Racial relations in Atlanta (Marietta, Fayetteville: upper-class, best city, sales)

[lukeache]

Can anybody give me a simplistic view of racial relations(Blacks/White) in Atlanta and suburbs? The reason why I am asking is because I have felt a lot of this tension even here as I was reading some threads. It seems Blacks and Whites have drastically different experiences living in Atlanta.

[nrgpill]

Some tension is good in my opinion because it shows that people care enough to confront the issue and express opinions on these forums. But things quickly get out of control when people show blind allegiance to their political party, religion, and social circle. See the Grady Hospital saga for what can be summed up as racial relations in Atlanta.

[pirate_lafitte]

Originally Posted by lukeache

Can anybody give me a simplistic view of racial relations(Blacks/White) in Atlanta and suburbs? The reason why I am asking is because I have felt a lot of this tension even here as I was reading some threads. It seems Blacks and Whites have drastically different experiences living in Atlanta.

I have lived in the metro Atlanta area for a decade(moved here in February 1996). I first lived in Marietta. Where I lived was very diverse(one of my best friends came from Poland) and racial animosity was almost unknown to me. Ironically that was the first time I was ever called the "n" word and it was by a kid from Chicago.
I moved to Paulding County later on and that was the first time I ever experienced being the only black person in my homeroom class. It was a culture shock for me(this was 1997). It has here that I did find alot of racial tensions. I was called racial slurs in Paulding County and other problems occured. High school was the main time I saw racial tensions get really bad. The blacks and the whites would often sit separately during lunch(by choice) and in some cases there were fights that were racial. It was on both ends. Many of the blacks didn't want to be around the whites and many of the whites didn't want to be around the blacks. It was both ways. And being the type of black kid who didn't fit the stereotype that I was expected to fit, I ran into some tension there on both ends. Some of the blacks didn't think I was "black enough" and some of white kids would make references to Carlton about me.
My experience is that Atlanta is a city that is touted as "the best city for blacks" because alot of upper class blacks are moving here. That is the reason. From what I see and here, many of the blacks who move to Atlanta(not all though) come here so that they can live in the mega-mansions without moving to white neighborhoods. One woman even stated on TV that she and her husband moved to Atlanta from Detroit so that she could live near the Starbucks and have all of the upper-class trappings and live in the subdivisions with 1/2million dollar and million dollar homes and be all-black.
There are racial tensions in Atlanta. They aren't publicized like they are in other big cities, but it happens here too. There places in Atlanta that are integrated and places that are segregated. The racial tensions here are hidden. Police brutality? It exists, but few people complain about it here. Atlanta is a city that likes to pretend. Our motto is "A city too busy to hate". No place is too busy to hate. Atlanta has had the "white flight" just as any other city has. The difference is that alot of whites moved to the northern suburbs and alot of blacks went to the eastern and southern suburbs. Chances are a klan rally wouldn't likely occur in Atlanta proper because they would be run out of town for obvious reasons. Chances are you can find a place that is integrated and civilized. I have a friend from Fayetteville and he said black and whites get along okay there. But likely, there is alot of hidden stuff and when hidden stuff comes out, alot of people will say "I'm not racist". On the whole, the city of Atlanta is about as segregated as LA or Chicago. The difference is that those cities have had more ethnic groups moving into those places for a longer time. Atlanta is just getting up there.
I can't give a simplistic view because race relations are complicated.

[rcsteiner]

Originally Posted by lukeache

Can anybody give me a simplistic view of racial relations(Blacks/White) in Atlanta and suburbs?

Some racial tension exists, sometimes for very good reasons, and sometimes for no other reason than the people involved being closed-minded idiots.

As others have mentioned in other threads, Atlanta has a lot of self-segregated areas which are predominantly black or predominantly white, and I suspect that the feeling one gets on those areas depends to some extent on your own race and background.

Thankfully, there are also areas like where I live where most folks are middle class professionals, the area has a mix of different people living in it, and the tension is at least a little more hidden. I'm sure it's there, but to this point it hasn't been an issue for my wife and I or for our neighbors (at least that I'm aware of).

[pirate_lafitte]

Originally Posted by rcsteiner

Some racial tension exists, sometimes for very good reasons, and sometimes for no other reason than the people involved being closed-minded idiots.

As others have mentioned in other threads, Atlanta has a lot of self-segregated areas which are predominantly black or predominantly white, and I suspect that the feeling one gets on those areas depends to some extent on your own race and background.

Thankfully, there are also areas like where I live where most folks are middle class professionals, the area has a mix of different people living in it, and the tension is at least a little more hidden. I'm sure it's there, but to this point it hasn't been an issue for my wife and I or for our neighbors (at least that I'm aware of).

Well put!!!

[pirate_lafitte]

Another factor is that Atlanta is a major hub. While racial tensions are there, there is a "behave because the world's eyes are on you" atitude. Few people will ever admit this, but Atlanta did have a riot during the 1960's. Most persons I talk to about Atlanta won't say or admit that, so it has been largely forgotten. Attitudes are hidden because no one wants to make Atlanta look bad. Milwaukee, on the other hand, is a relatively poor city and racial tensions, however exaggerated they may be, are there too. The difference is that Milwaukee is poorer and has less going for it and the world's eyes aren't on it, so there is more of a rawness in the tensions.

[backfist]

Originally Posted by pirate_lafitte

... Most persons I talk to about Atlanta won't say or admit that, so it has been largely forgotten. Attitudes are hidden because no one wants to make Atlanta look bad. Milwaukee, on the other hand, is a relatively poor city and racial tensions, however exaggerated they may be, are there too. The difference is that Milwaukee is poorer and has less going for it and the world's eyes aren't on it, so there is more of a rawness in the tensions.

Like most relationships, nothing gets better unless and until all involved have thorough, deep and honest dialogue about the problems. And no problem can be solved without acknowledging and accepting responsibility for the source of it. Nobody will look good, and some will look more villainous than others. But it's something that must be done in order to have a harmonious and healthy relationship.

[atlantagreg30127]

Originally Posted by pirate_lafitte

Few people will ever admit this, but Atlanta did have a riot during the 1960's. Most persons I talk to about Atlanta won't say or admit that, so it has been largely forgotten. Attitudes are hidden because no one wants to make Atlanta look bad. .

Ok, I've been here 23 years and there is one thing regarding race relations, and how in SOME ways they got WORSE, and know what I'm talking about. This is a view coming from a white man, as well as a couple of Korean folks I work with when this topic has come up several times over time at work...

Remember Rodney King?

Ok, back when the jerko cops did their number on Rodney King, the entire world was pretty much focused on one place - L.A. The riots there were crazy, they started torching neighborhoods, and when they pulled the white guy out of the semi truck and started bashing his head with bricks, the media never once left the L.A. area. What was not (at that time) shown was how Atlanta had the second highest amount of damage due to riots at the same time.

We didn't have the arson events, or one quite as bad as the truck driver in L.A., but there were numerous "events" that happened downtown near the Underground area, windows broken out of stores where the Macys building is on Peachtree, looting, and there were several physical attacks on white and Asian people - most heavily around the CNN Center, and at a couple of convenience/bottle stores owned by Koreans. The only major event shown live on local TV were dozens of people (mostly black teens) who broke into and raided a Korean-owned store, and we watched the owners and family escape to the roof, where police showed up and chased everyone away. A couple of radio stations reported that people had called in to say that in stores, when they showed the semi driver getting beaten in L.A., that groups of black patrons were making comments in a negative way such as "payback" and "yeah get 'em".

A few days later, the news reported that sales of handguns in the area had increase by up to FIVE TIMES the normal rate. The buyers? White women first, followed by white men, and then by Asian men and women. I actually knew a woman who was assaulted by two teens as she left the CNN MARTA station but almost immediately a security guard came to her aid. She was one of the people who bought a gun. I can honestly say that I really do think that for a short time after those riots, that a measurable percentage of downtown white and Asian workers were packing guns, mace, or SOME type of weapon. Scary. If there had been any more incidences I have no doubt there would have been lots of injuries due to overly freaked out trigger happy suburbanites shooting rounds down there.

Ok, long one, sorry, but I had to set up the "history", because until that time I actually thought that overall the race relations in Atlanta were pretty good considering it's a large city. After the Rodney King bit, there was a very and I mean VERY intense "feel" in the air - many in the white and Asian communities were very tense towards blacks - especially the younger black male crowd. I honestly don't think that 100% of that tension every really completely went away. Not totally. People who were here then remember.

Likewise, when large numbers of black people in workplaces cheered OJ Simpson when he was running from the cops, and more recently when everyone did the "Michael Vick is a victim" thing, that too hasn't exactly helped relations either, although those pale in comparison to the Rodney King event. The closest reverse-incident we've had was last year when police raided a home of an elderly women (who was black) and shot her to death thinking they were raiding a drug home. But I'm not sure you could call that specifically a racial incident because some of the officers involved were black, and the police chief who approved it here is also black - it involved more just complete idiot handing of something more than race.

So just like pirate said above - I too think there are A LOT of things besides 60s riots that people here simply do not talk about, or express... but I think the "tension" is still very much there from these past events. The blacks do not trust the police or white politicians who they feel are racist at heart, and the whites do not trust any young black person they see, and feel the black politicians play favorites to only black people. It's there and it's real, but unlike some other areas of the country (and world), people here tend not to verbally or even physically express this tension (thankfully).

Does this mean that EVERY white, Asian, and black person mistrusts EVERYONE else of the "other" race? No, not at all. There are plenty of success stories too, but I'm just laying it on the line that it DOES exist here for anyone who believes the very inaccurate rumor that Atlanta is a Kum-ba-yah racial paradise where everyone lives in harmony. It's just more quiet is all.

Ok. I'm done.

[pirate_lafitte]

Originally Posted by atlantagreg30127

Ok, I've been here 23 years and there is one thing regarding race relations, and how in SOME ways they got WORSE, and know what I'm talking about. This is a view coming from a white man, as well as a couple of Korean folks I work with when this topic has come up several times over time at work...

Remember Rodney King?

Ok, back when the jerko cops did their number on Rodney King, the entire world was pretty much focused on one place - L.A. The riots there were crazy, they started torching neighborhoods, and when they pulled the white guy out of the semi truck and started bashing his head with bricks, the media never once left the L.A. area. What was not (at that time) shown was how Atlanta had the second highest amount of damage due to riots at the same time.

We didn't have the arson events, or one quite as bad as the truck driver in L.A., but there were numerous "events" that happened downtown near the Underground area, windows broken out of stores where the Macys building is on Peachtree, looting, and there were several physical attacks on white and Asian people - most heavily around the CNN Center, and at a couple of convenience/bottle stores owned by Koreans. The only major event shown live on local TV were dozens of people (mostly black teens) who broke into and raided a Korean-owned store, and we watched the owners and family escape to the roof, where police showed up and chased everyone away. A couple of radio stations reported that people had called in to say that in stores, when they showed the semi driver getting beaten in L.A., that groups of black patrons were making comments in a negative way such as "payback" and "yeah get 'em".

A few days later, the news reported that sales of handguns in the area had increase by up to FIVE TIMES the normal rate. The buyers? White women first, followed by white men, and then by Asian men and women. I actually knew a woman who was assaulted by two teens as she left the CNN MARTA station but almost immediately a security guard came to her aid. She was one of the people who bought a gun. I can honestly say that I really do think that for a short time after those riots, that a measurable percentage of downtown white and Asian workers were packing guns, mace, or SOME type of weapon. Scary. If there had been any more incidences I have no doubt there would have been lots of injuries due to overly freaked out trigger happy suburbanites shooting rounds down there.

Ok, long one, sorry, but I had to set up the "history", because until that time I actually thought that overall the race relations in Atlanta were pretty good considering it's a large city. After the Rodney King bit, there was a very and I mean VERY intense "feel" in the air - many in the white and Asian communities were very tense towards blacks - especially the younger black male crowd. I honestly don't think that 100% of that tension every really completely went away. Not totally. People who were here then remember.

Likewise, when large numbers of black people in workplaces cheered OJ Simpson when he was running from the cops, and more recently when everyone did the "Michael Vick is a victim" thing, that too hasn't exactly helped relations either, although those pale in comparison to the Rodney King event. The closest reverse-incident we've had was last year when police raided a home of an elderly women (who was black) and shot her to death thinking they were raiding a drug home. But I'm not sure you could call that specifically a racial incident because some of the officers involved were black, and the police chief who approved it here is also black - it involved more just complete idiot handing of something more than race.

So just like pirate said above - I too think there are A LOT of things besides 60s riots that people here simply do not talk about, or express... but I think the "tension" is still very much there from these past events. The blacks do not trust the police or white politicians who they feel are racist at heart, and the whites do not trust any young black person they see, and feel the black politicians play favorites to only black people. It's there and it's real, but unlike some other areas of the country (and world), people here tend not to verbally or even physically express this tension (thankfully).

Does this mean that EVERY white, Asian, and black person mistrusts EVERYONE else of the "other" race? No, not at all. There are plenty of success stories too, but I'm just laying it on the line that it DOES exist here for anyone who believes the very inaccurate rumor that Atlanta is a Kum-ba-yah racial paradise where everyone lives in harmony. It's just more quiet is all.

Ok. I'm done.

Wow. I couldn't have put it much better. I agree that Atlanta isn't some "racial paradise" where everyone lives in harmony. There are tensions in Atlanta. I think the reason for the quietness is more of an image issue. No one wants to come of as racist, especially with Atlanta being in the South and everyone's eyes on the South, especially Atlanta, since it is a major hub for transportation and business. If all of that business left and if Delta left, alot of middle to middle-upper class people would leave. Look at Detroit. Detroit is in a similar fix that Atlanta is in. Maybe Atlanta didn't have as much blood in the streets as Detroit did during the 60's, but many people talk about Detroit being segregated. Well, it is, but no more than Atlanta. The difference is that Atlanta is economically stable and there are jobs down here. What does Detroit have going for itself? Nothing. GM and Ford have been cutting jobs for years. Detroit is poorer and there is no demand to move there. For that reason, racial tensions are so easy to see and they are magnified that much more due to other problems. Detroit can't hide anything. Atlanta can hide and pretend everything is alright because it has so much. Anyone can play like things are alright when the economics are good, but when things get bad, then there are problems.

[Mike Jones 1999]

....atlantagreg that post was well thought out and very informative!