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No doubt they are eager to get moving, after the COA dinked around forever with the old Turner field area. It really hasn't improved all that much since the original stadium was built half a century ago.
Of course not. They destroyed neighborhoods and built parking lots. When the COA suggested redevelopments, the Braves wanted control and ownership any private development the city suggests. The Braves are a media organization and should not be given a monopoly over restaurants and bars in an area like they demanded.
Hopefully Cobb will be smarter and not make the same mistakes COA did years ago and not build the stadium surrounded by a sea of parking lots. But Cobb loves their cars so we will see how that all works out.
In addition to the Braves hand outs. Cobb is giving millions in tax breaks to get developments in the area. So I am sure they will be able to get some to happen. But we will see what shape Cobb is in 10 years once those breaks expire and how it compares to COA. Cobb seems to be following in same mistakes COA made in decades past while COA has turned around.
The sea of parking lots on both sides of the connector is disgusting & I welcome the upcoming opportunity the COA will have to rid itself of that blight of paving & it's concomitant storm water runoff.
There's been a lot of criticism directed at Atlanta, some of it valid & some not, over the lack of movement to improve the area while the Braves have had their run first at AFCS & then at Turner Field. But would the Braves organization have allowed that huge expanse of paved lots to have been removed or replaced with something different? Considering the seeming control freak nature of the organization, I seriously doubt it in which case the whining directed at the COA about the area is just that: whining as an excuse to leave for a better deal.
Lookout Cobb!
The sea of parking lots on both sides of the connector is disgusting & I welcome the upcoming opportunity the COA will have to rid itself of that blight of paving & it's concomitant storm water runoff.
There's been a lot of criticism directed at Atlanta, some of it valid & some not, over the lack of movement to improve the area while the Braves have had their run first at AFCS & then at Turner Field. But would the Braves organization have allowed that huge expanse of paved lots to have been removed or replaced with something different? Considering the seeming control freak nature of the organization, I seriously doubt it in which case the whining directed at the COA about the area is just that: whining as an excuse to leave for a better deal.
The city of Atlanta has nothing to whine about. If they'd wanted to get serious about developing around Turner field they had 50 years to do so. Half a century is a long time in any context but especially in the uber competitive world of pro sports franchising. If you snooze (for 50 years) you lose and that's the way it works.
Fortunately for Atlantans the Braves are just moving up the road, so we're not losing our big league baseball team altogether. The new location will be closer for most fans and, hopefully, state of the art.
Fortunately for Atlantans the Braves are just moving up the road, so we're not losing our big league baseball team altogether. The new location will be closer for most fans and, hopefully, state of the art.
Now let's go win some ballgames!
I respect your opinion Arjay, but it's just hard to get excited about baseball in the suburbs. The feeling will not be the same. Sure, they are talking about developing the area, but who is willing to take the bet that this won't just turn out to be a lesser version of the artificial Atlantic Station at best?
Atlantic Station is at least a hop, skip, and a jump away from Midtown and has amazing views of the skyline. The new location will be in an auto-centric office park with a hooters and sub-par mall to its namesake. I do not see the Braves' 1 coffee shop, 2 sports bars, and 2 "fine dining" restaurants changing that feeling.
The only good that could have come out of this would have been the expansion of rail service to the desperately needed and clogged northwest corridor, but given Cobb County's backwards culture and government , I don't see that happening.
Yes, the Braves are only moving up the road, but in the hearts and minds of many Atlantans, we most certainly are losing our big league baseball team. For all that I'm concerned, they may as well be in another state.
I respect your opinion Arjay, but it's just hard to get excited about baseball in the suburbs. The feeling will not be the same. Sure, they are talking about developing the area, but who is willing to take the bet that this won't just turn out to be a lesser version of the artificial Atlantic Station at best?
Atlantic Station is at least a hop, skip, and a jump away from Midtown and has amazing views of the skyline. The new location will be in an auto-centric office park with a hooters and sub-par mall to its namesake. I do not see the Braves' 1 coffee shop, 2 sports bars, and 2 "fine dining" restaurants changing that feeling.
The only good that could have come out of this would have been the expansion of rail service to the desperately needed and clogged northwest corridor, but given Cobb County's backwards culture and government , I don't see that happening.
Yes, the Braves are only moving up the road, but in the hearts and minds of many Atlantans, we most certainly are losing our big league baseball team. For all that I'm concerned, they may as well be in another state.
the sad thing is that this would already be 100 times better than what is surrounding the stadium now. the stadium has been in the "auto-centric" part of downtown since the 60's and what is to show for it? one restaurant?
The city of Atlanta has nothing to whine about. If they'd wanted to get serious about developing around Turner field they had 50 years to do so. Half a century is a long time in any context but especially in the uber competitive world of pro sports franchising. If you snooze (for 50 years) you lose and that's the way it works.
Fortunately for Atlantans the Braves are just moving up the road, so we're not losing our big league baseball team altogether. The new location will be closer for most fans and, hopefully, state of the art.
Now let's go win some ballgames!
For the majority of those years, the team wanted the stadium to be car centric. The idea of urban, walkable neighborhoods was not popular. The reason the stadium was placed in the first place was the area was already slated for urban renewal and the land taken by emient domain for a low price. If the braves are real about being in an urban, walkable area they wouldn't be moving to an area of suburban office parks, strip malls, and an old mall. They would do their research and know that majority of development is taking place in the city.
I agree, the area around Atlanta-Fulton and Turner Field was originally designed very poorly. And the city failed to fix that when turner field was built. It was designed around the car. Just as has happened with other stadiums, the area got worse because of the stadium (not in spite). The last couple years the COA has been trying to get the area redeveloped, but the Braves were only trying to leverage that to get money, not improve the area.
Cobb seem to be trying to do a better job than COA stadium planers of decades past and spread out the parking. But they are throwing a lot of tax-money at it that is going to drain the county plus Cobb is still very car-centric. So I doubt they will be effective at getting people out of their cars. After the first few years of new-ness and all of the development tax hand-outs wear off, we will see what the Braves attendance is like and how the area is doing. But I think we will see a lot of pay-lots and Cobb may learn that stadiums drive away development. Not attract it. Living or working near an auto-centric stadium is a negative, not a positive. It may bring people in for couple hours for a few days a year, but will drive away permanent residents and workers. While it might be something people like to have in the region, potential residents or companies rarely put major stadiums at the top of the list of things they want to live next to.
Yes the city messed up in decades past but the city is not repeating its past mistakes here. Cobb is now repeating Atlanta's past mistakes.
it's just hard to get excited about baseball in the suburbs. The feeling will not be the same.
What does that even mean? You go to a baseball game to watch the baseball game. The purpose is to see the Braves play a game, not have an urban epiphany.
Of course, if you were being intellectually honest, then you'd admit that the area around Cumberland where the complex is being planned is actually more vibrant and urban in nature than the run down area where Turner Field is located now.
As I originally wrote a few weeks ago when this relocation story broke, I lived in Grant Park for 10 years & can assure you that the nearby old AFCS & Turner Field were NOT GOOD NEIGHBORS to that neighborhood, much less to the closer Summerhill or Mechanicsville neighborhoods either. While in Grant Park I often wished that the ball park would disappear into a hole in the ground & still found myself thinking the same thing this fall.
It seems to be a popular sentiment to bash the COA over the planned move & to cite the immediate neighborhood as a major reason for the move. I won't stop anyone from doing that but I personally look forward to the day when the ballpark & it's nasty paved lots are gone & the opportunity for close-in-to-downtown redevelopment can occur on a scale & of a nature more befitting an area that is smack up against both downtown & neighborhoods where people actually already live.
And to those who claim that the COA never got serious about redevelopment in the area one only needs to foresee the future for a Turner-Field-less area by looking at how the tide of new housing exploded west from Grant Park into Summerhill all the way to the parking lots east & southeast of the Olympic Cauldron & how that growth filled up a large area of formerly empty or decayed areas.
It's obvious that there is tremendous potential for a new & better looking face on the area than the present ball park & it's sea of paved lots.
Good riddance to what was a bad neighbor for real neighborhoods!
Originally Posted by arjay57 The city of Atlanta has nothing to whine about. If they'd wanted to get serious about developing around Turner field they had 50 years to do so. Half a century is a long time in any context but especially in the uber competitive world of pro sports franchising. If you snooze (for 50 years) you lose and that's the way it works.
Fortunately for Atlantans the Braves are just moving up the road, so we're not losing our big league baseball team altogether. The new location will be closer for most fans and, hopefully, state of the art.
Now let's go win some ballgames!
Quote:
Originally Posted by cqholt
For the majority of those years, the team wanted the stadium to be car centric. The idea of urban, walkable neighborhoods was not popular. The reason the stadium was placed in the first place was the area was already slated for urban renewal and the land taken by emient domain for a low price. If the braves are real about being in an urban, walkable area they wouldn't be moving to an area of suburban office parks, strip malls, and an old mall. They would do their research and know that majority of development is taking place in the city.
cqholt makes an excellent point that the Braves (like most other professional baseball teams in the pre-Camden Yards era) did not care about developing the parking lots around the stadium for at least 27 of the 47 or so years that they have been in Atlanta.
The idea of developing the area immediately around and next to a professional baseball stadium (or any pro-sports stadium or arena) or building new pro-baseball stadiums in densely-developed areas NOT surrounded by acres of parking spaces did not really come into being until the overwhelmingly-popular Camden Yards opened up in Downtown Baltimore in 1992.
When Atlanta-Fulton County Stadium was completed in 1965, demolishing entire struggling inner-city neighborhoods and replacing them with superhighways and acres of parking spaces was at the time considered to be a primary form of redevelopment and "urban renewal".
Tearing down old and/or historical structures (homes, commercial buildings, public buildings, etc) and replacing them with paved surface parking lots was actually considered a very-high form of societal "progress" at the time (in the 1950's-1970's).
We now know that paving over urban neighborhoods with superhighways and acres of parking spaces is and was even more destructive than letting a declining inner-city neighborhood stand.
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