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Old 09-23-2020, 06:17 PM
 
1,457 posts, read 557,250 times
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ATLANTA - There is a critical shortage of police officers in Atlanta. That is what police personnel records show, as the city is down approximately 400 officers available immediately to hit the street..."

FULL STORY/VIDEO: https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/atl...ge-of-officers

SOURCE: Fox 5 Atlanta
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Old 09-23-2020, 07:00 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
7,046 posts, read 8,434,811 times
Reputation: 5146
It's a shame. I'm not really surprised. I wouldn't be a police officer in Atlanta right now either.

The bad part is if they end up having to scrape the bottom of the barrel in the future, it might have a negative influence on the quality of policing.

Their 2019 annual report shows they had 1,900 sworn officers.

A few things not readily available from the article... Did they mean down to 400 officers? Did they mean down by 400 officers?

Also, many of those officers are specialty officers, detectives, management, etc... Were they referring to just certain types of patrolmen when citing 400 officers 'to hit the street,' in which case it isn't including parts of the force.

The article is not very clear.
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Old 09-24-2020, 12:34 PM
 
6,240 posts, read 2,537,275 times
Reputation: 4668
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwkimbro View Post
It's a shame. I'm not really surprised. I wouldn't be a police officer in Atlanta right now either.

The bad part is if they end up having to scrape the bottom of the barrel in the future, it might have a negative influence on the quality of policing.

Their 2019 annual report shows they had 1,900 sworn officers.

A few things not readily available from the article... Did they mean down to 400 officers? Did they mean down by 400 officers?

Also, many of those officers are specialty officers, detectives, management, etc... Were they referring to just certain types of patrolmen when citing 400 officers 'to hit the street,' in which case it isn't including parts of the force.

The article is not very clear.
I was trying to figure the bolded out as well.

In any event though, what do you feel can be done at this point? .. or more importantly, if you could re-imagine APD, what changes would you make? .. without getting too political about KLB -- I'm speaking more in terms of at a department level, do you feel anything could change to bring in better officers?
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Old 09-24-2020, 12:50 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
7,046 posts, read 8,434,811 times
Reputation: 5146
I mean it's hard for it to not get political.

There was an overzealous prosecutor pressing charges against these guys that are clearly having to deal with questionable and dangerous situations where people do not cooperate and fight them. Things were turned legal at times they should be held-accountable through the APD ranks.

Then you add the added hours of work they had to do, while people were openly on camera trying to bait them, fight them, spit at them, throw bottles or Urine at them and they just patiently stand there.... then add the threat a prosecutor will legally press charges against them should one thing go wrong or get misconstrued in the chaos.

If you legally punish them, it will have an effect an on morale. I'm not sure what you do.... What I do know is I would not put myself on the APD, if I was in that line of work.

You have to create a better line of protecting officer's whose job force them into rapidly changing situations that turn dangerous, while finding the right balance of punishing them when things go wrong. The public is often out for blood these days and that was reflected by the DA's actions at the time. This has been politicized and it is the problem.

Last edited by cwkimbro; 09-24-2020 at 01:29 PM..
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Old 09-24-2020, 02:56 PM
 
2,411 posts, read 1,744,705 times
Reputation: 3617
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwkimbro View Post
I mean it's hard for it to not get political.

There was an overzealous prosecutor pressing charges against these guys that are clearly having to deal with questionable and dangerous situations where people do not cooperate and fight them. Things were turned legal at times they should be held-accountable through the APD ranks.

Then you add the added hours of work they had to do, while people were openly on camera trying to bait them, fight them, spit at them, throw bottles or Urine at them and they just patiently stand there.... then add the threat a prosecutor will legally press charges against them should one thing go wrong or get misconstrued in the chaos.

If you legally punish them, it will have an effect an on morale. I'm not sure what you do.... What I do know is I would not put myself on the APD, if I was in that line of work.

You have to create a better line of protecting officer's whose job force them into rapidly changing situations that turn dangerous, while finding the right balance of punishing them when things go wrong. The public is often out for blood these days and that was reflected by the DA's actions at the time. This has been politicized and it is the problem.
All very well said.

There is no upside right now to serving as a police officer. Always being filmed, baited, having the burden of proof on you for everything. BLM police-hate chants being sung along the beltline. That's on top of the low pay, and a mayor who doesn't have your back, this is what you get. To be fair, KLB increased their pay, but subsequently used it as a way of asking them to comply with everything.
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Old 09-24-2020, 03:05 PM
 
Location: Vinings/Cumberland in the evil county of Cobb
1,311 posts, read 1,304,280 times
Reputation: 1516
Quote:
Originally Posted by Citykid3785 View Post
All very well said.

There is no upside right now to serving as a police officer. Always being filmed, baited, having the burden of proof on you for everything. BLM police-hate chants being sung along the beltline. That's on top of the low pay, and a mayor who doesn't have your back, this is what you get. To be fair, KLB increased their pay, but subsequently used it as a way of asking them to comply with everything.
Imagine the lack of upside to being a black person in a society that requires you to constantly justify our presence. You always are filmed, baited and the burden of proof is on you for everything. The burden of your entire race is predicated on your behavior. Every office/store etc that you enter, you have to prove you are worthy to be trusted. Every elevator you enter, hallway, lobby you enter you are burdened to make others feel comfortable.

...and the pay sucks
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Old 09-24-2020, 03:35 PM
 
2,411 posts, read 1,744,705 times
Reputation: 3617
Quote:
Originally Posted by glovenyc View Post
Imagine the lack of upside to being a black person in a society that requires you to constantly justify our presence. You always are filmed, baited and the burden of proof is on you for everything. The burden of your entire race is predicated on your behavior. Every office/store etc that you enter, you have to prove you are worthy to be trusted. Every elevator you enter, hallway, lobby you enter you are burdened to make others feel comfortable.

...and the pay sucks
I'm sorry you feel that way.


But This is a thread about police officers, not race

Last edited by Citykid3785; 09-24-2020 at 03:49 PM..
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Old 09-24-2020, 03:56 PM
bu2
 
16,794 posts, read 8,589,807 times
Reputation: 7398
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwkimbro View Post
I mean it's hard for it to not get political.

There was an overzealous prosecutor pressing charges against these guys that are clearly having to deal with questionable and dangerous situations where people do not cooperate and fight them. Things were turned legal at times they should be held-accountable through the APD ranks.

Then you add the added hours of work they had to do, while people were openly on camera trying to bait them, fight them, spit at them, throw bottles or Urine at them and they just patiently stand there.... then add the threat a prosecutor will legally press charges against them should one thing go wrong or get misconstrued in the chaos.

If you legally punish them, it will have an effect an on morale. I'm not sure what you do.... What I do know is I would not put myself on the APD, if I was in that line of work.

You have to create a better line of protecting officer's whose job force them into rapidly changing situations that turn dangerous, while finding the right balance of punishing them when things go wrong. The public is often out for blood these days and that was reflected by the DA's actions at the time. This has been politicized and it is the problem.
Short of getting rid of the mayor, I don't know what could be done. The DA is gone. Don't know how the new DA will handle things.

I can't imagine anyone willing to be an APD officer. Except maybe a Portland or Seattle officer.
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Old 09-24-2020, 03:59 PM
 
1,597 posts, read 656,390 times
Reputation: 1471
Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4Camaro View Post
I was trying to figure the bolded out as well.

In any event though, what do you feel can be done at this point? .. or more importantly, if you could re-imagine APD, what changes would you make? .. without getting too political about KLB -- I'm speaking more in terms of at a department level, do you feel anything could change to bring in better officers?
Did you see what happened to Paul Howard? That is what Keisha has waiting for her next year. The whole reason we are even discussing this is they both got political and it cost Paul Howard his precious job in a landslide loss. Paul Howard being removed from office was step one in restoring morale. Step two will put an end to this nightmare.
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Old 09-24-2020, 04:22 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
7,046 posts, read 8,434,811 times
Reputation: 5146
Quote:
Originally Posted by bu2 View Post
Short of getting rid of the mayor, I don't know what could be done. The DA is gone. Don't know how the new DA will handle things.

I can't imagine anyone willing to be an APD officer. Except maybe a Portland or Seattle officer.
I have a very different perspective on KLB than the conservatives do, especially the ones that just seem to look for an excuse to politically hang anything left of Fox News.

Atlanta is majority AA, so is the APD.

I think she made a very good attempt at trying to make people feel their voices were heard initially. She didn't create the situation or fan the flames.

I do feel she was perhaps a bit naive to believe how far that would go. I also think she exposed the city to lawsuits by dropping some legitimate charges against some people, because there was a slightest possibility of police misbehavior. To me I feel it inadvertently sent a message that if you can get the police to overreact, it's ok to fight them and ok to disobey a lawful order at an investigation. You have to work on the problems on both sides of the coin.

I'll give her some criticism, but I'm not going to fault her or blame her for trying and making a legitimate attempt at hearing people.

One of the largest problems to come of everything that has happened is people are trapping themselves into creating some type of false Police vs. black people/BLM battle-line. It's coming from both sides of the political spectrum and it really is unproductive and in my viewpoint incorrect.

The APD is called by the public about 800,000x times a year. A majority of it is actually on behalf of black callers that need help and largely the amount of questionable problems are relatively few. The few that happen come from risky situations

I don't want to make the mistake over over-reacting one way or another. That is largely what is fanning the flames in our country, not KLB. In terms of BLM, I think it is important to be careful at the difference of the simple message that is BLM and the way many perceive it vs. looking for the worse messengers/actors within what is otherwise a very broad movement that lacks too much specific messaging and lacks having well-defined leadership that represents its sole messaging. I don't agree with everything I hear from it either, but I'm not going to look for the worse of it for a political jab and I am going to seek some understanding from many on what is really just a simple message that a large portion of the country wants to live their life in the pursuit of happiness without fear.

But I find it doubtful that most voters within the city of Atlanta put KLB and Paul Howard in the same boat. Paul Howard was already embattled from issues he created within how own department and he tried to use a public uprising as a hail-mary in a manner that was reckless.
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