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Old 12-11-2006, 02:27 PM
 
Location: 30328
425 posts, read 1,560,418 times
Reputation: 152

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeweloflight View Post
Price is a small part of the issue. The percentage of blacks in the upper income bracket is high in Atlanta compared to other cities. So while money may be a factor for minorities to some degree, it still doesn't explain why these areas are almost lilly white. I could see if they were at least 10% black, or even 5%, but they're not even that. Blacks staying in their comfort zone is more managable for me to believe, which makes blacks just as guilty as racist sterotyping whites that don't want to mix. When will we stop compartmentalizing ourselves and truly intergrate?

My response was to an idea that somehow the prices are artificially driven up in order to keep the minorities out. That is simply not true. Market forces drive the prices either up or down, it is as simple as supply vs demand.

The only question here should be, "why aren't well-to-do African Americans attracted to Sandy Springs and Dunwoody?" As for me, I do not have an answer to this simple yet complicated socio-economic issue. I can only speculate that the upper middle class minorities are attracted to areas that serve their lifestyle the best.
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Old 12-11-2006, 02:58 PM
 
Location: 30328
425 posts, read 1,560,418 times
Reputation: 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeweloflight View Post
Price is a small part of the issue. The percentage of blacks in the upper income bracket is high in Atlanta compared to other cities. So while money may be a factor for minorities to some degree, it still doesn't explain why these areas are almost lilly white. I could see if they were at least 10% black, or even 5%, but they're not even that. Blacks staying in their comfort zone is more managable for me to believe, which makes blacks just as guilty as racist sterotyping whites that don't want to mix. When will we stop compartmentalizing ourselves and truly intergrate?
African-Americans make up 12% of the total population in Sandy Springs. The data was pulled from yr 2000 census data. Given that 6 years have passed, I would think that the percentage has increased.
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Old 12-11-2006, 03:25 PM
 
Location: Springfield, Missouri
2,814 posts, read 11,893,647 times
Reputation: 2000001281
Quote:
Originally Posted by backfist View Post
You're absolutely right. The best way to guarantee a low Black/Brown population is to inflate home prices. It's done all across the country. But one reason I moved here was because I didn't think that Black Atlantans would fall for that. They have, and it's a disgrace.

What's equally disgraceful are all of the excuses and justification why it's not really a problem.
I completely disagree with you. If you look at your argument again, it just doesn't make sense. You make it sound like all the upper income people (relatively speaking) in this area are participating in some kind of anti-black conspiracy. That's just not logical as firstly, the black population of Sandy Springs is according to the 2000 census 12.04% black. The other residents are 77.55% white, 9.93% hispanic/latino, 3.29% Asian, and about 5% people who describe themselves as another race. The 2004 estimate for blacks as a percentage of the American population is 12.8%. I don't see this "discrimination" you're talking about, and furthermore..it just doesn't hold up logically as anything more than an opinion. You've provided no substantial and verifiable facts, only emotional assumptions. And if you're currently renting in this area and wanting to buy, but haven't, then I can only assume that your income isn't high enough and/or your credit won't qualify you for even an ARM 100% financing loan. Is that anyone's fault? It's clearly a market force that dictates the prices of homes anywhere and to suggest otherwise is rather ...weak.

Last edited by MoMark; 12-11-2006 at 03:57 PM..
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Old 12-12-2006, 05:47 AM
 
Location: Atlanta, GA
2,290 posts, read 4,946,710 times
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Thanks for chiming in from ... Missouri?
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Old 12-12-2006, 06:40 AM
 
1,088 posts, read 5,731,968 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoMark View Post
I completely disagree with you. If you look at your argument again, it just doesn't make sense. You make it sound like all the upper income people (relatively speaking) in this area are participating in some kind of anti-black conspiracy. That's just not logical as firstly, the black population of Sandy Springs is according to the 2000 census 12.04% black. The other residents are 77.55% white, 9.93% hispanic/latino, 3.29% Asian, and about 5% people who describe themselves as another race. The 2004 estimate for blacks as a percentage of the American population is 12.8%. I don't see this "discrimination" you're talking about, and furthermore..it just doesn't hold up logically as anything more than an opinion. You've provided no substantial and verifiable facts, only emotional assumptions. And if you're currently renting in this area and wanting to buy, but haven't, then I can only assume that your income isn't high enough and/or your credit won't qualify you for even an ARM 100% financing loan. Is that anyone's fault? It's clearly a market force that dictates the prices of homes anywhere and to suggest otherwise is rather ...weak.
MoMark I also don't agree that there is some conspiracy by whites to raise hosuing prices to keep the blacks out, but you really don't see blacks living in Sandy Springs. 12.04% black sounds about right but the Atlanta metro area is about 30% black. This would mean that Sandy Springs's black population is way below average for the metro area. Using an US households average is a little deciptive.

Also the next time you come to Atlanta you should try checking out Sandy Springs. Statistics only tell part of the story. There is nothing like a little hands on experience to give some true perspective. Sandy Springs has some lower income communities which are primarily minority. These areas are mostly occupied by hispanics but there are a lot of blacks mixed in. If you go to the upper class neighborhoods or into Dunwoody you will see very few blacks. Atlanta has a large community of middle and upper class blacks and most don't seem to buy into Sandy Springs/Dunwoody or Roswell.
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Old 12-12-2006, 06:55 AM
 
Location: Atlanta, GA
2,290 posts, read 4,946,710 times
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To try and move this toward a positive thread, I intend to buy in the Sandy Springs/Roswell/Dunwoody area. And the more people like me who intend to buy here will make segregation--by all groups--a moot point. There really is nothing to fear.
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Old 12-12-2006, 03:43 PM
 
Location: Atlanta/DC
563 posts, read 2,505,624 times
Reputation: 286
My take:

I want to live someplace where I can easily get things I can use on a regular basis--for example: hair products, food items, etc.

If I lived someplace say, Sandy Springs, how easy would it be for me to get a can of Mizani Oil Sheen in a pinch? Would I have to drive over 20 minutes to get it?

If I wanted to cook curried goat and callaloo for dinner, how easy would it be for me to get it? Can I go to the local Caribbean grocery to pick it up, or would I have to drive to Marietta/Stone Mountain, etc. to purchase these items??


I say this to say that these items aren't readily available in a non-diverse or majority black or Caribbean neighborhood. This is some of the things I considered when looking for a home and I am sure that others like me think of the SAME THING. I'd say it's less about race and more about culture.
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Old 12-12-2006, 03:57 PM
 
Location: Morrisville, North Carolina
465 posts, read 2,210,227 times
Reputation: 372
Quote:
Originally Posted by backfist View Post
To try and move this toward a positive thread, I intend to buy in the Sandy Springs/Roswell/Dunwoody area. And the more people like me who intend to buy here will make segregation--by all groups--a moot point. There really is nothing to fear.
Good, backfist. That's what needs to happen. Let's just hope as many others become assertive and follow that lead, we don't have the ever famous "white flight", as whites tend to run the other direction when the neighborhood starts to get too "diverse".
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Old 12-12-2006, 06:51 PM
 
148 posts, read 789,581 times
Reputation: 102
Default Misguided assumptions

It's just misguided thinking to assume housing prices go up to keep minorities out. If that's the case, whites are paying a penalty, too.

A number of years ago 60 MINUTES profiled a very upscale black neighborhood in metro Atlanta. I think the subdivision was in south DeKalb County, but I'm not positive. The subdivision was beautiful--all brick two-story homes with a minimum of 4000 to 5000 square-feet, and big lots.

Mike Wallace chatted with seven or eight professional blacks in the living room of one homeowner. Most of them were from the North, and migrated to Atlanta because of more advancement opportunties up the corporate ladder. As I recall, most of them had little desire to live in a white subdivision.

Obviously, there's some diversity as to where successful blacks desire to live. Hank Aaron is worth millions, and millions, and million, and he lives in a black community. Six months ago, the AJC had a huge spread about a retired black UPS executive who built a multimillion dollar house in Roswell. This house was huge--maybe 20,000 square feet. The house even had a barber shop.

For whatever reasons, not many successful blacks own upscale homes in the northern suburbs. A few do, but just a few. Blacks can certainly buy a house in white communities if they so wish. However, blacks renting an apartment, in white communities, may be problematic.

Apparently, some apartment managers screen potential renters on the phone. ABC's 20/20 had a segment about this subject. A number of white apartment complexes were targeted by 20/20. Some partment managers, who perceived a caller to be black inquiring about an apartment, told the caller that none were available. If the same apartment manager perceived the caller to be white, apartments were readily available.

Z
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Old 12-13-2006, 12:39 AM
 
31 posts, read 134,110 times
Reputation: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by backfist View Post
I don't know about "plenty" of non-whites here. There's plenty if the purpose is to have very few. There are no doubt folks in Cumming who think there are "plenty" enough non-whites up there.

I agree that the homes in Sandy Springs/Dunwoody are ridiculously priced, and that most people can't afford to buy here. But I think your last sentence is contradictory. Blacks who can afford to buy here are discouraged precisely because the areas have been historically White and non-welcoming, and not simply because of the ability to buy a cheaper house in a cheaper suburb.

p.s. Not to nitpick, but African Americans aren't the poorest minority; Latinos are.

I was mostly talking about Latinos and some Asians who make up a large percentage of residents along Roswell Road, the main road through Sandy Springs. In the areas of Sandy Springs where it is mostly home ownership, yes it overwhelmingly white. I wasn't trying to deny that. I was simply trying to say the area is not all white and any racial group will feel comfortable living there. I respectfully disagree with the reasons many black people don't buy homes there. In my opinion, it is the same reason that I don't look to buy there, it is too expensive. Although, it's possible that some black people dont feel comfortable buying in majority white neighborhoods.

Frankly, I'm surprised you would describe that area as non-welcoming. I don't know what would give you that impression. The area is historically white, yet I'm not sure they are non-welcoming. From the people I have met who own homes there, I won't deny there is some dislike toward other groups of people, but it is poor people.

Residents of Sandy Springs probably do look down upon poor people as many rich tend to do. Yet, they discriminate against poor people, not any type of racial group in my opinion. I have never heard of potential black buyers being discouraged bc the area is historically white. If you know any, they should file a complaint with the realtor bc that practice is called steering and is illegal.

Also, I'm sure you know that my post had not amount of hatred in it. I don't know why you would focus on my use of the word plenty to try to convey as though there was. I was simply trying to state that any group will be comfortable there.

Also, here is a quote from the census bureau "Black households had the lowest median income in 2004 ($30,134) among race groups. Asian households had the highest median income ($57,518). The median income for non-Hispanic white households was $48,977. Median income for Hispanic households was $34,241." http://www.census.gov/Press-Release/www/releases/archives/income_wealth/005647.html (broken link)

Last edited by kevin44; 12-13-2006 at 01:42 AM..
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