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Old 12-21-2014, 08:13 PM
 
Location: Kirkwood
22,193 posts, read 16,201,271 times
Reputation: 4913

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bu2 View Post
That's merely the chicken or the egg question. Did development occur because of the rail or was development occurring and so they put rail there? And obviously, they don't put rail lines along less dense, slower developing areas.

Those studies, even in Portland, have all been debunked on that basis. All they show is correlation, not causation (kind of the same argument some of you are using on the other side). And they don't demonstrate that the development wouldn't have occurred elsewhere without the rail line. MARTA is ample demonstration that rail doesn't create development. Most of the south and east/west lines have had very little development for decades. They've been declining. Development has moved north.
I feel marta is a reason why perimeter and buckhead submarkets have seen more growth than cumberland.
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Old 12-21-2014, 08:15 PM
bu2
 
8,982 posts, read 5,689,108 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kferq View Post
This "Know Nothing" argument is similar to that being used against climate change: unless you can prove a theory beyond any uncertainty (which is not possible in most sciences, much less economics) then it has been "debunked." There is very good data that transit (as well as roads and other infrastructure spending) drives development as measured by standard methods from the US National Academy of Sciences: http://onlinepubs.trb.org/onlinepubs/tcrp/tcrp_w56.pdf.

Many people look at the MARTA system and draw the exact opposite conclusion with improved development everywhere except in the absolutely poorest areas. Multinational corporations choose to have their headquarters near transit. Why?
The poorest areas are 3/4 of the areas MARTA covers. By extension, I could say MARTA makes areas poorer and inaccessible to future development. That would be almost as unsupported as your comment.

Development will occur in areas that make sense for reasons other than rail lines. In some cases, rail lines can enhance it, but they don't create it.
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Old 12-21-2014, 08:16 PM
bu2
 
8,982 posts, read 5,689,108 times
Reputation: 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by cqholt View Post
I feel marta is a reason why perimeter and buckhead submarkets have seen more growth than cumberland.
The Cumberland people agree with you. But again, that is re-direction of development, not creation.
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Old 12-21-2014, 08:31 PM
 
Location: Kirkwood
22,193 posts, read 16,201,271 times
Reputation: 4913
Quote:
Originally Posted by bu2 View Post
The poorest areas are 3/4 of the areas MARTA covers. By extension, I could say MARTA makes areas poorer and inaccessible to future development. That would be almost as unsupported as your comment.

Development will occur in areas that make sense for reasons other than rail lines. In some cases, rail lines can enhance it, but they don't create it.
Thats because white flight, deindustrialization, and urban disivestment were at work during those decades and only recently has been slowly reversing.
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Old 12-21-2014, 09:13 PM
 
Location: Morningside, Atlanta, GA
280 posts, read 293,705 times
Reputation: 215
Quote:
Originally Posted by bu2 View Post
The poorest areas are 3/4 of the areas MARTA covers. By extension, I could say MARTA makes areas poorer and inaccessible to future development. That would be almost as unsupported as your comment.

Development will occur in areas that make sense for reasons other than rail lines. In some cases, rail lines can enhance it, but they don't create it.
I agree with you that a rail line by itself does not guarantee that development will occur. It is not magic. But it does contribute as does other infrastructure improvements.

Speaking of unsupported, where does your 3/4 figure comes from? Counting by station, there has been significant development around > 2/3rds of the stations. Both north lines are surrounded by development, the neighborhoods surrounding the entire East line have been developing rapidly and the close in West line stations have had significant retail and housing development in the neighborhood. In fact, the only long stretches without a lot of development occuring nearby are Garnet through Lakewood on the North/South line and the last two stations on the West line.
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Old 12-21-2014, 11:31 PM
 
Location: Bmore, The cursed land of -> Hotlanta -> Charlotte
305 posts, read 302,893 times
Reputation: 238
I hate being a Black Atlantan.
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Old 12-22-2014, 08:40 AM
 
1,584 posts, read 1,656,837 times
Reputation: 1197
Quote:
Originally Posted by Black_Sheep3 View Post
I hate being a Black Atlantan.
Love your struggle. Everybody has one. I don't know what yours feels like since I'm not you but I've been pushed around before and I let it get to me. Now I realize it just made me stronger. It made me who I am. Love your struggle. Love who you are. Nothing will ever change it so you might as well.
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Old 12-22-2014, 09:04 AM
 
Location: Vinings/Cumberland in the evil county of Cobb
1,258 posts, read 1,109,785 times
Reputation: 1376
Quote:
Originally Posted by Black_Sheep3 View Post
I hate being a Black Atlantan.
Your post is very disturbing. Honestly is being black anywhere else (outside of Atlanta) better or worst? I can't say love your struggle, cause I don't love mine however I would just say learn about who you are, so you can learn to love who you are. Knowledge of self gives us all clarity to embrace our path. Remember our history doesn't start with slavery, slavery interrupted our history. Being born in LA (liberal) and raised in NYC (liberal) and college in Maryland (liberal) I can attest that being black there is no better or worst than Atlanta.

"ATTITUDE DETERMINES ALTITUDE"
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Old 12-22-2014, 09:25 AM
 
1,584 posts, read 1,656,837 times
Reputation: 1197
What I really mean is love the person it helped you become. Love yourself. Be proud.
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Old 12-22-2014, 09:41 AM
 
Location: Vinings/Cumberland in the evil county of Cobb
1,258 posts, read 1,109,785 times
Reputation: 1376
Quote:
Originally Posted by joey86 View Post
What I really mean is love the person it helped you become. Love yourself. Be proud.
yes
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