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Old 01-12-2019, 11:43 AM
 
10,394 posts, read 7,363,364 times
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Some how hearing that the death rate in cars is better than fighting in certain wars doesn't make me feel it is a safe method we should have our children around and be encouraging most people to use most the time...
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Old 01-12-2019, 04:55 PM
 
Location: Kirkwood
23,045 posts, read 17,212,875 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samiwas1 View Post
True. There were about 1.8 million troops total over the war, with 40,000 deaths. A rate of 2,222 per 100,000. Driving has a rate of about 11.4 per 100,000. In case you were wondering, that's a rate 0.5% the rate of war deaths. Also, note that the number of driving deaths now is almost equal to the time period of the Korean war, even though population has doubled, and miles driven are between 5 and 6 times higher. We are well below even actual numbers from the 60s, 70s, and early 80s, and a fraction of other metrics.

Also, falling accounts for close to as many deaths as driving. I'm betting a good number of those are on those concrete death-walks (can we call sidewalks that now?).



What about all the people who live in the city and drive around it? Screw them? Do you honestly think the vast majority of city residents are walking and biking everywhere, or even would?
It's not like cars are being entirely banned, instead making it safer for PEOPLE to get around using alternative Transportation. Adding lanes is not happening, so we need to use the infrastructure we have to allow people the ability to opt out of traffic.
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Old 01-12-2019, 06:09 PM
 
4,809 posts, read 3,173,079 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsvh View Post
Some how hearing that the death rate in cars is better than fighting in certain wars doesn't make me feel it is a safe method we should have our children around and be encouraging most people to use most the time...
Quote:
Originally Posted by cqholt View Post
It's not like cars are being entirely banned, instead making it safer for PEOPLE to get around using alternative Transportation. Adding lanes is not happening, so we need to use the infrastructure we have to allow people the ability to opt out of traffic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Street Advocate View Post
It doesn’t matter if people drive or not- we have to build for people and communities. The more communities we have- the shorter distances anyone would have to drive anywhere else. Stop acting like driving is the only way or that anyone is saying you cannot own a car. Your excuses are exhausted.
What's getting exhausting is the endless false info thrown out by some advocates here (drivers get huge subsidies while transit users pay so much, for instance); the frequent use of terms such as "car sewer", "death machine", and "pedestrian killer"; the excessive use of thirteen buzzwords when trying to support their position; the apparent lack of realization that "people" drive cars; and the complete refusal of these people to accept that pedestrians and bikers should have even a modicum of responsibility for their own safety.

Once we can get past this and have a discussion rooted in facts instead of urbanist propaganda usually rooted in complete fallacy, we can be much more productive. The fact of the matter is that it is not practical nor reasonable to have an entire metro of 20MPH neighborhood complete streets. So, instead of consistently advocating for that, how about something slightly more reasonable in which everyone can get places reasonably, not giving a minuscule percentage of people the majority of the space.

I am not or have never said that driving is the only way. But, I have correctly said that it is the most-used and most-desirable way for most. This whole idea that we need to dismantle a large portion of our road network in order to make it slightly easier for a few people to get around is just silly. Our road network is already terrible. Make it worse, and the city isn't going to fare well. If even 20% of the people moved to transit and alternative methods, we would still need the vast majority of our road network as the city grows.
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Old 01-13-2019, 08:03 PM
 
233 posts, read 56,189 times
Reputation: 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by samiwas1 View Post
What's getting exhausting is the endless false info thrown out by some advocates here (drivers get huge subsidies while transit users pay so much, for instance); the frequent use of terms such as "car sewer", "death machine", and "pedestrian killer"; the excessive use of thirteen buzzwords when trying to support their position; the apparent lack of realization that "people" drive cars; and the complete refusal of these people to accept that pedestrians and bikers should have even a modicum of responsibility for their own safety.

Once we can get past this and have a discussion rooted in facts instead of urbanist propaganda usually rooted in complete fallacy, we can be much more productive. The fact of the matter is that it is not practical nor reasonable to have an entire metro of 20MPH neighborhood complete streets. So, instead of consistently advocating for that, how about something slightly more reasonable in which everyone can get places reasonably, not giving a minuscule percentage of people the majority of the space.

I am not or have never said that driving is the only way. But, I have correctly said that it is the most-used and most-desirable way for most. This whole idea that we need to dismantle a large portion of our road network in order to make it slightly easier for a few people to get around is just silly. Our road network is already terrible. Make it worse, and the city isn't going to fare well. If even 20% of the people moved to transit and alternative methods, we would still need the vast majority of our road network as the city grows.
If you’ve ever had a conversation with me about building a transportation network you’d know I include expanding the street grid and specific road capacities. After all, it’s called a {%[^% transportation network, meaning integration of various infrastructure and methods of getting around. I’ve never said ignore roads. You, however, are repeatedly obsessed with defending roads no matter the benefits of alternatives. Stop acting like you’re some omniscient transpiration genius. If anything you repeatedly out yourself as being iunfamiliar with transportation planning and insert yourself as an obstructionist toward helping create a better alternative than the current.

For those curious about complete streets/road diets- “A Wonderfully Clear Explanation of How Road Diets Work”:
https://www.citylab.com/design/2015/...mpaign=citylab

For those more curious on the technical side of things, “10-Foot Traffic Lanes Are Safer—and Still Move Plenty of Cars”:
https://www.citylab.com/solutions/20...f-cars/399761/

Last edited by Street Advocate; 01-13-2019 at 08:27 PM..
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Old 01-14-2019, 06:47 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
23,045 posts, read 17,212,875 times
Reputation: 5259
Quote:
The fact of the matter is that it is not practical nor reasonable to have an entire metro of 20MPH neighborhood complete streets.
Do you see Memorial Dr having lanes removed for bike lanes and speed limit reduced? No, instead they are removing the dangerous contraflow lane and replacing it with center turn lane to improve safety for DRIVERS. Making bicycle improvements to parallel streets (Trolley Line Trail, Woodward Ave) but drivers still want to speed down Woodward to avoid traffic on Memorial Dr. So even when we acknowledge that some streets are going to be prioritized for cars, drivers still want more.
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Old 04-13-2019, 12:22 PM
 
359 posts, read 136,494 times
Reputation: 424
New app allows Atlantans to report illegally parked e-scooters

Cellphone tool catalogues and reports e-scooters behaving badly

https://atlanta.curbed.com/2019/4/12...ar-the-clutter
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Old 04-13-2019, 03:12 PM
 
4,809 posts, read 3,173,079 times
Reputation: 3177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Street Advocate View Post
If you’ve ever had a conversation with me about building a transportation network you’d know I include expanding the street grid and specific road capacities. After all, it’s called a {%[^% transportation network, meaning integration of various infrastructure and methods of getting around. I’ve never said ignore roads. You, however, are repeatedly obsessed with defending roads no matter the benefits of alternatives. Stop acting like you’re some omniscient transpiration genius. If anything you repeatedly out yourself as being iunfamiliar with transportation planning and insert yourself as an obstructionist toward helping create a better alternative than the current.
Never saw this back when it was posted, but it popped up today in a thread bump. Look through my post history. I am absolutely not against transit expansion, and have, in fact, pushed for it on many occasions. I think we need her more heavy rail and commuter rail. Many places could use light rail. I supported the streetcar early on, until I realized how badly-implemented it was. I'm not that jazzed about busses and stuff. So, you can stop with the "obsessed with defending roads no matter what". Calling out bull**** from certain people repeatedly using "alternative facts" to back up their desired ways is not "defending no matter what"...it's calling out bull****. I try to always post information directly from organization budgets or fact books in order to back up what I am saying, instead of relying on 5-, 10-, or even 40-year-old information from blogs and urbanist research sites.

But, that doesn't mean that any alternative transit plan is a good one that will help anything or solve any problems. In many places, shutting down a lane to "add capacity" will only lead to more congestion and issues, as the new route likely doesn't serve everyone who used the road previously. So, you end up with fewer people, not more, getting through. That's a sometimes bad plan. While the 10th Street bike lane is a nice thing for bikers and scooters and gives them a safer place, and by theoretical definitions "added capacity" and provided an alternative, the throughput of that lane went from more than 3,500 people per day to far fewer than 1,000. So, a good thing to those who use it, but it didn't really provide any relief.

I also don't think I accused you of wanting to shut down streets, but others here have on many occasions, without giving even the slightest thought to the repercussions in some areas. Simply taking a lane away and adding a bike lanes or bus lane and "adding capacity" does not mean that the result will be better and more people will be served. That's the kind of BS I take issue with, and the kind of BS I like to debate.
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Old 04-15-2019, 06:23 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
23,045 posts, read 17,212,875 times
Reputation: 5259
Quote:
Originally Posted by samiwas1 View Post
In many places, shutting down a lane to "add capacity" will only lead to more congestion and issues, as the new route likely doesn't serve everyone who used the road previously. So, you end up with fewer people, not more, getting through.
That certainly is not the case with Ponce de Leon and the new reversible lane removal on Memorial Dr. Both are showing increased through put after the new striping plan.
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Old 04-15-2019, 06:48 AM
 
Location: Decatur, GA
5,175 posts, read 3,943,971 times
Reputation: 2713
Memorial sure isn't, it's definitely a lot worse now.
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Old 04-15-2019, 07:20 AM
 
Location: Kirkwood
23,045 posts, read 17,212,875 times
Reputation: 5259
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattCW View Post
Memorial sure isn't, it's definitely a lot worse now.
That is not the traffic count data that GDOT has provided to NPUs as feedback. It may feel worse, but even with the slower speeds, more vehicles are moving through choke points, like Moreland.
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