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Old 07-26-2019, 01:50 PM
 
Location: 30080
2,228 posts, read 3,541,202 times
Reputation: 1672

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4Camaro View Post
Most of these vehicle are stolen and they are not required to be registered because they are not street legal to begin with. They won't have tags.

Still doesn't even come remotely close to being a situation for lethal force. We aren't north korea good grief.

 
Old 07-26-2019, 01:59 PM
 
Location: Formerly Pleasanton Ca, now in Marietta Ga
5,552 posts, read 4,141,769 times
Reputation: 7384
Quote:
Originally Posted by toll_booth View Post
Cameras and license plate detectors for starters. Police don't need to pull over the ATVs the second they see them.

In extreme situations cops might need to shoot out tires. But this could aggravate the riders and I don't recommend it except as a last resort.
So how do you arrest the rider. They often have headgear hiding them. Unless you plan on arresting the registered owner whether they were driving or not.

You donít t think lethal means should be used by the police, yet advocate shooting out tires. Thatís just silly. Iíll bet youíve never fired a gun. Do you have any idea how hard it is to hit a small moving object like a tire moving at 20 mph? And at a distance. The likelihood of missed shots hitting bystanders and property is extremely high. Thatís just a knuckle headed idea from someone who hasnít thought it out and thinks every leo is a fantasy deadeye gunslinger like in the westerns. No doubt you have probably suggested cops donít take lethal shots but instead take warning shots or shoot guns out of criminal hands.
 
Old 07-26-2019, 08:07 PM
 
2,168 posts, read 860,610 times
Reputation: 1714
Quote:
Originally Posted by brownhornet View Post
Still doesn't even come remotely close to being a situation for lethal force. We aren't north korea good grief.
Sure let em live as they continue endangering countless innocent bystanders mindless and carelessly while doing practically little about it as they plainly get the idea that they can get away with it again and again (which is why it still happens). There are times where its okay to put down a bad dog, and times when it plainly has to be done for the better cause. When they plainly exhibit over and over again their complete disregard to the law and other people's lives, what other means do you really think are going to reach them. There's a difference between a dictatorship dictating the direction of civilian lives and defending peace with force when it comes to be necessary.
 
Old 07-26-2019, 08:33 PM
 
15,366 posts, read 27,592,472 times
Reputation: 18837
Ok, that's enough - let's keep this civil.
 
Old 07-26-2019, 10:05 PM
 
1,828 posts, read 1,866,214 times
Reputation: 1671
The police are really using a lot of patience with these guys. I imagine they haven't used the spike strips because it'd be a pile up and riders would be injured--they are riding so close together, popping wheelies, it's surprising they haven't been hurt as it is.
 
Old 07-26-2019, 11:17 PM
 
Location: Georgia
5,263 posts, read 4,305,039 times
Reputation: 3035
Quote:
Originally Posted by aslowdodge View Post
So how do you arrest the rider. They often have headgear hiding them. Unless you plan on arresting the registered owner whether they were driving or not.

You donít t think lethal means should be used by the police, yet advocate shooting out tires. Thatís just silly. Iíll bet youíve never fired a gun. Do you have any idea how hard it is to hit a small moving object like a tire moving at 20 mph? And at a distance. The likelihood of missed shots hitting bystanders and property is extremely high. Thatís just a knuckle headed idea from someone who hasnít thought it out and thinks every leo is a fantasy deadeye gunslinger like in the westerns. No doubt you have probably suggested cops donít take lethal shots but instead take warning shots or shoot guns out of criminal hands.
If you've got a nonlethal method of enforcement then I am all ears.
 
Old 07-27-2019, 06:25 AM
 
4,440 posts, read 4,432,600 times
Reputation: 3512
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4Camaro View Post
I'm for whatever sends the strongest message, if people saw they had to pay a heavy price for their crimes, they would think twice before they committed them.

By all means however deal with it with peace rather than vigilance and see how far that goes... ...oh wait.

Those people aren't brainless, and they aren't being 'forced' to commit these actions. They willingly, voluntarily and carelessly chose to put innocent lives in danger by their actions. Why protect them when they are already at this point where they plainly dont care about the legal system? Not doing anything about it is literally approving their actions.

I gauruntee you, you won't feel so merciful if one of these clowns came through your windshield and killed your wife, or your daughter.
That completely nuts I can't believe you would suggest this, first off it's false, accidents can occur but they goal in it self isn't intentionally to harm people, people also j walk etc does this mean police beat j walker to sends the strongest message? What the heck.



Second off cause US is not 3rd world banana republic, Even criminals themselves have rights and are protected by laws.

Another flaw argue in this thread, is if the cop can't catch them, then that justification for violence, when that's not how that works in the first place. It's rowdy behavior but nothing about this warrants the call for police violence. what you stating is call excessive use of force. Police Jobs are de-escalate problems not making them worst by doing most extreme measure. Police should only use force when dealing with force.

For example your saying 'if one of these clowns came through your windshield and killed your wife, or your daughter.".............. The error if a cop used force on some one moving fast only could increase the likely hood of them loosing control?

The "strongest message" is too increase fines and jail time or something, Not police force

What's tricky about this while it's dangerous riding non street legal vehicular in the street, riding bikes in the street It's nothing more than a misdemeanor of a issue. What make this stands is activity itself it's large crowds. Any time you have large crowds gather with out Reservations on streets and parks it create issues. So I understand what they going for it's basically same appeal as motocross, but the settings are not the most appropriate without the Reservations.
 
Old 07-27-2019, 07:58 AM
 
Location: Formerly Pleasanton Ca, now in Marietta Ga
5,552 posts, read 4,141,769 times
Reputation: 7384
Quote:
Originally Posted by toll_booth View Post
If you've got a nonlethal method of enforcement then I am all ears.
So you say you are against lethal violence by police, but then suggest that the police use ineffective cameras and later arrest which wonít work. As a backup you suggest them drawing out their firearms and firing away in an attempt to shoot out tires meaning multiple rounds flying at random in different directions at them. You probably donít know this, but gun safety dictates you always know where the bullets will wind up in in the end. How many innocent people have been killed or injured by stray bullets? We hear about it every time. The only way to shoot out tires is a rapid fire hope you hit the tire method. Thereís also a good chance to hit the driver.
I donít have an answer except to make the punishment extreme for the few you do catch in hopes of discouraging them.
I am pointing out the contradiction in your police violence comment not being cool, but then suggesting a way that results in perhaps more police violence. Itís just not well thought out, more knee jerk thinking
 
Old 07-27-2019, 08:21 AM
 
Location: Georgia
5,263 posts, read 4,305,039 times
Reputation: 3035
Quote:
Originally Posted by aslowdodge View Post
So you say you are against lethal violence by police, but then suggest that the police use ineffective cameras and later arrest which wonít work. As a backup you suggest them drawing out their firearms and firing away in an attempt to shoot out tires meaning multiple rounds flying at random in different directions at them. You probably donít know this, but gun safety dictates you always know where the bullets will wind up in in the end. How many innocent people have been killed or injured by stray bullets? We hear about it every time. The only way to shoot out tires is a rapid fire hope you hit the tire method. Thereís also a good chance to hit the driver.
I donít have an answer except to make the punishment extreme for the few you do catch in hopes of discouraging them.
I am pointing out the contradiction in your police violence comment not being cool, but then suggesting a way that results in perhaps more police violence. Itís just not well thought out, more knee jerk thinking
I'm asking if you have a better plan. You suggested tougher punishments, which I could get behind.
 
Old 07-27-2019, 09:49 AM
 
Location: Formerly Pleasanton Ca, now in Marietta Ga
5,552 posts, read 4,141,769 times
Reputation: 7384
Quote:
Originally Posted by toll_booth View Post
I'm asking if you have a better plan. You suggested tougher punishments, which I could get behind.
I donít think there is any way unless there is some master kill switch that gets installed in each vehicle that police can use, but that opens a whole new set of problems. I think then we can agree very few can be caught. The only way which we both agree on is much stiffer punishments to hopefully discourage this .
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