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Old 01-11-2019, 07:16 PM
 
Location: Washington DC
3,314 posts, read 2,974,414 times
Reputation: 2244

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL View Post
BTW, I'm totally for a massive rail system. I just think buses are a waste of time and money.
I assume you never lived in a place with a large massive rail system. Especially in a place like Atlanta where I’m assuming infrastructure is pedestrian unfriendly even if there are sidewalks.

Say Marta train went out to suburban ATL. Buses would be key to circulating people that last couple miles to your destination. If you have to go to work, would you want to schlep across streets on Busy roads, walk a couple miles for 30 or so minutes? Or have a bus take you there in a few minutes?


IMO, bus routes are key to the success of suburban rail stops
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Old 01-11-2019, 07:26 PM
 
7,867 posts, read 9,752,442 times
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Quote:
IMO, bus routes are key to the success of suburban rail stops
I'm not saying you're wrong.

But I envision an extremely robust network of rail throughout downtown, midtown, Buckhead, and maybe a few other places. I mean, I'd like to see a network so good, that you can easily walk to a station from almost anywhere in town. So you wouldn't really need buses in the city, you could use the train.

Then I'd like to see spurs to the suburbs that more or less mirror the interstates. I envision these as "drive to" stations. Hopefully, businesses located nearby would provide shuttles, rideshare, scooters and whatever last mile idea private enterprise comes up with next could pick up the rest of the slack. There wouldn't be a wide need for buses since these areas would still remain car dependent for getting around the local area.
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Old 01-11-2019, 07:41 PM
 
10,112 posts, read 7,109,189 times
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Drive-to stations rarely find much success. Buses are the main feeders even to those stations with large decks. Most people that drive to a station usually will just drive on to their destination. Car storage is a very poor use of the valuable land around a transit station anyways.

Maybe in a decade or two with the continued rise of ride-sharing services & autonomous cars that will change how people get to rails stations, but for now buses are key feeders. And things like BRT and ART with dedicated RoW will make the most sense on many higher capacity suburban routes for the foreseeable future.
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Old 01-11-2019, 07:56 PM
 
7,867 posts, read 9,752,442 times
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Quote:
Drive-to stations rarely find much success. Buses are the main feeders even to those stations with large decks
Do you have any proof to back this claim up?

Are you telling me all those people who live upstate or on Long Island and take commuter rail into New York are taking buses to the stations?

It might be right, I just find it difficult to believe because somebody said so.
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:07 PM
 
10,112 posts, read 7,109,189 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL View Post
Are you telling me all those people who live upstate or on Long Island and take commuter rail into New York are taking buses to the stations?
Of course not. Such an absolute would be very silly. But most do not park at stations. There are only about 34,000 total spaces at all LIRR stations and they have a daily ridership of 354,800. So ~10% drive and park at stations if every space is filled?
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:26 PM
 
7,867 posts, read 9,752,442 times
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Yeah, that sure didn't sound right to me.

Thanks for clearing it up.

Everybody hates buses. Accept it.
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Old 01-11-2019, 10:33 PM
 
Location: Decatur, GA
5,000 posts, read 3,808,057 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL View Post
*SNIP*

Everybody hates buses. Accept it.
Buses have their place. It's when we try to use them inappropriately like Xpress or Cobb or GCT's commuter routes that people hate them. Or like most of the routes around Atlanta, they don't serve where people need to go, take too long to get where they do go, and don't run frequently enough to be useful. Atlanta's bus systems have virtually no redeeming qualities whatsoever. Maybe fluffy things like wifi...but that's it. MARTA's bus system should have been redesigned, instead they did a pathetic "comprehensive operations analysis" that is proposing to reduce service in most cases and not adding any substantially new routes, particularly not around the city itself, and the few "circulator" routes that exist are 60-65 minute headways.
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Old Yesterday, 12:01 AM
 
1,296 posts, read 673,744 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL View Post
Yeah, that sure didn't sound right to me.

Thanks for clearing it up.

Everybody hates buses. Accept it.
Yep. I don't want to focus on buses at all. No one ever talks about the "amazing bus network" in any city. It's always trains and subways.

Why?

Because a bus solves absolutely nothing for the average commuter. It sits in the same traffic, and usually takes more time due to frequent stops and routing that may not go exactly from point A to B. If my option is only a bus, I'll just drive - if I am going to be on the road anyway, I might as well do it in my own comfortable car. What problem as a car driver does the bus solve for me?

Trains and subways are a whole different animal. They skip traffic entirely. A well made train system (I.e. Tokyo) can get you basically anywhere in the city just by walking. If Atlanta had train stations all over, no one would need buses. I never rode a bus once in Tokyo because I was always <8 mins walk or so from a train station.

Hate buses, love trains and subways. Wish none of the transit tax we pay went to investing in buses.
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Old Yesterday, 12:24 AM
 
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Tokyo's train system is amazing.

Even with all the private companies and different lines requiring different fares, it's still a hell of a lot faster than a bus. Once you figure it out, it's not hard at all.

I don't remember even seeing a bus in Tokyo. I had to look up if they have them there. Turns out they do, but everybody rides the train, so I'm not sure exactly what purpose they serve.
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Old Yesterday, 08:13 AM
 
3,481 posts, read 8,593,150 times
Reputation: 1987
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forhall View Post
Yep. I don't want to focus on buses at all. No one ever talks about the "amazing bus network" in any city. It's always trains and subways.

Why?

Because a bus solves absolutely nothing for the average commuter. It sits in the same traffic, and usually takes more time due to frequent stops and routing that may not go exactly from point A to B. If my option is only a bus, I'll just drive - if I am going to be on the road anyway, I might as well do it in my own comfortable car. What problem as a car driver does the bus solve for me?

Trains and subways are a whole different animal. They skip traffic entirely. A well made train system (I.e. Tokyo) can get you basically anywhere in the city just by walking. If Atlanta had train stations all over, no one would need buses. I never rode a bus once in Tokyo because I was always <8 mins walk or so from a train station.

Hate buses, love trains and subways. Wish none of the transit tax we pay went to investing in buses.
I used buses in the suburbs of Tokyo because it was about a 30 minute walk to the nearest train station.
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