Dekalb-inization of Gwinnett? (Atlanta, Lawrenceville, Duluth: property taxes, debt, work)

[Gradypaces]

Dekalb has been rough for decades. Way rougher than Gwinnett, even with Norcross factored in. Areas of Dekalb have been some of the worst in Georgia and the nation.

I feel for the OP. Gwinnett is becoming a Dekalb and there's not much we can do about it. And we may see these areas get a whole lot worse off. Most of the people I know that lived in Gwinnett have moved out. They're in Athens now.

FYI to all :

The nicer Buckhead gets, the worse Gwinnett will get. Take it to the bank.

[blackrabbit]

All I know is annecdotal evidence at work. All the professionals making over 125k live in Dekalb or Fulton ITP. All the support folks making less live in Gwinnett and talk about how great places like Lawrenceville and Dacula are!!!. Personally all I ever see is traffic, strip malls, chain stores and tract housing when I drive thru Gwinnett plus a water tower saying how great the place is but I guess that appeals to some.

Funny thing they just leveled the last project near me in Brookhaven and word is all the people got vouchers to move to guess where?

[neil0311]

Originally Posted by catlvr

I have lived in Gwinnett County for 17 years and have seen it change dramatically. It is becoming so congested, schools are terribly overcrowded, gangs are in EVERY school cluster, and crime has gone through the roof in the past few years. It didn't used to be this way. I recently heard someone refer to this change as the Dekalb-inization of Gwinnett.

Any thoughts on this?

I'm moved to the Atlanta area the first time in 1982 and lived in both DeKalb and Gwinnett, leaving to move back north in 1992. I can offer an opinion about what both DeKalb and Gwinnett were like then, and what they are like now (from what I can see) after 15 years away.

Dekalb was generally a nice county with some rough areas when I arrived in 1982. I lived in Stone Mtn (near Rays Rd and Memorial Dr) for 2 years and it was a middle class area with little crime. I also lived briefly in Dunwoody and Tucker, with Dunwoody being the nicer of the two but both areas being OK areas with decent schools and minimal crime. Portions of DeKalb were so-so, but they were mostly in S Dekalb, in the area south of Avondale and Decatur, between Stn Mtn and Atlanta. Lithonia was an OK area. I used to shop at Northlake Mall and get on MARTA at Avondale, and I never felt unsafe.

In the early 80's Gwinnett was a suburban, almost rural county. Pleasant Hill Rd before the mall was nothing but a 2 lane road with a 76 truck stop... Buford, Dacula, Duluth, Suwanee and many other parts were just redneckville. Norcross was the up and coming suburb with new high tech businesses on Oakbrook Pkwy and in Peachtree Corners and new homes were popping up. Lilburn and Snellville were getting bigger but still kind of country. Schools were being built and were pretty good. My sister lived here and taught at Berkmar HS, and it was a nice school. Not an illegal alien in sight for the most part. Violent crime in Gwinnett was almost non-existent back then.

If you fast forward to today, DeKalb has changed in a big way. Stone Mtn and other middle class areas are now pretty bad while some areas that were so-so like parts of Decatur have been revived. Overall though, it appears that DeKalb has not changed for the better, and the daily parade of murders, home invasions, car jackings, etc., illustrate that fact in part. It was never that way 20 years ago.

The changes in Gwinnett are even more drastic. The semi-rural areas like Buford, Dacula, and Suwanee are now built out and becoming concrete jungles, while the areas that were the leading edge of development like Norcross and Duluth are changing as crime is increasing and illegal aliens take over. You would never have seen billboards in Spanish in Gwinnett 20 years ago. My sister lived in Lawrenceville and I lived in Duluth. There were 300K people in the county then. Gwinnett isn't the same place today.

[lastminutemom]

Actuallly, many of those people ended up in Chamblee or Doraville. You absolutely can't move to Gwinnett unless you have cars -- and in the case of most of those Hispanic families and others -- they were carless or one car families at most.

DeKalb's problems are more severe than Gwinnett's right now-- not to say that won't change in the future. Overall, Gwinnett's schools are still better -- in part because they have segregation by economics and allow almost no movement of students from one district to another. DeKalb has massive amount of movement, especially at the middle and high school level and this impacts schools negatively. The reality is that it hurts the schools that these kids leave from as well, as generally these are the strongest students and families. DeKalb spends far more on transportation than Gwinnett and this is a profound waste of resources.

I think that the rougher parts of Doraville and Chamblee still have a long ways to go -- look 20 plus years ago the GA Tech city planning department studied inner city neighborhoods that back then were in the beginning stages of gentrification and many of these neighborhoods still have miles to go.

Buford Highway will really only improve with a massive buyout.

[Georgia]

The term of Dekalbinization of Gwinnett came from yours truly.
I have shouted this from the rooftoops for over 2 years.
Other posters have hit the button in regard to this comment, being out of control, rubber stamp developer growth and crime issues moving north from DeKalb into Jimmy Carter to Pleasant Hill.

Today, DeKalb and Gwinnett can provide 2 extremes in regard to county government which come out to equal results. In DeKalb you have "The CEO" Vernon, God Help us all if he wins the Senate seat. Cynthia McKinney II anyone? who's wink wink, nod nod, to his buds has led DeKalb into financial turmoil.
In today's Gwinnett, we have, well let's just call it the Ole' Slappem' on the Back White Bread Blue Bloods who have became developer patsy's overnight. Gwinnett, which was lush green land space from Exit 104 North has now turned into what was stated above. A strip mall ladened, cookie cutter developed concrete jungle. Of course, never mind any infrastucture to support it.

All in all both counties have encountered the wounds of rapid growth over the last decades due to the influx of Rust Belt Refugees, illegal immigrants, and those running from the City of Atlanta itself. It's not about who has the "better" county it is the overall trend happening to the counties, just as DeKalb took the initial brunt, Gwinnett is now suffering the pain.

Who knows, as "THE CEO" moves onto other greener pastures to bankrupt, DeKalb will benefit, maybe, providing they don't go down the same road the City of Atlanta government did by electing another incompetent. As for Gwinnett? Right now, the tunnel is still dark. The government is entrenched, and though homes do not sell, permits for developers are still being issued, though strip malls are vacant, more are going under construction, though traffic is at a standstill by the Mall of Georgia during the weekend, we are building baseball diamonds without the capital to pay for it. Oh yes, and now we may get the final blow, MARTA Yes, MARTA. another deficit ridden transportation system that WILL NOT work. Why? Well, in Gwinnett the current beaucrats will use it as an excuse to issue another thousand building permits! In short, more taxes, higher crime, and just as much gridlock as the county has at present.

In short, we are suffering the consequences of rapid population growth (120,000 per year in the metroplex) without common sense planning from our elected government officials. The best example here is the Chairman of Gwinnetts planning commission, which happens to be the largest developer in the State of Georgia. Rather sad isn't it.

[BobKovacs]

Originally Posted by blackrabbit

All I know is annecdotal evidence at work. All the professionals making over 125k live in Dekalb or Fulton ITP. All the support folks making less live in Gwinnett and talk about how great places like Lawrenceville and Dacula are!!!. Personally all I ever see is traffic, strip malls, chain stores and tract housing when I drive thru Gwinnett plus a water tower saying how great the place is but I guess that appeals to some.

Funny thing they just leveled the last project near me in Brookhaven and word is all the people got vouchers to move to guess where?

Well, there I go bucking the trend again- working downtown, making over $125k/year, and living out in Cherokee County. I guess I'm just a rebel like that......

[RainyRainyDay]

Originally Posted by blackrabbit

All I know is annecdotal evidence at work. All the professionals making over 125k live in Dekalb or Fulton ITP. All the support folks making less live in Gwinnett and talk about how great places like Lawrenceville and Dacula are!!!.

Originally Posted by BobKovacs

Well, there I go bucking the trend again- working downtown, making over $125k/year, and living out in Cherokee County. I guess I'm just a rebel like that......

True, Bob, but then, according to blackrabbit, nobody at all lives in any of the metro counties but three.

[Ghanley]

Originally Posted by georgia

the term of dekalbinization of gwinnett came from yours truly.
I have shouted this from the rooftoops for over 2 years.
Other posters have hit the button in regard to this comment, being out of control, rubber stamp developer growth and crime issues moving north from dekalb into jimmy carter to pleasant hill.

Today, dekalb and gwinnett can provide 2 extremes in regard to county government which come out to equal results. In dekalb you have "the ceo" vernon, god help us all if he wins the senate seat. Cynthia mckinney ii anyone? Who's wink wink, nod nod, to his buds has led dekalb into financial turmoil.
In today's gwinnett, we have, well let's just call it the ole' slappem' on the back white bread blue bloods who have became developer patsy's overnight. Gwinnett, which was lush green land space from exit 104 north has now turned into what was stated above. A strip mall ladened, cookie cutter developed concrete jungle. Of course, never mind any infrastucture to support it.

All in all both counties have encountered the wounds of rapid growth over the last decades due to the influx of rust belt refugees, illegal immigrants, and those running from the city of atlanta itself. It's not about who has the "better" county it is the overall trend happening to the counties, just as dekalb took the initial brunt, gwinnett is now suffering the pain.

Who knows, as "the ceo" moves onto other greener pastures to bankrupt, dekalb will benefit, maybe, providing they don't go down the same road the city of atlanta government did by electing another incompetent. As for gwinnett? Right now, the tunnel is still dark. The government is entrenched, and though homes do not sell, permits for developers are still being issued, though strip malls are vacant, more are going under construction, though traffic is at a standstill by the mall of georgia during the weekend, we are building baseball diamonds without the capital to pay for it. Oh yes, and now we may get the final blow, marta Yes, marta. Another deficit ridden transportation system that will not work. Why? Well, in gwinnett the current beaucrats will use it as an excuse to issue another thousand building permits! In short, more taxes, higher crime, and just as much gridlock as the county has at present.

In short, we are suffering the consequences of rapid population growth (120,000 per year in the metroplex) without common sense planning from our elected government officials. The best example here is the chairman of gwinnetts planning commission, which happens to be the largest developer in the state of georgia. Rather sad isn't it.

amen!!!!!!

[atlantamoi]

Originally Posted by neil0311

The semi-rural areas like Buford, Dacula, and Suwanee are now built out and becoming concrete jungles

What exactly do you mean by concrete jungle? I think of downtown cities when I hear that expression. If you mean a few strip malls here and there, okay, but Dacula is still a pretty area with the major developments being new subdivisions in nice areas. Hardly a concrete jungle.

[neil0311]

Originally Posted by atlantamoi

What exactly do you mean by concrete jungle? I think of downtown cities when I hear that expression. If you mean a few strip malls here and there, okay, but Dacula is still a pretty area with the major developments being new subdivisions in nice areas. Hardly a concrete jungle.

Have you driven around Duluth near Gwinnett Place Mall and Discover Mills? Concrete jungle. I'm not discussing every square mile of the entire county, but even places like Buford, thanks to the Mall of GA and massive development, that used to be mostly rural near the lake are now being paved over. For someone who remembers the place 20+ years ago, the changes are drastic.