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No you don't. Roads require constant maintenance and improvement and taxes aren't covering it. But yes, I agree it would be best to switch to direct-user-funding-only. But that will take time because politics.
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Originally Posted by arjay57
Stick the true cost of transportation on the user rather than the taxpayer in general.
So raise taxes and spend the money on things like transit as opposed to removing a traffic lane. At least that way it's not a regressive consumer tax, where those who can afford it do, and those who can't get stuck in the mess of traffic created by removing an entire traffic lane.
Everyone still pays for the roads, because EVERYONE, not just the direct users, benefits from public logistical infrastructure. I say the same for transit. Everyone pays, because it benefits everyone, and is thus open, unrestricted to everyone.
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Originally Posted by sedimenjerry
Can't believe I'm gonna argue in support of jsvh but the previous HOV lane in Gwinnett was already clogged with HOV2 and needed to go to HOV3 to keep it flowing. The lane is still free for HOV3+, busses, etc. Single occupant vehicles could previously NEVER use the lane anyway so it's just paying for a privilege that was previously not an option for them as a single occupant. Only people who can remotely complain is HOV2 but again the lane was already too congested when allowing them. The options were to make it HOV3+ or HOT with 3+ being free. HOV2 was going to be shut out no matter what. As a single occupant I could not previously use that lane but now I have the option to and I do for a fee.
See, it's great that one lane moves, yay, but what do you think happened to everyone who was in the HOV2 situation? They're in the other lanes. So instead of adding capacity or ability, really they just forced the traffic all into the other lanes, which still hurts those in the HOV3/HOT lanes when you need to, say, exit.
I will say, though, I like the idea of these lanes for HOV3+ and buses, but the pricing component just rubs me the wrong way (yeah, shocking I know!).
So, BACK ON TOPIC! Should a MARTA Expansion into Gwinnett be BRT, HRT, or Commuter Rail? Where should it all go, and Should MARTA be the one leading the Commuter rail effort in the region instead of the GDOT?
Can't believe I'm gonna argue in support of jsvh but the previous HOV lane in Gwinnett was already clogged with HOV2 and needed to go to HOV3 to keep it flowing. The lane is still free for HOV3+, busses, etc. Single occupant vehicles could previously NEVER use the lane anyway so it's just paying for a privilege that was previously not an option for them as a single occupant. Only people who can remotely complain is HOV2 but again the lane was already too congested when allowing them. The options were to make it HOV3+ or HOT with 3+ being free. HOV2 was going to be shut out no matter what. As a single occupant I could not previously use that lane but now I have the option to and I do for a fee.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fourthwarden
See, it's great that one lane moves, yay, but what do you think happened to everyone who was in the HOV2 situation? They're in the other lanes. So instead of adding capacity or ability, really they just forced the traffic all into the other lanes, which still hurts those in the HOV3/HOT lanes when you need to, say, exit.
I will say, though, I like the idea of these lanes for HOV3+ and buses, but the pricing component just rubs me the wrong way (yeah, shocking I know!).
Currently vehicles with 3 or more occupants can ride in the HOT lanes on I-85 Northeast for free along with buses.
But there is a building amount of speculation that eventually only buses and registered vanpools will be allowed to ride in the I-85 HOT lanes for free.
That's because the two other managed toll lane projects under construction on I-75 South in Henry County and on I-75/I-575 in Cobb and Cherokee counties will only allow buses and registered vanpools to ride for free in those lanes once those projects are completed.
It is suspected that the only reason why vehicles with 3 or more occupants are allowed to ride for free in the I-85 HOT Lanes is because the $110 million grant from the federal government that paid for the implementation of tolls on the lanes was likely issued with the condition that vehicles with 3 or more occupants be allowed to ride in the lanes during the life of the federal grant which expires in late 2016.
The I-85 HOT Lanes were intended to be a five-year demo project that got the motoring public used to the idea of tolls on lanes....That's because there are many indications that the State of Georgia wants to eventually expand tolling to other lanes on the freeway system.
There is also speculation that the State of Georgia possibly even wants to expand tolling to all lanes of the freeway system over the long-term along with eventually placing variable tolls on all stretches of the existing HOV-2 lane system.
Currently vehicles with 3 or more occupants can ride in the HOT lanes on I-85 Northeast for free along with buses.
But there is a building amount of speculation that eventually only buses and registered vanpools will be allowed to ride in the I-85 HOT lanes for free.
That's because the two other managed toll lane projects under construction on I-75 South in Henry County and on I-75/I-575 in Cobb and Cherokee counties will only allow buses and registered vanpools to ride for free in those lanes once those projects are completed.
It is suspected that the only reason why vehicles with 3 or more occupants are allowed to ride for free in the I-85 HOT Lanes is because the $110 million grant from the federal government that paid for the implementation of tolls on the lanes was likely issued with the condition that vehicles with 3 or more occupants be allowed to ride in the lanes during the life of the federal grant which expires in late 2016.
The I-85 HOT Lanes were intended to be a five-year demo project that got the motoring public used to the idea of tolls on lanes....That's because there are many indications that the State of Georgia wants to eventually expand tolling to other lanes on the freeway system.
There is also speculation that the State of Georgia possibly even wants to expand tolling to all lanes of the freeway system over the long-term along with eventually placing variable tolls on all stretches of the existing HOV-2 lane system.
What we would do without you? But yes bolded is the reason why HOV2 and single occupants have to pay. Single occupants either pay or ride in the mainlines like they always did so even any HOV2s kicked out just have their place taken by single occupants (and only for the HOT stretch, can still take HOV to downtown)
So, BACK ON TOPIC! Should a MARTA Expansion into Gwinnett be BRT, HRT, or Commuter Rail? Where should it all go, and Should MARTA be the one leading the Commuter rail effort in the region instead of the GDOT?
High-capacity transit expansion into Gwinnett should come in multiple forms:
Regional Heavy Rail Transit (with regional commuter rail service in the form of express Heavy Rail trains) should be extended into Gwinnett County primarily along 3 alignments:
> Along the Georgia Highway 13 (Buford Highway)/NS/Southern Railroad corridor between Doraville and Gainesville through the village-like downtown areas of Norcross, Duluth, Suwanee, Sugar Hill and Buford...
> Along the I-85 corridor between Doraville and Buford with the line splitting from the GA 13/NS Railroad regional HRT alignment just north of Doraville and re-joining with the GA 13/NS Railroad regional HRT alignment just north of Buford...
> Along the US Highway 29/CSX/Seaboard Airline Railroad corridor through the center of the county....This alignment would run through the center of the Lilburn, Lawrenceville and Dacula and would be used by the much-touted "Brain Train" regional high-capacity passenger rail transit line (preferably a regional HRT/express train commuter rail line) that would operate between the Atlanta Airport and the University of Georgia by way of the Atlanta University Center, Downtown Atlanta (Georgia State University, etc), Georgia Tech, Emory University and Georgia Gwinnett College.
The US Highway 78 corridor through South Gwinnett County should be served by high-capacity bus transit service (a combination of Bus Rapid Transit, high-frequency local bus transit and express commuter bus service)....Though a future upgrade of transit service to high-capacity passenger rail service should remain under consideration over the long-term.
All high-capacity transit lines should be largely self-funded with large-scale P3s (Public-Private Partnerships), Value Capture taxing (revenues collected from the increases in property taxes along the high-capacity transit lines) and distance-based fares....A collective funding source that either limits the amount of federal aid needed or totally eliminates the need for federal aid altogether if possible.
And it should be state government that leads the way in raising the funds to extend high-capacity transit service through heavily-populated, fast-growing Gwinnett County and beyond (to Gainesville and Athens).
High-capacity transit expansion into Gwinnett should come in multiple forms:
Regional Heavy Rail Transit (with regional commuter rail service in the form of express Heavy Rail trains) should be extended into Gwinnett County primarily along 3 alignments:
> Along the Georgia Highway 13 (Buford Highway)/NS/Southern Railroad corridor between Doraville and Gainesville through the village-like downtown areas of Norcross, Duluth, Suwanee, Sugar Hill and Buford...
> Along the I-85 corridor between Doraville and Buford with the line splitting from the GA 13/NS Railroad regional HRT alignment just north of Doraville and re-joining with the GA 13/NS Railroad regional HRT alignment just north of Buford...
> Along the US Highway 29/CSX/Seaboard Airline Railroad corridor through the center of the county....This alignment would run through the center of the Lilburn, Lawrenceville and Dacula and would be used by the much-touted "Brain Train" regional high-capacity passenger rail transit line (preferably a regional HRT/express train commuter rail line) that would operate between the Atlanta Airport and the University of Georgia by way of the Atlanta University Center, Downtown Atlanta (Georgia State University, etc), Georgia Tech, Emory University and Georgia Gwinnett College.
The US Highway 78 corridor through South Gwinnett County should be served by high-capacity bus transit service (a combination of Bus Rapid Transit, high-frequency local bus transit and express commuter bus service)....Though a future upgrade of transit service to high-capacity passenger rail service should remain under consideration over the long-term.
All high-capacity transit lines should be largely self-funded with large-scale P3s (Public-Private Partnerships), Value Capture taxing (revenues collected from the increases in property taxes along the high-capacity transit lines) and distance-based fares....A collective funding source that either limits the amount of federal aid needed or totally eliminates the need for federal aid altogether if possible.
And it should be state government that leads the way in raising the funds to extend high-capacity transit service through heavily-populated, fast-growing Gwinnett County and beyond (to Gainesville and Athens).
So raise taxes and spend the money on things like transit as opposed to removing a traffic lane. At least that way it's not a regressive consumer tax, where those who can afford it do, and those who can't get stuck in the mess of traffic created by removing an entire traffic lane.
Everyone still pays for the roads, because EVERYONE, not just the direct users, benefits from public logistical infrastructure. I say the same for transit. Everyone pays, because it benefits everyone, and is thus open, unrestricted to everyone.
See, it's great that one lane moves, yay, but what do you think happened to everyone who was in the HOV2 situation? They're in the other lanes. So instead of adding capacity or ability, really they just forced the traffic all into the other lanes, which still hurts those in the HOV3/HOT lanes when you need to, say, exit.
I will say, though, I like the idea of these lanes for HOV3+ and buses, but the pricing component just rubs me the wrong way (yeah, shocking I know!).
So, BACK ON TOPIC! Should a MARTA Expansion into Gwinnett be BRT, HRT, or Commuter Rail? Where should it all go, and Should MARTA be the one leading the Commuter rail effort in the region instead of the GDOT?
Extend the current gold line and have it run along satellite blvd corridor to Gwinnett arena area.
Implement commuter rail along existing rail corridors to serve downtown areas if norcross, Buford, Lawrenceville, lilburn, Tucker, etc. BRT along Buford hwy and US 78.
For a week in August, thousands of Gwinnett residents, workers and passersby will be asked to participate in a wide-ranging conversation about transportation in the county: how they want to get around, where they wish they could get to more easily and why it’s important that transportation be improved.
The project, called the Great Exchange, aims to push conversations about transportation in Gwinnett to the forefront. By the end, organizers hope to have gathered a wide range of opinions and forced people to consider what their transportation system needs.
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The campaign comes as the county plans to spend $1.25 million to update its transportation plan over the next 18 months, and on the heels of a poll by the Chamber of Commerce that indicated residents are increasingly in favor of public transportation options. But Warbington said he wants the Great Exchange to stand apart from discussions of MARTA or money.
Quote:
The campaign will cost $60,000, and is being funded by the Gwinnett Village and Gwinnett Place community improvement districts. Warbington has been working on it for a year — but he said he does not want to create unrealistic expectations. He does not know what, if anything, will change as a result of the answers.
On one of these threads someone was responding to the bashing of Gwinnett leaders by saying there should be some thought put into what to do. While this survey is lead by the Chamber of Commerce, the transportation plan is being lead by the county. Together they are a good thing for Gwinnett.
On one of these threads someone was responding to the bashing of Gwinnett leaders by saying there should be some thought put into what to do. While this survey is lead by the Chamber of Commerce, the transportation plan is being lead by the county. Together they are a good thing for Gwinnett.
Haha! I knew it was only a matter of time before this got brought up.
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