What would be some Realistic MARTA expansion dates? (Atlanta, Lawrenceville: tax, live)

[toll_booth]

Originally Posted by primaltech

I still think that the State of GA, via GDOT, via GRTA, should swallow up and consolidate and control all the metro ATL transit, and operate everything and unify the branding (as GRTA), like MBTA does everything up in Boston. CRT, HRT, LRT, BRT, etc.

Then the 13-county GRTA area would fund it appropriately according to need, maybe at 1% sales tax for the 5 core counties, 1.5% for Atlanta proper, and .5% for the outer metro counties, who would just get commuter rail and express buses.

Then they could use P3's like the arrangement above, to quickly build out tons of commuter rail lines throughout the entire region, plus heavy rail to North Fulton and SE DeKalb, and light rail for Emory, and etc. And Blue Line to Fulton Industrial.

If we'd just simply do that next year, the whole region could be connected with frequent passenger rail probably by 2028. I don't get why we can't just get our act together and just do it.

In theory that's a good idea, but I worry about what the catch is. Such as, why is the state so interested in consolidating MARTA into a regional system now that it has been performing relatively well?

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by toll_booth

In theory that's a good idea, but I worry about what the catch is. Such as, why is the state so interested in consolidating MARTA into a regional system now that it has been performing relatively well?

Because it's all about the money.

Specifically, it is about the business community pressuring Georgia state government to takeover MARTA and fold it into a regional system as a means of dramatically increasing both the monetary value of the Atlanta metropolitan and regional real estate market (including both within and beyond the current MARTA service area).

The business community's desire to see Atlanta's regional real estate market increase in monetary value is one of the major reasons why 2018 gubernatorial frontrunner and sitting Georgia Lt. Governor Casey Cagle has been going around advocating for MARTA to be taken over by Georgia state government and expanded as a largely privatized regional transit agency.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by Born 2 Roll

Specifically, it is about the business community pressuring Georgia state government to takeover MARTA and fold it into a regional system as a means of dramatically increasing both the monetary value of the Atlanta metropolitan and regional real estate market (including both within and beyond the current MARTA service area).

The business community's desire to see Atlanta's regional real estate market increase in monetary value is one of the major reasons why 2018 gubernatorial frontrunner and sitting Georgia Lt. Governor Casey Cagle has been going around advocating for MARTA to be taken over by Georgia state government and expanded as a largely privatized regional transit agency.

The business community wants all this, yet the business community is unwilling to put up one dime in transit funding themselves.

Metro Atlanta's subsidy of the business community is grossly disproportionate to comparable cities, and it's done on the backs of the little man.

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by arjay57

The business community wants all this, yet the business community is unwilling to put up one dime in transit funding themselves.

Metro Atlanta's subsidy of the business community is grossly disproportionate to comparable cities, and it's done on the backs of the little man.

Agreed.

[LTCM]

Threads like this are prime examples of how out of touch ATL rail proponents are with the metro area.

[primaltech]

Originally Posted by LTCM

Threads like this are prime examples of how out of touch ATL rail proponents are with the metro area.

You going to explain your comment, there, champ?

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by toll_booth

In theory that's a good idea, but I worry about what the catch is. Such as, why is the state so interested in consolidating MARTA into a regional system now that it has been performing relatively well?

Originally Posted by Born 2 Roll

Because it's all about the money.

Specifically, it is about the business community pressuring Georgia state government to takeover MARTA and fold it into a regional system as a means of dramatically increasing both the monetary value of the Atlanta metropolitan and regional real estate market (including both within and beyond the current MARTA service area).

The business community's desire to see Atlanta's regional real estate market increase in monetary value is one of the major reasons why 2018 gubernatorial frontrunner and sitting Georgia Lt. Governor Casey Cagle has been going around advocating for MARTA to be taken over by Georgia state government and expanded as a largely privatized regional transit agency.

Originally Posted by arjay57

The business community wants all this, yet the business community is unwilling to put up one dime in transit funding themselves.

Metro Atlanta's subsidy of the business community is grossly disproportionate to comparable cities, and it's done on the backs of the little man.

Originally Posted by bryantm3

Agreed.

Oh, the business community is willing to put up the money.

BUT....In exchange for putting up the money (from local, national and international private investment sources) to have the state takeover and expand MARTA as a largely (but not completely) privatized entity under a name and image that is much more attractive to affluent white professionals and affluent white suburbanites/exurbanites, the business community is going to want a big (massive) return on their investment....A return in the form of virtual total political control of an expanded regional transit authority (by way of business-friendly suburban/exurban state politicians like Casey Cagle) and increased monetary values and returns on their prime commercial real estate holdings.

Metro Atlanta's and North Georgia's business community sees the way that transportation is going in the 21st Century with rail transit increasingly attracting the type of large-scale investment that superhighways attracted in the years and decades after World War II in the late 20th Century.

The Metro Atlanta/North Georgia business community is motivated to push for a probable state takeover, privatization and overhaul of MARTA because they know that rail transit connections will make their commercial land holdings increase in monetary value in the 21st Century in much the way that commercial land holdings increased in value when the Interstate superhighway system was constructed in the 20th Century.

Any business community interest in having the state takeover and expand MARTA under a different name and image that is much more acceptable to affluent suburbanites and exurbanites is because the business community has figured out how much more monetary profit they can collect with expanded rail transit service than without expanded rail transit service.

[bryantm3]

I'm having a hard time believing that I'm the only one who can see it would be a really, really *bad* idea to instate a government monopoly over transit and hand it to a cartel of multinational corporations. Come on y'all. Yeah, traffic is bad but let's keep our heads on straight here.

[primaltech]

In terms of commuter rail for Cobb and Gwinnett and other counties, I don't see why it couldn't be mostly privatized, like maybe 75% funded by a private sector consortium, with 25% coming from state gas tax subsidy or whatever. Freight along those rail corridors is handled by private companies, so why can't passengers?

The fare would be higher to generate revenue, like maybe $9 per ride per person. But, as B2R just said, the main incentive would be TOD. Lucrative new developments both in the city and the suburbs, connected together by passenger rail.

CRT on (modified/widened) existing freight rail corridors makes more sense for that privatization angle than HRT does, because the capital cost of it is so much lower, and the construction disruption and displacement is minimal.

And it might prevent Cobb and Gwinnett and other counties from having to increase their sales tax, something that residents of these counties have long been averse to. They could have maybe increased gas tax and property tax instead. But most of the bill of the initial construction and implementation would be footed by private companies.

To me that sounds like a win-win. The end user pays a higher fare to ride, which the affluent folks of the northern suburbs can afford, but they also don't get their taxes raised by much, which they hate. And then we actually get regional transit.

[bryantm3]

I don't see how $9 fare would be a win-win for anyone except a class of elite people who seem hell-bent on squeezing anyone making under $100K a year out of the metro entirely.