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Old 09-04-2009, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Atlanta, GA
926 posts, read 1,862,051 times
Reputation: 718

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Morphous01 View Post
Yes this is true... Go check out some vids by Dr. York.
Okay, I've got A LOT to say about this...just prepping you guys, lol. So while I agree that hair relaxers can be a unhealthy way of altering one's natural state and that a straight hair texture is more accepted in our society because of the propagation of Eurocentric beauty norms, I ask that some people accept the nuances and examine the hypocrisy that also exists among folks, including black men, who say "hair is just hair."

I had natural hair all of my life, but my hair was also diffiult for me to keep up and grow because I didn't really know how to do so. I rocked braids for some time and eventually just sported a natural, nappy short fro while occasionally pressing it last year. I decided, after MUCH contemplation on my part and consulting with loved ones, to get a relaxer for the convenience. A little social context to this hair debate-- most beauty products, as many goods and technology in this country, are tested and marketed for white people. Most black people don't get taught how to care for our hair in its natural state because the folks who have the tools to provide these products and information en masse (large beauty companies, hair care lines, authors, etc.) cater to white women. Therefore, our hair can seem unmanageable and be unhealthy. So many of us go the easy route--relax it, then all you have to do is have someone else take care of it or just wrap it and go.

While maintaining my consciousness and pride, I relaxed my hair. This decision did not catalyze the collapse of my community. I did not lose my sense of African-ness. I just made my mornings a lot less frustrating.

For those who are "conscious" it is up to us to know how to teach our people in a constructive manner. Telling our people that we're destroying each other without understanding their individual choices is more destructive than my personal decision for what I do with MY hair. For many of us, it's not that deep.

On that note, many of us do find straight hair that flows pretty and beautiful and find it more beautiful than coily, kinky hair. I have no doubt in my mind that this world's obsession with Eurocentric aesthetics produces that sentiment. Without being aware that we want to be white, we are subconsiously fixated on European beauty standards because it surrounds us and white folks are in power to maintain that standard.

And here's the hypocrisy with the "it's just hair" types. When I rock straight hair, I get more attention from black dudes, including the so-called revolutionaries. Y'all tell us to be proud of our beauty yet some won't look twice at a brown girl with a real ass afro. There is this behavior among all of us, men and women, latino, asian, black or white to be attracted to what looks European because that's what we are ALL exposed to. Flip through the now defunct KING magazine. It's catered towards Black men, but how many nappy-headed women are gracing the covers of KING? How many black men in the public eye embrace a brown-skinned sistah with kinky hair? Even growing up in grassroots organizations, most of the guys who were all "conscious" married mixed looking, straight haired black women. This should go without saying, but this applies to whites as well who ask why it's such a big deal, but then fire you for rocking your teeny 'fro to work or discriminate against black folks for wearing locks. (A good discussion of this here: LAWSUIT: Woman Claims Donald Trump Fired Her For Wearing NATURAL HAIR!!! - MediaTakeOut.com™ 2009).

Black women ain't in this alone. We ALL subconciously accept the notion that what's "white is right." Instead of pointing fingers, we ALL should work together by studying and researching our hair types and developing products that work for our hair texture, own media companies to propagate our own standards of beauty, and constructively enlighten our sisters and brothers on the health risks associated with relaxing. THEN things might change.

Last edited by bizchick86; 09-04-2009 at 12:33 PM..

 
Old 09-05-2009, 07:46 PM
 
65 posts, read 160,010 times
Reputation: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by bizchick86 View Post
For those who are "conscious" it is up to us to know how to teach our people in a constructive manner. Telling our people that we're destroying each other without understanding their individual choices is more destructive than my personal decision for what I do with MY hair. For many of us, it's not that deep.

On that note, many of us do find straight hair that flows pretty and beautiful and find it more beautiful than coily, kinky hair. I have no doubt in my mind that this world's obsession with Eurocentric aesthetics produces that sentiment. Without being aware that we want to be white, we are subconsiously fixated on European beauty standards because it surrounds us and white folks are in power to maintain that standard.

And here's the hypocrisy with the "it's just hair" types. When I rock straight hair, I get more attention from black dudes, including the so-called revolutionaries. Y'all tell us to be proud of our beauty yet some won't look twice at a brown girl with a real ass afro. There is this behavior among all of us, men and women, latino, asian, black or white to be attracted to what looks European because that's what we are ALL exposed to. Flip through the now defunct KING magazine. It's catered towards Black men, but how many nappy-headed women are gracing the covers of KING? How many black men in the public eye embrace a brown-skinned sistah with kinky hair? Even growing up in grassroots organizations, most of the guys who were all "conscious" married mixed looking, straight haired black women. This should go without saying, but this applies to whites as well who ask why it's such a big deal, but then fire you for rocking your teeny 'fro to work or discriminate against black folks for wearing locks. (A good discussion of this here: LAWSUIT: Woman Claims Donald Trump Fired Her For Wearing NATURAL HAIR!!! - MediaTakeOut.comô 2009).

Black women ain't in this alone. We ALL subconciously accept the notion that what's "white is right." Instead of pointing fingers, we ALL should work together by studying and researching our hair types and developing products that work for our hair texture, own media companies to propagate our own standards of beauty, and constructively enlighten our sisters and brothers on the health risks associated with relaxing. THEN things might change.
ditto
ditto
to most of what you said. except the prefer straight hair thing . . . i like my hair kinky just as much straight. I haven't had a perm in over a decade, and never will again. I typically wear some version of braids, twists, or fro. However, I grew up rocking every black girl permed style you can think of so know both sides. last winter i got tired of the braids and such and bought a chi (those things are fabulous ), and wore my hair straight for 6 mths. Whoah! talk about the compliments, "oh your hair is so pretty" "oh you look great with your hair like that" "oh you need to do that more often" including the "concious" brothas I've dated who i know really do like my curly hair. one told me, "you just look so vibrant" hmmm.

neway, point is that i agree with the affect living in this eurocentric world has on ALL of us. it is hilarious to see the attention i get when my hair is straight, even from the "african center my nubian queen" crew. i continually get annoyed with condescending folks who dismiss black women's issues with their hair as self-inflicted vainity. ALL women are obsessed with their hair! Black women have to live in a world where we are told on a daily basis that are most natural state is at the bottom of the beauty rung. trust me, i've gotten the fever from many segments of society for rocking my regular natural state but i have enough self confidence, pride in my heritage, and knowledge to move on. every sista doesn't have that. instead of preacihng from the high horse, those concerned should try instilling self-love to those sistas. it will go much further
 
Old 09-08-2009, 08:25 AM
 
Location: Atlanta, GA
926 posts, read 1,862,051 times
Reputation: 718
Preach..you feel me diva; that's exactly what I'm saying. And I'm not saying we all prefer straight hair, just based on the proportion of black women who have presses and perms, the billion dollar hair care industry revolved around straight hair, and the weave consumption of black women for that yaki/indian remi 4b, we have made it clear what type of hair most black women prefer.

There are some exceptions, like you, but unfortunately not many. And many black women prefer the natural out of convenience, but I can bet that if they could be born with a straighter texture they would. Not at all saying you do this, but that many black women would probably want "good" hair if they had the choice (and I despise that term, but that's the best way to address it right now)

Of course we know the reasons why, as stated above, but it's still the sad reality.


Quote:
Originally Posted by diva05 View Post
ditto
ditto
to most of what you said. except the prefer straight hair thing . . . i like my hair kinky just as much straight. I haven't had a perm in over a decade, and never will again. I typically wear some version of braids, twists, or fro. However, I grew up rocking every black girl permed style you can think of so know both sides. last winter i got tired of the braids and such and bought a chi (those things are fabulous ), and wore my hair straight for 6 mths. Whoah! talk about the compliments, "oh your hair is so pretty" "oh you look great with your hair like that" "oh you need to do that more often" including the "concious" brothas I've dated who i know really do like my curly hair. one told me, "you just look so vibrant" hmmm.

neway, point is that i agree with the affect living in this eurocentric world has on ALL of us. it is hilarious to see the attention i get when my hair is straight, even from the "african center my nubian queen" crew. i continually get annoyed with condescending folks who dismiss black women's issues with their hair as self-inflicted vainity. ALL women are obsessed with their hair! Black women have to live in a world where we are told on a daily basis that are most natural state is at the bottom of the beauty rung. trust me, i've gotten the fever from many segments of society for rocking my regular natural state but i have enough self confidence, pride in my heritage, and knowledge to move on. every sista doesn't have that. instead of preacihng from the high horse, those concerned should try instilling self-love to those sistas. it will go much further
 
Old 09-10-2009, 08:47 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
3,063 posts, read 2,981,279 times
Reputation: 1881
If you're natural I recommend Too Groovy Salon (ask for Akilah...but most of the stylists there are great). I'm natural and I'm pleased with the results I've had going there.

Oh, and shout out to all the LHCFers!
 
Old 09-11-2009, 09:55 AM
MGD
 
Location: Atlanta
122 posts, read 248,487 times
Reputation: 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by bizchick86 View Post

And here's the hypocrisy with the "it's just hair" types. When I rock straight hair, I get more attention from black dudes, including the so-called revolutionaries. Y'all tell us to be proud of our beauty yet some won't look twice at a brown girl with a real ass afro.

Even growing up in grassroots organizations, most of the guys who were all "conscious" married mixed looking, straight haired black women.

.
Hmmm. While I went natural for most of this year (my hair is stubborn and throws off relaxers in a minute, lol)...I have noticed that.

I got compliments from men and women on my particular natural look.

But the one man who I thought would most love it...gave me a surprising reaction that made me realize the ones who act most like they are into awareness and consciousness and realness DON'T WANT A BLACK WOMAN WITH HAIR LOOKING LIKE THEIRS.

I had my natural, and a pink halter top, black pants, black sandals, and I am brown skinned...i had no earrings headed out so my friend who is into a lot of earth tones and such (I am usually into straight silver or rhinestones or colours) gave me this giant teardrop-shaped copper earrings to go with the outfit.

White people complimented the look out on the road, black guys did too...but THIS guy has had the shoulder length dreads as long as i have known him, eats healthy, fasts once or more per year, just a very healthy, down to earth seeming guy. So I see him for the night and he has not seen me in years (and when he last saw me I had relaxed hair). I notice he didn't say anything about how I looked except how big the earrings are and I said yeah my friend gave them to me, you like them? and all he was in this careful voice after a pause was ".........well...they go with the hair."

I was like what the hell is that? I have a brand new hairstyle completely different from anything he's ever seen before on me and it's just referred to as "the hair" like it's some fad he can't wait to see pass? You could tell from the blah tone of voice he did not like the earrings nor the hair, cause he usually gives me a compliment on how I look, especially if the hair is styled differently.

I said to myself interesting. He has dreads but he obviously prefers my hair relaxed and seems to think the whole big earring/natural hair "look" is less than appetizing. Last time I visited him I heard how sexy i was, this time he said NOTHING.

White people like how I looked more than he did, and he is one of the few dreads I know, I would have thought he would be more into a woman with natural hair, not less.

Funny thing though, cause i was raised to not like dreads, and I'm still not big on them. Natural low cut hair on a man is fine, but some girls lose it over big long Bob Marley dreadlocks. I don't like those, and I'm Jamaican. If it's brainwashing or whatever fine, but I look at them and feel like if they touch my skin my eczema will break right out. lol.

Anyway that's my contribution. I have seen what this poster is talking about. And dem dreadlocked men might feel the hair represents STRENGTH, but if that's the case they don't want a woman who represents STRENGTH, they want a woman who, going by that definition of what types of hair means, is VULNERABLE or WEAKER.

Either way natural or relaxed is fine with me, I have gone to interviews with natural hair and gotten the job, and the interviewer was white and female or white and male...but I will relax my hair when i feel like it cause i'm use to it and cause i hate being bothered to do my own hair and natural salons are a. hard to find and b. EXPENSIVE.

But it was a real shock to realize a man with LOCKS and into all kinds of natural things, of all people, did not like my hair natural.
 
Old 09-11-2009, 11:54 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
3,063 posts, read 2,981,279 times
Reputation: 1881
^Wowwww....

An ex of mine, who considered himself to be a "conscious" type of brother, had locks and always talked about loving women with natural hair. When I cut my relaxed hair off to a little fro he said I "need to lock that ish", and that my hair looked like a "dried our jheri curl". We weren't together for much longer after that.

One day I wore my hair out in a twistout, and it was longer then, so I had it pulled back with a headband. My male friend who I was with tugged on it and asked me, "What do you plan on doing with THIS?"

And when I told a different male friend of mine that I was going to go natural, he asked, "Why would you wanna do that? You're just gonna end up with with a nappy @ss afro."

White women have the same hair as their white male counterparts, asian women have the same hair as their asian male counterparts, and black women have the same hair as their black male counterparts, but I don't find too many black men to be too keen on a black woman wearing her hair in it's natural state.

The guy in the 2nd scenario above is still a friend of mine. The other day we got into a convo about natural hair (his girlfriend is natural now, and in the 6.5 years of me being natural I've seen more than a couple of people close to me decide to go natural as well). Anyways, he had made the comment that natural hair is okay as long as it's not "dry"...and I understand, but I can't help but think that he expects natural hair to have the same sheen as relaxed hair, which, depending upon your texture, is not necessarily going to happen not matter HOW moisturized your hair is. For one, straight hair reflects lights in a totally different way than kinkier/more textured hair does....so in alot of cases, natural hair is going to look drier than straight hair.

And natural hair "is" prone to being drier simply due to the texture of it; natural oils from the scalp of someone with straight hair is going to have an eaiser time traveling down the full length of their straight strands, as opposed to a kinkier/curlier texture of hair. I think black men should be more considerate of the fact that many black women are just now learning how to take care of their natural hair, and that takes time to learn how to do. So they should be more considerate, respectful, and encouraging. I have encountered way more negative and discouraging comments about my natural hair from black men than positive. Of course, now that it is longer and healthier they (black men and women that I knew from when I first went natural...including friends and family) look at my hair with more admiration than they did before. It's funny....
 
Old 10-27-2009, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Atlanta, GA
926 posts, read 1,862,051 times
Reputation: 718
Thank you for these posts guys...seriously, that's why I have mixed feelings about Good Hair. And apparently, Chris Rock still doesn't "get it." When he was on Oprah's show and she showed a photo of her with her natural hair, he made some derogatory comment about her looking like a slave. You JUST made a whole movie about black women and our use of relaxers, and then the next second deride our natural hair? We can't win for losing!

For the vast majority of us, our hair will NEVER look like white people's. Once black men embrace that idea, maybe more black women can embrace it as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by southkakkatlantan View Post
^Wowwww....

An ex of mine, who considered himself to be a "conscious" type of brother, had locks and always talked about loving women with natural hair. When I cut my relaxed hair off to a little fro he said I "need to lock that ish", and that my hair looked like a "dried our jheri curl". We weren't together for much longer after that.

One day I wore my hair out in a twistout, and it was longer then, so I had it pulled back with a headband. My male friend who I was with tugged on it and asked me, "What do you plan on doing with THIS?"

And when I told a different male friend of mine that I was going to go natural, he asked, "Why would you wanna do that? You're just gonna end up with with a nappy @ss afro."

White women have the same hair as their white male counterparts, asian women have the same hair as their asian male counterparts, and black women have the same hair as their black male counterparts, but I don't find too many black men to be too keen on a black woman wearing her hair in it's natural state.

The guy in the 2nd scenario above is still a friend of mine. The other day we got into a convo about natural hair (his girlfriend is natural now, and in the 6.5 years of me being natural I've seen more than a couple of people close to me decide to go natural as well). Anyways, he had made the comment that natural hair is okay as long as it's not "dry"...and I understand, but I can't help but think that he expects natural hair to have the same sheen as relaxed hair, which, depending upon your texture, is not necessarily going to happen not matter HOW moisturized your hair is. For one, straight hair reflects lights in a totally different way than kinkier/more textured hair does....so in alot of cases, natural hair is going to look drier than straight hair.

And natural hair "is" prone to being drier simply due to the texture of it; natural oils from the scalp of someone with straight hair is going to have an eaiser time traveling down the full length of their straight strands, as opposed to a kinkier/curlier texture of hair. I think black men should be more considerate of the fact that many black women are just now learning how to take care of their natural hair, and that takes time to learn how to do. So they should be more considerate, respectful, and encouraging. I have encountered way more negative and discouraging comments about my natural hair from black men than positive. Of course, now that it is longer and healthier they (black men and women that I knew from when I first went natural...including friends and family) look at my hair with more admiration than they did before. It's funny....
 
Old 11-02-2009, 11:50 AM
 
2 posts, read 6,984 times
Reputation: 10
I agree Bizchik86 Chris Rock still doesn't get it! Why did he feel the need to "enlighten" us? Most black women I hear respond to the movie say he has been very degrading and did not show the other side of this whole good hair thing. I think it was a one-sided and incomplete project that needed to show more real educated sistas out there doing their thing with beautiful napptural hair!
 
Old 11-02-2009, 12:11 PM
 
2 posts, read 6,984 times
Reputation: 10
Default Dominicans..... Too much heat!!!

Ladies!!!! The Dominicans are not the answers to all our problems. When we allow our hair to be natural, it is the healthiest. Yes it is hard to manage sometimes but so worth it to keep some of the heat out of it. I don't have anything against Dominican Salons, but i do have something against salons that can't tell me anything about my hair only sit in my chair and let me break half of it off trying to get it straight, and burn your scalp with this high powered blow dryer. They treat your hair so rough it is as if we are paying the price for having a tighter curl pattern. Please look for salons that cater to OUR hair. Dominicans only know how to use excessive heat to straighten our hair. They don't know the first thing about African-American hair care. They don't care either! Ladies in the Atlanta area, if you are having problems finding salons that do natural hair, your head must be in the sand... they are everywhere from Little Five Points to Decatur to Buckhead. Try Too Groovy- 3 African American married couples own these salons and are into real hair care. Try Oh My Nappy Hair, and Sweet Potato Pie in Little 5 Points..and tons of others. Also please stay away from all these other nationalities breaking into the Black hair market. Where were they in the days of hot combs and afro puffs? They only want your money...they are NOT interested in keeping your hair healthy! Please take some time to know, understand and appreciate you grade of hair. Until I went natural...I thought I had the most unmanageable hair...not true. My texture changed drastically when I stop putting the chemicals in it. My real texture came through. It is still a little kinky...but nothing like the way it felt when it was time for a retouch when I wore the perm. I love my hair and I'm happy nappy-this is the hair that the Creator gave me. Love your hair enough to treat it right. Do you want your hair to grow??? Stop putting chemicals in it. They are too harsh for our hair. It's not as bad as Bantu and Design Essentials wants you to believe. Too much heat is not good. The round brush may be cheap, but you will eventually pay for it after your hair begins to thin. Patronize black salons that can do the same job you like in addition to educating you about how to care for your hair.

Read more: [URL]http://www.city-data.com/forum/atlanta/38080-please-help-african-american-women-who-4.html#ixzz0VjJ24DKp[/URL]
 
Old 11-02-2009, 12:19 PM
 
Location: N of citrus, S of decent corn
34,576 posts, read 42,741,316 times
Reputation: 57252
Did you ladies see the Chris Rock movie about hair? Did it offend you? Why do you feel you must spend so much time and money on your hair?
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