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Old 10-27-2012, 06:09 PM
Location: Atlanta, GA (Dunwoody)
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Old 10-27-2012, 08:46 PM
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Thank you, Roslyn. That photo should lay any doubts to rest.
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Old 10-27-2012, 09:14 PM
Location: Atlanta, GA (Dunwoody)
2,047 posts, read 3,880,847 times
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Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
Thank you, Roslyn. That photo should lay any doubts to rest.
I'm such a giver.
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Old 10-28-2012, 08:41 PM
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Good post, Residing.

Originally Posted by residinghere2007 View Post
But the state would not have the power. The parents would. That is the point. I don't see how telling all people in this state that they have the option of sending their kids to whatever school they want to send them to, no matter the county/district/locale is going to make the "good ole boys" network any bigger.

Also, I am middle class but I live in the ghetto. I grew up around a lot of different people and I am also black. I LOVE black people and I agree with a lot of the things you said in your inital post after mine in regards to young black men.

My nephew is poor. His mom is a slob and very "into" herself. My brother, his dad, has a lot of issues that were his own doing, he loves his kids but isn't responsible for them and neither of them look out for their children's best interest. In a lot of ways, my own mom I don't think went out of her way to provide me with the many opportunities I could have taken advantage of being a little black, nappy headed, highly intelligent girl. Teachers/administrators in my average schools in the inner city where I am from did recognize my intelligence and made my mom aware and I was in the TAG program from K-12 and did AP classes and all that jazz. But I know that I could have achieved more and done more if I had been provided more academically. I don't regret any of my choices, and like I said, I am solidly middle class in income right now, but there is always room for improvement. I also grew up in the 80s and was a teen in the 90s. I want more for my kids than what I had. I can admit (which is hard for us people who were TAG kids as I have a few friends still from my TAG days and I keep up with them) that my son is not gifted like I was. But that doesn't mean that he should not have to put up with a bunch of mess from administrators or that he should have to sit in a class where teachers teach to "the middle" and don't challenge him academically.

As a black man, you should know our black boys are failing. They are failing in situations that you went through. More failed back then than they do now. Most of the black men, former childhood friends and cousins of mine when I was a child did not turn out all that great. Many of them quit school. There was a criminal element in one side of my family and most of my male cousins and uncles on that side are in jail. One of my brothers recently got out of jail a couple years ago after spending 6 years there for drug trafficking. I know what "the school of hard knocks" is. My dad used to tell me that he went to the "University of Street Life" lol. So I know all about that. My dad is a high school drop out. My older brother (my dad's oldest son, we don't have the same mom) was a middle school drop out, he grew up in the 80s/90s as well. My 2nd oldest brother did graduate (we have the same mom) but he dropped out of college and works in factories and spends most of his time getting high on weed and drinking. He isn't a deep drug addict, but he is enough of one that it has thrown his life off course. He also is always talking about "being tough" similar to what it seems you spoke of about your hard knocks. He wants the best for his kids but thinks that his own life style is good enough for them, he has very highly intelligent children. Both his boys are much smarter than what I was as a TAG child. They have many more opportunities available to them due to school choice. My poor 14 year old nephew was sought after by the school he goes to. He gets excellent grades and is very involved in school. His dad, my brother who smokes weed and drinks a lot, also wanted to go to the same school when we were teens before he got off track. Our family could not afford to send him so he went to our neighborhood high school. I am certain that if he had gone to that school he would be better off today as he was also very smart as a child and talented and he still is but doesn't think he can do anything more now that he is in his 30s, he thinks his time has passed. Times change and change is for the better. Why should we continue to let our boys suffer so that their dad's can claim some sort of macho attitude about how tough their son's are. That is failing our kids. They can do better if we demand that they do better and if we do better as their parents and if we demand that the teachers/administrators and the state that takes our money via taxes provides us with the opportunity to send our bright kids to great schools.

As someone who grew up in the ghetto and who still lives in the ghetto, I can say from experience that most of the kids I grew up with and who I know now, who are little black boys and girls are VERY bright. Most of them have good parents who just happen to be poor. It seems here on this forum poor neighborhoods get a bad rap but from my experience, poor people work way harder for way less money than middle or upper income people. Most of the people in my neighborhood who work, have much tougher jobs and put up with way more crap than I have to deal with in my career. They may be ignorant in regards to what is out there for their kids, but most want their kids to do better than them and they want them to have the best. Even my mom wanted me to have the best and she did the best she could with what she knew, but she was ignorant in regards to other programs and opportunities I could have had as a child. My counselors didn't give me info on things that I found out later, I could have benefitted from like full ride scholarships to boarding/prep schools as many top prep schools in the nation will give any kid accepted a free ride if they are in a certain percentile. I was in the 99th percentileSchool choice provides parents with info and takes them out of their ignorance in these situations. They can see that kid is just as capable as another as long as their kid does the work required.

I don't think anything about your high school experience or rearing was "despicable." I grew up probably the same way. I also had a lot of hard knocks experiences that I won't get into that I had to navigate as a child mostly in regards to the criminal side of my family. But I am just a positive person, I always look at life optimistically and I always am looking at "getting better" and not staying the same. I have some nostalgic feelings about my high school, the people I knew then, the things we did, how much fun we had, but my experience is mine and I don't want it for my kids or other people's kids. We need to do everything we can to give our kids a better opportunity.

I also agree with the above. This was not a racially charged thread until you made those comments.

Also, we actually had street gangs in my school in high school, there were gang fights and we even had a riot once where swat teams came in and they shut down the school and arrested about 50 people involved in a fight. We had some obnoxious kids in the classroom. Every class room has obnoxious kids.

The culture I am speaking of that needs to be addressed in many traditional schools is one of "getting by" or teaching to the middle. We need to address the needs of ALL children and with all the technology and research we have on learning styles and teaching methods and statistical markers for kids who may drop out of school - there is just no reason why we should not use the information we have to either 1- better our traditional schools or 2-create new schools and let the families decide where to send their kids. I honestly do think school choice could work in GA. But I think that people are too pessimistic about it and have a defeatist attitude. There are those also with an elitist attitude in that they don't want certain kids from certain demographics or income classes to come to their school because "they paid" to get into that neighborhood to go to that school.

We can even get back to Grady where someone earlier in this thread said that it was unfair for people out of the district to come in when they had no part in making the school great. To me that is laughable since it well known that Atlanta is more of a transient city and so I would bet the large majority of the students at Grady are from families who have no history with that school and moved to the neighborhood to take advantage of the school. They have the money to do so. Yet, you have children who have roots in Atlanta going back generations who are black or poor who you don't want to go there. It is really strange and interesting to me. Maybe it is a Georgia or southern thing. I find it odd that GA is a republican state and that republicans usually are for school choice, yet there isn't much school choice in many southern states at all.
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Old 10-28-2012, 08:47 PM
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Reputation: 1426
I just don't see the "let the kids stay in the failing school while they are fixed" being a viable option...for the kids in the failing schools. How is that helping the kids that are in the schools WHILE THEY ARE BEING FIXED? I am not jumping on you. Moreso posing this question to the idea that is raised (no matter who puts forth this position). Are there any actual parents of kids IN FAILING SCHOOLS who WANT them to stay in the failing schools while they are fixed -- or is this idea really one posited by people who don't have kids who would fail along with the school? Is there really any skin in the game (posed to those who want the kids to be stuck in the failing schools) or is it just a hypothetical viewpoint that does not affect YOUR kids? (Assuming you have kids.) Again, not directed to you specifically, AcidSnake.

Originally Posted by AcidSnake View Post
As a response to the thread being taken in a different direction all I can say is this:

1. Many conservative-minded parents often wish that children who bus to their schools from other neighborhoods would stay in their neighborhoods and fix them themselves. I actually agree with them(the conservative-minded parents) on this one. School-bussing in my opinion actually avoids the issue of failed schools.

2. I don't mind compromising on the State Charter Commission issue provided that this potentially new agency is an elected agency.

Given my willingness to compromise in these areas I would've expect many people to say, "golly gee willikers AcidSnake, you are actually a reasonable person". One would think, anyways.

But for whatever reason, people will find cause to jump on me anyways...simply because I don't say things the way they want me to say things. What can I say?

I simply bring out the "fighter" in folks!
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