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Old 08-02-2019, 03:36 PM
 
29,471 posts, read 26,472,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsvh View Post
These people sleeping on the streets are doing no one any good. We at least need to get them sheltered and provided with food, water, and basic medical care even if it is in prison.
Just to voice a dissenting view, however, don't folks in a free society have the right to sleep outdoors in a public space?

And how is this is different from those who say a man has a right to park his bucket of bolts in front of my house?
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Old 08-02-2019, 04:15 PM
 
3,180 posts, read 1,479,438 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsvh View Post
Think I am deciding we need to have a backstop to end homelessness. We need to make trespassing / loitering / sleeping on public property an accelerating misdemeanor offense. First violation $200 or 24 hours in jail. Next violation goes to a week in jail, then a month.

These people sleeping on the streets are doing no one any good. We at least need to get them sheltered and provided with food, water, and basic medical care even if it is in prison. On release they should be connected with non-profits and other organizations that can help them / provide them housing options outside of jail. But clearly those organizations are not cutting it on their own.

We got to have some backstop for the people on are streets that are unable or unwilling to find other options.

Uh no...How can you justify locking someone up for being homeless? They're homeless...where else are they suppose to sleep at night? Jail should never be an option unless they are being violent. People hate seeing the homeless because they are a reminder of the things we like to ignore in society-mental illness, economic despair, etc.
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Old 08-02-2019, 04:21 PM
 
472 posts, read 127,805 times
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Being homeless is not a crime. Plus some are working poor in between places to live.
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Old 08-02-2019, 06:58 PM
 
10,644 posts, read 7,575,949 times
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Trespassing is a crime. Parking your car / "bucket of bolts" on public or private property without permission is a crime and likely to result in it being towed off and impounded.

What if some people are better off institutionalized? I am fine with providing & connecting folks with other resources to try and support them, but clearly more than that is needed. If you want to host people to stay on your property that is very noble of you and you certainly should. But if people are going to be living public property it should be in a structured environment where food, proper shelter, and medical care are provided. Not just in the gutter left to die.
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Old 08-02-2019, 07:17 PM
 
2,232 posts, read 879,442 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsvh View Post
Trespassing is a crime. Parking your car / "bucket of bolts" on public or private property without permission is a crime and likely to result in it being towed off and impounded.
Leave it to you to bring shame upon automobiles in a thread concerning homeless are suffering and starving on the streets. Way to go! -- I'll come back on page 65.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsvh View Post
What if some people are better off institutionalized? I am fine with providing & connecting folks with other resources to try and support them, but clearly more than that is needed. If you want to host people to stay on your property that is very noble of you and you certainly should. But if people are going to be living public property it should be in a structured environment where food, proper shelter, and medical care are provided. Not just in the gutter left to die.
Agreed. Now....where in the American Dream do we begin?
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Old 08-02-2019, 08:36 PM
 
10,644 posts, read 7,575,949 times
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N4C - Just responding to arjays comment. Not everything has to be about cars.
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Old 08-03-2019, 07:40 AM
 
8,371 posts, read 10,333,567 times
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jsvh has a point.

While it is certainly possible to fall onto hard times, and maybe even go through every safety net you have, almost anybody who has their senses about them would be on the street for a very shot amount of time.

Involuntary institutionalization may be the best option for people who require inpatient mental health care because they are non-compliant with their therapies, or never got proper therapies prescribed. This is likely well more than 50% of the homeless population.

If they can get stabilized and stay that way, many of them would have a chance of actually getting off the street. Some of them, unfortunately, have been neglected for so long, they would likely be unable to ever get their lives together even if they were stabilized because they have limited/no work history and possibly criminal records.

It's not illegal to be homeless. But maybe... it should be? If police could arrest anyone who is sleeping on the street and judges understood how to route the cases to the places that could help the best (not jail), maybe we could make a dent in the problem. That's just a thought.
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Old 08-03-2019, 12:25 PM
 
5,149 posts, read 3,346,294 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLTJL View Post
It's not illegal to be homeless. But maybe... it should be? If police could arrest anyone who is sleeping on the street and judges understood how to route the cases to the places that could help the best (not jail), maybe we could make a dent in the problem. That's just a thought.
Why would it have to be illegal and require arresting people? If we had good, useful, funded places to help people like this, they would probably use it. Not many would choose to live on the street if there were a place with a bed, food, and help available.
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Old 08-03-2019, 12:30 PM
 
8,371 posts, read 10,333,567 times
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It is my understanding that many of the people who require mental health services have been evaluated, have been treated, and are non-compliant with their therapies.

Therefore, it would stand to reason that temporarily incarcerating/institutionalizing them long enough to force treatment to get them stable might help them get to the point where they would remain compliant.

These benefits ARE available to many people, but they do choose not to use them. Yeah, those places could be better, but I'm not convinced that would make people more likely to seek them out.
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Old 08-03-2019, 07:36 PM
 
3,180 posts, read 1,479,438 times
Reputation: 2438
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsvh View Post
Trespassing is a crime. Parking your car / "bucket of bolts" on public or private property without permission is a crime and likely to result in it being towed off and impounded.

What if some people are better off institutionalized? I am fine with providing & connecting folks with other resources to try and support them, but clearly more than that is needed. If you want to host people to stay on your property that is very noble of you and you certainly should. But if people are going to be living public property it should be in a structured environment where food, proper shelter, and medical care are provided. Not just in the gutter left to die.

I'm so confused...
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