CREATIVE LOAFING: APD to increase patrols in south, east Atlanta — but what about addressing root of the problem? (purchase, legal)

[joey86]

Originally Posted by Poncey

No way ALL drugs would or should be legalized. Crack, heroin and meth will never be made legal. Illegal trade in prescription meds would also remain a problem.

The only real argument against legalization is an emotional one. "I don't like the sound of that, heroin is terrible."

The truth is many of the problems associated with drugs are a product of prohibition. If the prescription drugs that people abuse were easier to get legally the illegal trade would dissapear. There is a reason people don't make bathtub gin anymore.

I don't like hard drugs one bit. But not liking them is no reason to support prohibition. Legalization would likely lower drug use, crime, and overdoses and it would make drugs harder to get for youth, just like alcohol.

I have seen zero evidence of any kind that prohibition does any good. All evidence I have seen points towards it having a very negative effect.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by ATLTJL

Oh good, more police uselessly driving around in cruisers....that'll help a lot....

The real problem is APD doesn't have enough officers on foot patrol. It's pathetic that two people were shot and killed in the parking lot of the Vortex. Even if they were drug dealers, which I understand they were, have you ever gone out in Little Five Points? Or East Atlanta? Did you see an APD officer on foot patrolling the area? I don't think I ever have. And why don't these businesses hire off duty police officers? When I was a kid, I had a job at a miniature gold course in Vestavia Hills, Alabama....which is basically a Johns Creek, and even we had an off duty police officer who worked with us on weekend nights. If you run a bar that has had a bartender murdered and been robbed at gunpoint...I'm talking to you, Augustine's....when are you going to get off your behind and hire some private security?

Very good points, ATLTJL. Officers on foot (and bike) patrol make a huge difference.

We had a robbery at our office one day and two bike cops showed up and ran them down like Starsky and Hutch. A cruiser looped around and boxed in their getaway car.

It was darn good policing and pretty exciting to boot. The capacity for that sort of instant response is bound to deter lowlifes who are thinking holding people up.

[Poncey]

Originally Posted by joey86

The only real argument against legalization is an emotional one. "I don't like the sound of that, heroin is terrible."

The truth is many of the problems associated with drugs are a product of prohibition. If the prescription drugs that people abuse were easier to get legally the illegal trade would dissapear. There is a reason people don't make bathtub gin anymore.

I don't like hard drugs one bit. But not liking them is no reason to support prohibition. Legalization would likely lower drug use, crime, and overdoses and it would make drugs harder to get for youth, just like alcohol.

I have seen zero evidence of any kind that prohibition does any good. All evidence I have seen points towards it having a very negative effect.

The only real argument isn't just emotional, it's also moral. PCP, crack, heroin, meth.. are all highly addictive drugs that ravage the mind and body. Legalizing highly addictive substances will not lower usage, crime or overdoses. All that would "likely" happen is the creation of more addicts to generate even higher demand and employ more illegal drug dealers.

Now, the national legalization of marijuana, that's a different story.

Edit: Maybe not many people making bathtub gin anymore; but there is still illegal moonshine. Even a TV series glorifying it.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by Poncey

The only real argument isn't just emotional, it's also moral. PCP, crack, heroin, meth.. are all highly addictive drugs that ravage the mind and body. Legalizing highly addictive substances will not lower usage, crime or overdoses. All that would "likely" happen is the creation of more addicts to generate even higher demand and employ more illegal drug dealers.

Now, the national legalization of marijuana, that's a different story.

Portugal seems to have had some success with decriminalization. However, I don't know the extent of their problems with things like meth, crack, etc.

It is clearly ridiculous for us to be locking people up for pot while allowing far more dangerous substances like alcohol and tobacco.

Drug decriminalisation in Portugal: setting the record straight | Transform: Getting Drugs Under Control

[bu2]

Originally Posted by joey86

The only real argument against legalization is an emotional one. "I don't like the sound of that, heroin is terrible."

The truth is many of the problems associated with drugs are a product of prohibition. If the prescription drugs that people abuse were easier to get legally the illegal trade would dissapear. There is a reason people don't make bathtub gin anymore.

I don't like hard drugs one bit. But not liking them is no reason to support prohibition. Legalization would likely lower drug use, crime, and overdoses and it would make drugs harder to get for youth, just like alcohol.

I have seen zero evidence of any kind that prohibition does any good. All evidence I have seen points towards it having a very negative effect.

Ah, a true believer.

Reality is that a lot of drugs are very bad for the users and society. They make the users less productive. They commit crimes to get the money. And we pay for the negative costs to their health. Legalization doesn't make drugs free.

You can argue that the costs are higher than the benefits, but to say its only an emotional argument is ridiculous.

[midtown mile girl]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Yep. The key problem is Fulton (and DeKalb) courts just keep re-releasing repeat offenders.

I agree. The parole board and the judges need to be looked at and investigated. Too many repeat offenders not serving full terms.

[Poncey]

Originally Posted by arjay57

Portugal seems to have had some success with decriminalization. However, I don't know the extent of their problems with things like meth, crack, etc.

It is clearly ridiculous for us to be locking people up for pot while allowing far more dangerous substances like alcohol and tobacco.

Drug decriminalisation in Portugal: setting the record straight | Transform: Getting Drugs Under Control

Portugal still hasn't legalized drugs. They've decriminalized many of the offenses for drug use and focused on rehabilitation as a penalty for addicts and those with less than a 10 day supply. Which, is a direction I would like to see here in the U.S.

[tikigod311]

Originally Posted by ATLTJL

The real problem is APD doesn't have enough officers on foot patrol.

Good point, that is actually something easy to do and makes their presence a lot more efficient.

[joey86]

Originally Posted by bu2

Ah, a true believer.

Reality is that a lot of drugs are very bad for the users and society. They make the users less productive. They commit crimes to get the money. And we pay for the negative costs to their health. Legalization doesn't make drugs free.

You can argue that the costs are higher than the benefits, but to say its only an emotional argument is ridiculous.

We don't have much evidence that prohibition lowers usage. There is evidence that it raises it.
I never said drugs aren't bad for the users, but prohibition makes matters worse.

[Atlwarrior]

The problems is certain young people never developed basic life skills from home, and even if you are 21 years old can have the emotional intelligence of adolescent. No amount of police presence or law can solve a emotional and soulical issue that starts at home.