High-Rise Apartment Rents Falter While Older Properties Flourish (Atlanta, Glenwood: fit in, condo)

[arjay57]

I can tell you right now that if you started allowing developers to slap up inexpensive zero lot line multifamily housing with no parking anywhere they pleased in single family neighborhoods, you'd have an explosion such as never imagined.

[chiatldal]

Midtown during the 80's


Midtown ended up growing into a CBD




if Quote fourthwarden " Tokyo should be our guide more in how to do this well." Would it make more sense in low develop areas that have density potential instead historic SFH neighborhoods? On the Westside there even amount of land for develop, with a portions that could follow Midtown footsteps. but yall fucos about Atlanta SFH neighborhoods why?

West midtown

https://d2v9y0dukr6mq2.cloudfront.ne...ail-full01.png

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by chiatldal

But again yall mind set is that the only way Multi units came be in SFH neighborhoods is for them be more "open" when it's not, Your argument should be about changing what the zoning codes are strict towards. Not changing the fact they are strict.

You are very correct on this point. The argument is about changing what the zoning code is strict towards. Zoning and building codes should still be in place for health and safety concerns, that coal powered nuclear waste plant should not be located next to the daycare. But zoning and buildings codes should not be used to dictate stylistic concerns or limit lifestyle preferences.

You keep using Houston as this horror story of terribleness you get without zoning. But Houston is still guilty of some of the most troublesome & limiting zoning requirements such as setbacks and parking minimus. Sure maybe your McMansion can have a ADU or technically be a duplex, but you better not try to build any housing that more urban in style (close to the street / neighboring buildings and without parking). That is not allowed!

I'd say we need to go back more to the level of zoning laws that were around when some of our great leafy neighborhoods like West End, Grant Park, and Cabbagetown were built (without any red lining of course). No setbacks, missing middle housing is all legal, some commercial mixed in, no parking requirements.

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by jsvh

What exactly are you trying to prevent that you see in this photo that so offends you that you feel obligated to deny people their prefered way of living and raise housing prices?

The drastically different sized homes? The poor streetscaping / lacking sidewalk? Our restrictive SFH dominate zoning laws would not have changed that.

Because it looks like crap, that's why. And if you don't live in a deed restricted neighborhood in Houston, there is no zoning. This can and does happen all over town.

And how do you know this is what the neighborhood desires? They don't have any say in the matter, which is actually what you want.

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by arjay57

I can tell you right now that if you started allowing developers to slap up inexpensive zero lot line multifamily housing with no parking anywhere they pleased in single family neighborhoods, you'd have an explosion such as never imagined.

Exactly, and it would be a well-deserved explosion.

I'm about as liberal as they come, but these people are advocating social engineering when it is absolutely not necessary. There is PLENTY of room in Atlanta to house hundreds of thousands of additional residents.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by JMatl

Exactly, and it would be a well-deserved explosion.

I'm about as liberal as they come, but these people are advocating social engineering when it is absolutely not necessary. There is PLENTY of room in Atlanta to house hundreds of thousands of additional residents.

Totally.

Consider Detroit, for example. At its peak it housed 1.9 million people in an area almost identical in size to the city of Atlanta. And it did so with miles and miles of gracious single family neighborhoods on spacious individual lots. See, e.g., https://goo.gl/k7a1YX

We are FAR from facing such an Armageddon that we need to turn the developers loose on our treasured neighborhoods.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by JMatl

Because it looks like crap, that's why. And if you don't live in a deed restricted neighborhood in Houston, there is no zoning. This can and does happen all over town.

And how do you know this is what the neighborhood desires? They don't have any say in the matter, which is actually what you want.

But what exactly is it that you think looks like "crap" that so offends you that you think we need to deny people affordable urban living options as a result? And Houston still has parking minimums and housing setbacks and those contribute far more to the assetic issues you see there than allowing missing middle housing options you see in great neighborhoods like Grant Park, West End, and Cabbagetown.

And yes, there are some things the "neighborhood" / political leaders should not have a say in. Some of the first zoning laws were to keep out other races the "neighborhood" didn't want. Today zoning laws are being used to keep housing unaffordable and thus keep out people the "neighborhood" doesn't want that way. That is what many of these "Protect Single Family Home" / NIMBY mind set type folks are often really mascorading behind, they still don't want the poor / other races mixing with them. Both those practices are wrong and no, "neighborhoods" should not have that power.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by arjay57

Consider Detroit, for example. At its peak it housed 1.9 million people in an area almost identical in size to the city of Atlanta. And it did so with miles and miles of gracious single family neighborhoods on spacious individual lots. See, e.g., https://goo.gl/k7a1YX

You do realize that even those homes would not meet the zoning requirements in most of the metro, correct? Even their side-yard setbacks are far to close to meet the requirements for most SFH zonings withing the city limits, let alone the suburbs.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by JMatl

Exactly, and it would be a well-deserved explosion.

I'm about as liberal as they come, but these people are advocating social engineering when it is absolutely not necessary. There is PLENTY of room in Atlanta to house hundreds of thousands of additional residents.

No reducing these restrictions is advocating reducing the "social engineering" that is in place. You need to get over the possibility that a poor family could move in next door to you.

Atlanta has enough land to continue to sprawl as it has been. But we need to stop forcing the poor outward and start giving people real affordable urban options as well. That requires legalizing things like your feared missing middle housing.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by jsvh

You do realize that even those homes would not meet the zoning requirements in most of the metro, correct? Even their side-yard setbacks are far to close to meet the requirements for most SFH zonings withing the city limits, let alone the suburbs.

Garden Hills, Springlake, Candler Park, etc., etc., would all fit nicely in that kind of setting, jsvh.