so the progressive residents that do live there can never get anything done. Nothing is free. If Atlanta wants a system large as DC, they better get ready to pay DC fares. One of the main reasons Marta will never be able to charge that much is because parking is so cheap and even free from many employers. That is a transit killer. That is one of the fundamental flaws with Baltimore also. Parking is too cheap. There is no incentive to take the train. Make driving an inconvience, make parking expensive, build high density, and people will switch modes. It's the reason every major transit system has high ridership. Those are the things Atlanta must fix first. I don't think there is anything the city can do about the state government not allowing Marta to spend their money how they want. That is the people talking unfortunately. The politicians are voted into office.
MD All Star I think u are right . Those from the north are so used to seeing that type of environment like 5 points so it really doesn't bother them.. Its the people who have never experienced that kinda environment that have a problem and are scared for dear life..
Of course you can also find someone in the NYC metro is wouldn't take the train too. Many have embraced the train but agree many have not.
Regarding the state not allowing Marta to spend how they want - What I don't follow is Marta was to get something like $700 million for capital repairs/improvements. If 50% of their revenue is already set aside for this purpose by state law why is it they need the funds from another source. Is it for operations or capital that they need funding help more?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar
Seems like the biggest difference isn't the different agencies around the country, it's the people and the culture of the cities. Atlanta does not have a transit culture. They have a car culture. It's the south and there is a stigma about taking the train for most people in Atlanta. In cities like DC and NYC, everyone and anyone takes the train. It's just apart of living in the city. If they don't take the train, they ride bikes or walk. Many take a taxi or town car to get around too. People just walk past homeless people in major cities like DC or NYC. It's just apart of living in the city. When people living in the south drop the stigma associated with mass transit and the racial stigma many times associated with mass transit, people in the south will be fine taking transit with everyone else.
The catch 22 is in the south, there is an entitlement to not have to pay for anything. This TSPLOST is the perfect example. People hate taxes in the south being a republican stronghold, so the progressive residents that do live there can never get anything done. Nothing is free. If Atlanta wants a system large as DC, they better get ready to pay DC fares. One of the main reasons Marta will never be able to charge that much is because parking is so cheap and even free from many employers. That is a transit killer. That is one of the fundamental flaws with Baltimore also. Parking is too cheap. There is no incentive to take the train. Make driving an inconvience, make parking expensive, build high density, and people will switch modes. It's the reason every major transit system has high ridership. Those are the things Atlanta must fix first. I don't think there is anything the city can do about the state government not allowing Marta to spend their money how they want. That is the people talking unfortunately. The politicians are voted into office.
Of course you can also find someone in the NYC metro is wouldn't take the train too. Many have embraced the train but agree many have not.
Regarding the state not allowing Marta to spend how they want - What I don't follow is Marta was to get something like $700 million for capital repairs/improvements. If 50% of their revenue is already set aside for this purpose by state law why is it they need the funds from another source. Is it for operations or capital that they need funding help more?
Yes, there are people in NYC and DC that won't take public transit too. They often choose to bike, walk, take a taxi or town car, or they have their own vehicle. The issue is mode change. Everyone doesn't have to take the train etc. There has to be a balance though. Granted, a city like DC and New York could not function without their respective subway systems with DC having over 1 million daily riders a day and NYC having an astronomical 8 million daily riders. Only about 3 cities in America are built with such a large core and concentrated job base like those cities so most cities get along just fine without a massive subway system. But, a major city with high density can't function without an extensive subway system. It's the only way to provide efficient transportation around a city. People in the northeast cities especially NYC and DC don't have the stigma most American cities have for mass transit which explains their high ridership. I don't really know how you can combate that stigma in America. If we every figure out how to combate that stigma, America will be a different place.
As for Marta funding, I don't really know what their money is spent on once split 50/50. I'm sure you could find out though.
Seems like the biggest difference isn't the different agencies around the country, it's the people and the culture of the cities. Atlanta does not have a transit culture. They have a car culture. It's the south and there is a stigma about taking the train for most people in Atlanta.
That's actually not correct.
If you look at the areas of Atlanta that have reasonable access to rail, that's a population of around 750,000. The train has 260,000 riders a day. Not bad at all! (Another 250,000 take the bus but let's stick with rail).
The issue isn't any sort of negative stigma about riding trains. Just hop aboard and you'll see riders from all demographics and all walks of life. The issue is simply that the system is still fairly limited in scope. As it fills in with additions such as the Clilfton Corridor, the Beltline and the streetcar, ridership will increase even more. There's also a synergistic effect. As more routes come online, access, connectivity and the number of destinations all go up exponentially.
The key factor for rail usage is its availability -- can you easily get to it, and will it take you where you want to go? That's why rail ridership in Atlanta is high in areas that are well served. It's the same in DC and NYC.
Seems like the biggest difference isn't the different agencies around the country, it's the people and the culture of the cities. Atlanta does not have a transit culture. They have a car culture. It's the south and there is a stigma about taking the train for most people in Atlanta. In cities like DC and NYC, everyone and anyone takes the train. It's just apart of living in the city. If they don't take the train, they ride bikes or walk. Many take a taxi or town car to get around too. People just walk past homeless people in major cities like DC or NYC. It's just apart of living in the city. When people living in the south drop the stigma associated with mass transit and the racial stigma many times associated with mass transit, people in the south will be fine taking transit with everyone else.
Such is an unfortunate consequence of the way we live our lives. And you're right, seems like some of us hate the symptoms but not the underlying causes.
Quote:
The catch 22 is in the south, there is an entitlement to not have to pay for anything. This TSPLOST is the perfect example. People hate taxes in the south being a republican stronghold, so the progressive residents that do live there can never get anything done. Nothing is free. If Atlanta wants a system large as DC, they better get ready to pay DC fares. One of the main reasons Marta will never be able to charge that much is because parking is so cheap and even free from many employers. That is a transit killer. That is one of the fundamental flaws with Baltimore also. Parking is too cheap. There is no incentive to take the train. Make driving an inconvience, make parking expensive, build high density, and people will switch modes. It's the reason every major transit system has high ridership. Those are the things Atlanta must fix first. I don't think there is anything the city can do about the state government not allowing Marta to spend their money how they want. That is the people talking unfortunately. The politicians are voted into office.
Don't even get me started. When I overheard some people describe the TSPLOST as a "stimulus," and they were going to vote it down primarily for that, I knew it was doomed. I would suggest that they add Jared Diamond's Collapse: How Societies Choose to Fail or Succeed to their reading list.
you are looking to hard into this. There are even worse sketchy people in the NY subway stations with the God awful smell during the summers but it doesn't stop anyone from buying things from the concession stands there. Oh I forgot its NY so they are excused. This is just going to ad a service for those who want a quick snack paper magazine or Gum.. As far as where the money is going to go then maybe you should email some of the Marta Officials to get those answers. Because the article isnt very detailed.
Doesn't NYC allow street performers at stations? I saw one guy playing his cello, for money, at Peachtree Center, and MARTA police escorted him out. Not sure if he was charged with anything. Shame though, the guy was entertaining.
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I swear some of the people that dog MARTA out would have passed if they'd seen that! I've never been to NYC, but I've heard stories about their subway and the way people talk about MARTA and homelessness/sketchy people in this forum, they wouldn't ride it no matter how extensive it is.
