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Old 08-05-2019, 04:02 PM
 
29,508 posts, read 26,513,857 times
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I'm sure this would raise protests today but the old Fulton County almshouse was not, in my opinion, a totally bad thing.

It's now the Galloway School on West Wieuca. Before it was closed, the farm had become largely self-sufficient and produced much of its own food. There are many stories of people who lived there for a while after the bottom fell out and they were able to get back on their feet. Many worked and gained skills and a sense of purpose.

I'd recommend Rev. Henry Hope's book. He is the grandson of Dr. Robert Hope, who was the long time superintendent.

https://oaklandcemetery.com/robert-lawson-hope/
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Old 08-05-2019, 05:47 PM
 
10,672 posts, read 7,591,665 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waronxmas View Post
This would be exceedingly cruel and most likely in direct violation of the 8th Amendment to the Constitution. No one, literally no one, lives on the streets of major cities because they want to. They are there because they have run out of options and have no one to fall back on for various reasons.

Imagine if you will that you had no family or close friends. You lose your job, have no savings, and you find yourself in a bind for a day or two. You don't have enough money even for a cheap motel, so you go down to the homeless shelter to grab a bed while you sort things out. There's only one problem: You got there too late and all of the beds have been taken. In this (very common and not even far fetched) scenario you're only left with the option of finding someplace on the street to stay for the night.
Yeah, does look like it is an 8th amendment violation if you don't provide enough shelters to house folks: https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...oors-is-cruel/

So I think you just build special minimum security facilities that also can double as voluntary shelters for folks that way you always have enough shelter space. So you can go in on your own choosing or if you are found in violation of these laws you would be required to stay. It also would have the added benefit of separating folks from more violent offenders and should be more affordable to operate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by waronxmas View Post
In your system, you're either going to jail (and have to find a way to bail out) or you now have to figure out a way to pay $200. How pray tell would someone in that situation pay for such a bill? Should we then jail them at a far greater expense than just opening additional homeless shelters because they are now debtors? What crime are we actually punishing here, the crime of having bad luck?

How does this even begin to fix the problem of aggressive panhandling, particularly for those aggressive panhandlers (which if you ask me are larger percentage than you think) aren't even homeless?
Fair point. The law should apply to panhandling as well. Not just sleeping on the streets.

Probably scrap the fine too. Think I was thinking it would prevent those with means from getting penalized if they pass out on the sidewalk one night. But yeah, I prefer not making special exceptions. Lock them up for 24 hours too. They probably need to spend the night in a drunk tank anyways.

The point is getting people off sleeping on the streets, away from any potential vices. And connected with food, water, shelter, healthcare, and hopefully other services.

Last edited by jsvh; 08-05-2019 at 06:00 PM..
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Old 08-05-2019, 06:27 PM
 
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...Also, "jail" seems to a trigger to some. Maybe we just call them shelters. And some of the people there may just be there because they are required to stay there for a certain number of days for violating certain laws like sleeping on the streets, trespassing, or panhandling.
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Old 08-05-2019, 07:28 PM
 
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Relevant article with some good stats: https://www.ajc.com/news/local/torpy...r1VUu3nPpODNM/
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Old 08-05-2019, 07:39 PM
bu2
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4Camaro View Post
For some reason I don't like the idea of being 'arrested' - although they definitely do need to be 'admitted' if that makes sense... don't want to make them feel criminal or especially treated like criminals and I just get a bad vibe that (although I agree they need to be institutionalized) the system and people will be abused. Alot of those people do not go to shelters because of what really happens there. (drugs, needles, other very bad things if you're a woman for the lack of easier ways of explaining) and I can't help but feel that alot of these people will be abused by a government system and treated like individuals without rights.

In a ideal world though... without getting too deep into politics - instead of us spending billions on other nations and walls - fix the problems right here on homeland by developing institutions dedicated for these people rather than neglecting them and putting them out of sight out of mind.
Institutionalizing as was done is exactly that-putting them out of sight, out of mind.
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Old 08-05-2019, 07:46 PM
bu2
 
10,183 posts, read 6,532,696 times
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Getting help can be intimidating for some of these people.

https://psmag.com/social-justice/how...among-veterans

"...They mapped out how many different steps a veteran would have to take to get into permanent housing and found that the process required over 150 different steps, from securing a photo ID and birth certificate to filling out nearly identical paperwork for the housing authority and the VA—the sort of bureaucratic obstacles that can be daunting for anyone, even the most organized professionals.

"We got it down to 50-60 steps," says Eva Thibaudeau-Graczyk, vice president of programs for the Houston Coalition for the Homeless. The process of streamlining these steps included changing the documents required by the local housing authority to include alternate forms of ID, and having the VA and housing authority share paperwork.

"We started to learn the power of navigation, and take [homeless veterans] one-on-one through each step of the process," Thibaudeau-Graczyk says. "We'd drive them, wait with them, visit properties with them too....""
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Old 08-05-2019, 08:16 PM
 
8,396 posts, read 10,354,211 times
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What are all the social workers out there doing?

I have a friend who is a social worker who spends most of his time getting people insurance through the Affordable Care Act, Medicare or Medicaid.

Surely there are also social workers out there who specialize in helping people fill out the necessary forms to get housing.
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Old 08-05-2019, 09:56 PM
 
481 posts, read 169,634 times
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I’d rather be on the street than arrested and put in jail.

Who the hell wants to rot in a cage and get a criminal record on top of it?
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Old 08-05-2019, 10:06 PM
 
461 posts, read 306,284 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arjay57 View Post
From what I've read here, these wimpy hotel guests need to mentally toughen up and recognize they are in an urban setting. Walk with confidence, keep your head on a swivel and don't let it be known that you may have valuables.




Doesn't seem like that is happening after watching this video, as far as guests mentally toughening up. rofl
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Old 08-06-2019, 10:32 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Otakumaster View Post
I’d rather be on the street than arrested and put in jail.

Who the hell wants to rot in a cage and get a criminal record on top of it?
This is a misdemeanor so not really a "criminal record".

Think most would be better off "rotting" with shelter, food, water, and healthcare than on the street. Shouldn't people have the choice of going into a minimum security "shelter" by choice at least? Because I think most would prefer it over the street.

And what do you think is the solution to those that have serve issues and continue to live on the street and / or aggressively panhandle / trespass?
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