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Big L - You obviously do not "believe in" all public schools, especially not APS. Your concerns about "making friends" in the neighborhood show that education is not your real priority here. You have bigger concerns about the people in the neighborhood and your compatibility with them.
And if resale value is your concern, intown neighborhoods have been seeing the biggest growth in values.
Big L, I think it is time for you to acknowledge you just have a preference for the suburbs. Not that there is anything wrong with that. But you should stop pretending that the suburbs are the most frugal option for everyone (or even most) or that they are the only place you can get a good education.
I never said ALL public schools. Do not put words in my mouth (or in this case, strokes on my keys).
I also never said that I did not have a preference for the suburbs. I think that was already established from my previous posts.
I think that it is time for YOU to admit that you are a snobbish ITPer that can't seem to understand why someone would choose to live elsewhere.
I never said ALL public schools. Do not put words in my mouth (or in this case, strokes on my keys).
I also never said that I did not have a preference for the suburbs. I think that was already established from my previous posts.
I think that it is time for YOU to admit that you are a snobbish ITPer that can't seem to understand why someone would choose to live elsewhere.
Got it. You only believe in suburban public schools. But if you are acknowledging that you just personally prefer the suburbs and don't want to live in the city regardless then, great. I am glad people have the ability to choose the suburbs if that is the lifestyle they want. I prefer a more urban lifestyle and will make other sacrifices for that. I just wanted to get you off the idea that living in the city is not a frugal option. Or that there are not great education options ITP. Those are just simply not the case.
Got it. You only believe in suburban public schools.
There you go ASSuming again!
Please point out in any of my previous point where I specifically stated that I only believe in suburban public schools. I can acknowledge that there are some good public schools in urban areas. Unfortunately, Atlanta Public Schools is definitely not an example of good public schools in an urban area. Even the teachers that I have come across that taught in APS didn't send their kids to APS schools. That speaks volumes.
People now using the argument that people don't want to live in cities because the schools are bad, crime and etc.
When actually it's reverse crime and bad schools became cause people left, and etc. it happen after suburban sprawl and white flight. And the Fantasy about suburbs are errors because minorities and etc are only going move out there 10 to 20 years.
People didn't leave these neighborhoods in 1960-1970's because of bad schools and crime, they left because of race. And because they left cause bad schools and crime came later in the 1980-2000's.
I my Aunt is from Memphis but during the great migrations as you know many Blacks family moved north, She was raised in Chicago. When my Family first moved to Chicago Westside in the early 60's it was majority white. But Because so many Blacks were now able to move to those neighborhoods the white population scattered.
This happen in Atlanta as it happen in many American cities, in the early 60's Atlanta was over 60% white. And around 40% Black. Deep in mind most of Buckhead didn't even exist. A lot neighborhoods that are now majority black "and are consider the hood" was majority white middle class and had black segregated blocks that were different economics ranges. When civil rights era hit, and segregation end blacks began to move to white areas. The White population scattered to the suburbs. which cause the wealth to be grain out of these neighborhoods. Some neighborhood stayed middle class but most decline.
But Sprawl is largely a game of white flight, then later minorities move to these suburban neighborhoods which cause more white flight. This also the reason transit is unpopular because there this notion is brings minorities faster to living in these suburbs, It been pass the point of ridiculous,
In the 60's came this fantasy that suburbs are these super white utopia that minorities can't afford. The huge error is at some point minorities will to start to move these neighborhoods, And failed part is population keeps moving further as if minorities won't move there too.
So there this fantasy about suburbs that don't exist, or least won't exist in a suburban neighborhood 10 to 20 years. There this stigma that exist against cities, crime, bad schools, and etc that only exist because of white flight in the first place.
White flight is pointless because minorities are only going to follow and will come, people just have to get use to diversity, The irony is they wasn't fleeing it would offset the crime rate, and bad school performance.
In the early 1960s the area was a predominantly white neighborhood. After an African American physician bought a home in Peyton Forest, white residents in the area feared that their neighborhood would become a victim of blockbusting, a business practice in which real estate agents would profit from the racial fears of white residents while changing the racial makeup of a white residential area. When African-Americans moved into a neighborhood, many whites believed that property values would automatically plunge, which was a self-fulfilling prophecy as so many homes went on the market at the same time as whites fled first West End and then Cascade Heights, Adams Park, and most of the rest of southwest Atlanta. Real estate agents stirred up racial tension and benefited from the commissions they earned when fearful homeowners sold their properties, often at a loss, in order to escape the area.
In an infamous 1962–1963 episode that came to be called "the Peyton Road affair", Atlanta mayor Ivan Allen responded to residents' fears of blockbusting by directing city staff to erect barricades on Peyton Road and Harlan Road to restrict access to Cascade Heights, thus preventing African American homeseekers from getting to the neighborhood from Gordon Road (now MLK Drive). He took the action at the urging of white residents of southwest Atlanta (in particular, one of his high-level employees who lived a short distance from Peyton Road[citation needed]). After the barricades went up, December 18, 1962, the incident quickly drew national attention. The barrier was compared to the Berlin wall and nicknamed the "Atlanta wall". Some newspapers in other parts of the country questioned Atlanta's motto "the City Too Busy to Hate." The walls were torn down when, on March 1, 1963, a court ruled them to be unconstitutional. White homeowners fled the neighborhood after the barricades were removed. By the end of July 1963, only 15 white homeowners remained in Peyton Forest.
By the late 1960s the Cascade Heights neighborhood was predominantly African-American but, in spite of the fears of some whites, little had changed in Cascade except the color of the residents. In the 1970s, the area became home to many of the movers and shakers in the city's African American community and it remains so today. It is, in many ways, a mirror of the much-vaunted white neighborhoods in northwest Atlanta, with notable celebrities in residence, several gated communities, and flanked by two golf courses.
Mozley Park was an early epicenter of white flight in Atlanta,[3] which had de facto residential segregation.
1899 Ad in Atlanta Constitution for the Lemon Elixir of Dr. Mozley
The neighborhood was located immediately west of the Ashby Street area, which underwent turbulence in the 1940s as many white sections of that neighborhood transitioned to black. In 1937, a black physician bought three lots in Mozley Park but abandoned his building plans after work crews were threatened. In 1941 city officials considered building a parkway that would serve as a physical barrier to black areas to Mozley Park's east. When this was not built, Westview Drive was used as a boundary, with anyone trying to build homes for blacks within 100 yards of the road threatened. Streets in black subdivisions north of Westview were unpaved for the last 100 yards nearest Westview. East of Chappell Road was also considered a black area.
In 1948, William A. Scott, Jr., an African American and the son of the Atlanta Daily World founder, built his home on the corner of Mozely Place and Chappell Road. But since it faced Mozely Place, this was seen as encroachment on the white area. White neighbors began to sell, which as was common in the day, caused mass selling by other white homeowners. In 1949 some white residents formed the Mozley Park Home Owners' Protective Association (MPHOPA) to stem the expansion of black residents, whose leaders stated their intentions to buy back homes in the "white" sections and establish a voluntary boundary line for "Negro expansion". The establishment of the MPHOPA was an important precedent in the city, as it was a "respectable" organization, whereas previous efforts to halt black expansion were under the auspices of the less respectable Ku Klux Klan or other overtly racist organizations.
Due to the extreme shortage of housing in "black" areas of the city, however, it was extremely profitable for white homeowners to sell to blacks. By 1950 black realtists (real estate agents) refused to cooperate any longer with MPHOPA efforts and in September 1951 advertised a mass listing of Mozley Park homes in the black newspaper the Atlanta Daily World. Mayor William B. Hartsfield personally visited the black "realtists'" board to ask them to let Westview Drive serve as a color line with blacks to the north and whites to the south; the realtists accepted this proposal tentatively. White residents reorganized the MPHOPA into the much larger Southwest Citizens' Association and lobbied Mayor Hartsfield who in 1952 presented a plan to build a six-lane highway along Westview Drive — but financing stalled and it would only be built years later as part Interstate 20.
Nonetheless, black families still managed to move into houses north of Westview. By 1954 the mayor finally agreed to transfer the neighborhood park to be designated for use by blacks (parks in Atlanta were also segregated by race) and the racial transition of the neighborhood was virtually complete
Last edited by chiatldal; 03-23-2016 at 03:09 PM..
Interesting. The DOE records show that only about 4% of South Gwinnett's students were FRL eligible in 1998. Of course Brookwood and Parkview had less than 2% at the time.
That's a crazy low number. According to US News/World Report Brookwood in 2012-2013 was at 28%. Everywhere has seen increases. How much of that is to the economy and how much is to migration, I don't know. I do know that for the last 20 years most of the money in south Gwinnett has been concentrated north of US 78. It'd be interesting to see what happened to that rate for SGHS once Grayson split off and took basically everything north of 78.
Please point out in any of my previous point where I specifically stated that I only believe in suburban public schools. I can acknowledge that there are some good public schools in urban areas. Unfortunately, Atlanta Public Schools is definitely not an example of good public schools in an urban area. Even the teachers that I have come across that taught in APS didn't send their kids to APS schools. That speaks volumes.
So you believe in all public school districs except for APS? Where are you going with this anti-ITP ranting?
[QUOTE=chiatldal;43461373]People now using the argument that people don't want to live in cities because the schools are bad, crime and etc.
When actually it's reverse crime and bad schools became cause people left, and etc. it happen after suburban sprawl and white flight. And the Fantasy about suburbs are errors because minorities and etc are only going move out there 10 to 20 years.
People didn't leave these neighborhoods in 1960-1970's because of bad schools and crime, they left because of race. And because they left cause bad schools and crime came later in the 1980-2000's.
Interesting reading. We lived not far from Cascade Hts. in the early 60s.
But you've got the accelerator mixed with the cause in most cases. As JSVH mentioned, there is a lot of momentum in new communities. Schools are new and can be very good. Houses are new. That is what drove most of the move to the suburbs. Race accelerated natural cycles of aging.
My HS was probably 90-95% white 3-4 years before I went there, about 75% my sophomore year, majority Black 3 years after that and probably only about 5% white 3 more years later. A large number of my friends moved in when they were 2 years old when the neighborhood was new and their family moved when they graduated, which was just before the area turned majority black. They were moving to bigger newer houses and places with better schools for their younger siblings. Many good students actually moved just before they entered high school. The ones without school age kids were the ones who stayed. There were also a series of 3 floods that drove people out. And in the 70s, drug crime was starting to ravage the cities with shootings and burglaries (look at the murder rates for the 70s). So it really was crime and schools. Race just sped it up.
There is a natural cycle. Neighborhoods get built, they age, people who moved in when new have their kids grow up and then the area gradually declines. Hopefully it eventually revitalizes and the cycle starts again.
I also don't believe in DeKalb or Clayton schools, which are both OTP.
A good bit of DeKalb is ITP.
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