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Old 10-04-2013, 11:53 AM
JPD
 
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One of the nice things about this is that the view from the green will include the Hurt Building, easily one of Atlanta's most beautiful and important buildings.
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Old 10-10-2013, 08:25 AM
 
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GSU has put up a page with photos of Kell Hall. There was even talk of replacing Sparks Hall with a new building. GSU has so little tradition. Hate to see it remove its oldest ties to the past.

Kell Hall: A Building With Quirky History - Georgia State University
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Old 10-10-2013, 10:39 AM
 
Location: NW Atlanta
6,495 posts, read 6,077,833 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MathmanMathman View Post
GSU has put up a page with photos of Kell Hall. There was even talk of replacing Sparks Hall with a new building. GSU has so little tradition. Hate to see it remove its oldest ties to the past.

Kell Hall: A Building With Quirky History - Georgia State University

I spent 4 years at GSU and while I understand the historical significance of Kell, the building is a freakin' dump that should've been torn down years ago. Gumboula's post was spot on.
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Old 10-10-2013, 11:38 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gumboula View Post
I would fight for most historic buildings, but I will not fight for Kell Hall. It only has two very old elevators and despite all of the ramps, it is not ADA compliant (the ramps are far too steep for wheelchairs). Until the completion of the Petit Science Center, it was full of very bad lab space. The prospects for renovation in any serious way were slim because of how it was constructed. It is going to cost about twice the normal price per square foot just to demolish. Serious renovation would be even more expensive. I guess they built parking garages well back in the day.

And Kell has actually been on the chopping block for a long time (maybe as many as 15 years or so). The question was what would replace it. Initially the talk was for a new classroom building (the Board of Regents actually approved that). But as GSU has acquired more existing downtown buildings and land, the need for a classroom building on that site has become less important. With more students, and especially more students living downtown, the need for open space has become a priority. Especially around the library plaza. Come to that area of campus at noon on a weekday and evaluate the safety of that many people in that enclosed a space for yourself. It isn't just Kell coming down. Library plaza will be dropped to ground level and there will be an open linear greenspace from Kell, past the library, under Courtland, between the Student Center and the Urban Life Building (with the bookstore building and the law school conference center coming down as well), right up to the new science complex. That will provide a much safer egress for students across that side of campus, than the current masses that cross the main streets wherever they want.

So as much as I bemoan Atlanta's disregard for history (I moved here from New Orleans), Kell is not worth saving.
But bringing all that down to ground level will require reconfiguring a lot buildings, losing parking spaces, and spending a lot of money even beyond demolition costs. And it's pretty clear that under the Courtland bridge cannot be prettied up. The Plaza can get crowded but as the campus is moving out, there'll be less students. And really, any "green"space there can't last. It would be trampled down in no time and any efforts to fence off the green would be defeating the purpose.

The Plaza is very successful so don't try and "fix it". Elevators in Kell can be replaced and its floors and ceiling redone and even provide more window access. Nothing really wrong with Kell. Every building needs attention and sprucing up now and then. The library is evidence of that. If you don't maintain a building...sure...it will eventually look rundown. And Kell has more space than even the Aderhold building. That'll be a lot of lost space.
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Old 10-10-2013, 12:29 PM
JPD
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MathmanMathman View Post
But bringing all that down to ground level will require reconfiguring a lot buildings, losing parking spaces, and spending a lot of money even beyond demolition costs. Good. That's a lot of people getting paychecks for doing all that work. There is an overabundance of parking in downtown, so losing some would be great. And it's pretty clear that under the Courtland bridge cannot be prettied up. Anything can be prettied up. Just takes some imagination and a lot of labor. The Plaza can get crowded but as the campus is moving out, there'll be less students. And really, any "green"space there can't last. It would be trampled down in no time and any efforts to fence off the green would be defeating the purpose. College campuses all over the world have greenspaces that don't get trampled down. I don't see why this would be any different.

The Plaza is very successful so don't try and "fix it". Elevators in Kell can be replaced and its floors and ceiling redone and even provide more window access. Nothing really wrong with Kell. Every building needs attention and sprucing up now and then. The library is evidence of that. If you don't maintain a building...sure...it will eventually look rundown. And Kell has more space than even the Aderhold building. That'll be a lot of lost space. Good, that'll force GSU to expand their footprint on downtown.
Responses in bold.
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Old 10-10-2013, 01:44 PM
 
7,112 posts, read 10,094,627 times
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Originally Posted by JPD View Post
Responses in bold.
Easy.

Quote:
Good. That's a lot of people getting paychecks for doing all that work. There is an overabundance of parking in downtown, so losing some would be great.
Creating work for the sake of work is not a good idea. There's plenty more productive things GSU can do with the money than an expensive greenspace project that won't create that much greenspace. GSU is not cash rich and this expense does nothing to expand the campus. And GSU has a severe shortage of parking. GSU has buses rolling in from Turner Field for years. Plus close in parking helps in recruiting good staff if they can have great spots.

Quote:
Anything can be prettied up. Just takes some imagination and a lot of labor.
Not unless they replace that whole bridge. They've tried to pretty it up with nice lighting and cut stone, but it's like putting lipstick on a pig. That area under Courtland is pretty nasty.

Quote:
College campuses all over the world have greenspaces that don't get trampled down. I don't see why this would be any different.
And those other college campuses have hundreds of acres of campus to let people spread out on. It would be worse than Woodruff Park in terms of density of people and Woodruff Park actively keeps people off the grass to keep it green.

Quote:
Good, that'll force GSU to expand their footprint on downtown.
They don't need that to encourage them. GSU has the second highest enrollment (almost as many as UGA) with the least amount of land so space for academics and parking is always an issue. As I said before, GSU doesn't have a lot of money and its surrounding land is far more expensive per acre than for any other school in the USG. KSU bought 88 acres for $20 million. Let's see GSU do that.

Last edited by MathmanMathman; 10-10-2013 at 01:57 PM..
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Old 10-10-2013, 02:05 PM
JPD
 
12,138 posts, read 18,228,397 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MathmanMathman View Post
Easy.


Creating work for the sake of work is not a good idea. There's plenty more productive things GSU can do with the money than an expensive greenspace project that won't create that much greenspace. GSU is not cash rich and this expense does nothing to expand the campus. And GSU has a severe shortage of parking. GSU has buses rolling in from Turner Field for years. Plus close in parking helps in recruiting good staff if they can have great spots.


Not unless they replace that whole bridge. They've tried to pretty it up with nice lighting and cut stone, but it's like putting lipstick on a pig. That area under Courtland is pretty nasty.


And those other college campuses have hundreds of acres of campus to let people spread out on. It would be worse than Woodruff Park in terms of density of people and Woodruff Park actively keeps people off the grass to keep it green.


They don't need that to encourage them. GSU has the second highest enrollment (almost as many as UGA) with the least amount of land so space for academics and parking is always an issue. As I said before, GSU doesn't have a lot of money and its surrounding land is far more expensive per acre than for any other school in the USG. KSU bought 88 acres for $20 million. Let's see GSU do that.
Sounds like sour grapes.
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Old 10-10-2013, 02:24 PM
JPD
 
12,138 posts, read 18,228,397 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MathmanMathman View Post
Easy.


Creating work for the sake of work is not a good idea. That's not what they're doing. This is a campus beautification project that will probably increase enrollment and improve the quality of on-campus life. A very worthy reason to spend money. There's plenty more productive things GSU can do with the money Perhaps, but paying to maintain a terrible facility like Kell isn't producitve. than an expensive greenspace project that won't create that much greenspace. GSU is not cash rich and this expense does nothing to expand the campus. And GSU has a severe shortage of parking. As does every urban campus on Earth.GSU has buses rolling in from Turner Field for years. Seems to work reasonably well. Plus close in parking helps in recruiting good staff if they can have great spots.I'll need to see some evidence to back up this claim.


Not unless they replace that whole bridge. They've tried to pretty it up with nice lighting and cut stone, but it's like putting lipstick on a pig. Those ideas failed, but that doesn't mean other ideas would also fail. I suspect the best idea will have more to do with adding color, perhaps in the form of murals, and/or turning the area into event space. They've already held some concerts there in the recent past. I would propose they offer students course credit for ideas and designs to improve that area. That area under Courtland is pretty nasty.


And those other college campuses have hundreds of acres of campus to let people spread out on. It would be worse than Woodruff Park in terms of density of people Most parks are.and Woodruff Park actively keeps people off the grass to keep it green. Thaty most likely has more to do with keeping bums from sleeping on the lawn than it does with keeping the grass green.

again, responses in bold.
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Old 10-10-2013, 02:46 PM
 
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Kell hall is outdated, inefficient and uninviting from the street. It's a frumpy converted parking lot, not an architectural treasure.

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Old 10-10-2013, 02:47 PM
JPD
 
12,138 posts, read 18,228,397 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
Kell hall is outdated, inefficient and uninviting from the street. It's a converted parking lot, not an architectural treasure.
I like the yellow brick. I'd like to see them save and reuse some of it in some way.
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