Problems at the Aquarium? (Atlanta: work, home, deed)

[Georgia]

Originally Posted by RoslynHolcomb

Yep, I definitely agree with Greg. We're a very frugal couple, accustomed to living on one income (supplemented with my freelancing and various other gigs). We were very comfortable in Huntsville, but I definitely need a job here.

So far nobody's offered enough money to compensate for the cost of pre-school/daycare. I would never recommend anyone move here with less than a six figure income.

Roslyn:
I have to respectfully ask, just what type of lifestyle are you referring to here? A mansion on the streets of Buckhead I have seen a couple of posts, this one above and about Atlanta being the city for only the well to do?

On this I will keep politics out of it and just speak economics. As far as "large" metro areas go, Atlanta and the Atlanta area is about the most economical location bar none. If you cannot survive in this area then you should forget about going to anyplace else. For the record, I have lived in Philadelphia, New Jersey, outside of New York City, and lastly Chicago before coming to Atlanta 4 years ago.

None of the above come close to Atlanta. In any of the locations above you can count on a condo beginning over 300k with 5k+ per year in property taxes. A regular middle class home, double and triple the cost and taxation.
Chicago, 11% sales tax. NJ 7=% income and sales taxes. Car tax? yes we have it here, but try insuring your car in Philly, NJ, or NYC. Try 2-3k per year for a jalopy. Go out to your favorite chain restaurant and add 20% more for the same menu item in Chicago vs. here and this is just touching the surface at a high level.

Sorry, but in comparison, Atlanta is WalMart and the other large cities in America are Macy's when it comes to cost. Now, if you want to play keep up with the Jones's (not directed to you as I noticed you stated that you live frugal), then plan on getting into financial turmoil no matter where or what cost structure you live.

With the above said, I personally would rather live back in any location listed than here, cost be damned. But until my job plans to move me back I have to remain here at least for another 5 years before retirement.

[Homer12]

Originally Posted by Georgia

Roslyn:
I have to respectfully ask, just what type of lifestyle are you referring to here? A mansion on the streets of Buckhead I have seen a couple of posts, this one above and about Atlanta being the city for only the well to do?

On this I will keep politics out of it and just speak economics. As far as "large" metro areas go, Atlanta and the Atlanta area is about the most economical location bar none. If you cannot survive in this area then you should forget about going to anyplace else. For the record, I have lived in Philadelphia, New Jersey, outside of New York City, and lastly Chicago before coming to Atlanta 4 years ago.

None of the above come close to Atlanta. In any of the locations above you can count on a condo beginning over 300k with 5k+ per year in property taxes. A regular middle class home, double and triple the cost and taxation.
Chicago, 11% sales tax. NJ 7=% income and sales taxes. Car tax? yes we have it here, but try insuring your car in Philly, NJ, or NYC. Try 2-3k per year for a jalopy. Go out to your favorite chain restaurant and add 20% more for the same menu item in Chicago vs. here and this is just touching the surface at a high level.

Sorry, but in comparison, Atlanta is WalMart and the other large cities in America are Macy's when it comes to cost. Now, if you want to play keep up with the Jones's (not directed to you as I noticed you stated that you live frugal), then plan on getting into financial turmoil no matter where or what cost structure you live.

With the above said, I personally would rather live back in any location listed than here, cost be damned. But until my job plans to move me back I have to remain here at least for another 5 years before retirement.

Agreed 100%. I currently live outside of Boston and am looking at the possibly moving to Atlanta. Prior to Boston I lived in Weschester County, NY and before that Long Island, NY. Property Taxes on Long Island are crazy, my brother is paying $14k per year, I pay $6k now. Atlanta is almost half the price and even at half the price you get a lot more. People live up this way on $100k, I am not usre how it would be a problem living down there making even $60-80k.


Georgia, just curious, why are you looking to leave? I do not have to go, actually think it would be better for me and the family. Keep in mind I have a wife that hates the winters up here and 2 1/2 year old twin boys. I think the communities are geared toward the family in Atlanta, at least the ones I have looked at, and up here you can not find that.

[RoslynHolcomb]

Georgia, personally I'm not interested in large metro areas of any stripe. I don't care for them. Haven't lived in Boston, Philadelphia or NYC and certainly wouldn't want to live there either. I certainly have no desire to live in a mansion in Buckhead. We have a small ranch in Dunwoody. More than adequate for our needs. We don't eat out or really do any real entertainment at all. We are very frugal and family oriented. My husband brown-bags his lunch. I cook three meals a day. We eat a LOT of beans and other low-cost food. I clip coupons and bargain shop like a fiend. I don't buy new clothes except for my son who outgrows his clothes rapidly. And we're having a helluva time surviving in this city. Can't compare it to any of those other cities, but I can say that for a southeastern city Atlanta is darned expensive and the salaries from what I've seen are NOT commensurate with the cost of living here.

Atlanta is a rich man's town. Keep in mind, I knew this before we moved here. Which is the main reason we didn't want to move here. Unfortunately, it's the only place my husband could find a job.

Originally Posted by Georgia

Roslyn:
I have to respectfully ask, just what type of lifestyle are you referring to here? A mansion on the streets of Buckhead I have seen a couple of posts, this one above and about Atlanta being the city for only the well to do?

On this I will keep politics out of it and just speak economics. As far as "large" metro areas go, Atlanta and the Atlanta area is about the most economical location bar none. If you cannot survive in this area then you should forget about going to anyplace else. For the record, I have lived in Philadelphia, New Jersey, outside of New York City, and lastly Chicago before coming to Atlanta 4 years ago.

None of the above come close to Atlanta. In any of the locations above you can count on a condo beginning over 300k with 5k+ per year in property taxes. A regular middle class home, double and triple the cost and taxation.
Chicago, 11% sales tax. NJ 7=% income and sales taxes. Car tax? yes we have it here, but try insuring your car in Philly, NJ, or NYC. Try 2-3k per year for a jalopy. Go out to your favorite chain restaurant and add 20% more for the same menu item in Chicago vs. here and this is just touching the surface at a high level.

Sorry, but in comparison, Atlanta is WalMart and the other large cities in America are Macy's when it comes to cost. Now, if you want to play keep up with the Jones's (not directed to you as I noticed you stated that you live frugal), then plan on getting into financial turmoil no matter where or what cost structure you live.

With the above said, I personally would rather live back in any location listed than here, cost be damned. But until my job plans to move me back I have to remain here at least for another 5 years before retirement.

[atlantagreg30127]

Ok, without getting too far off topic here (per the Aquarium)...

Roslyn's comments above about income quoting me were from another thread on the board - one where a young couple wanted to move here and live in the Dunwoody area, one one income of $85k per year, and this was their comment: "please advise if gross salary of 85K per a year (before taxes) will allow us living as we want (rent 2 bedrooms apartment in Dunwoody, buy two cars, go once in a while to see a movie, eat in a good restaurant, buy new clothes etc) without being stretch.", which on that note, I told them that it would be EASIER to live in that area, having bought two new cars, and wanting to eat in nice places and go shopping, PLUS be able to save money, if they made around $120k per year perhaps.

No one is suggesting I believe that you have to be wealthy to live in Atlanta. But if you want to make it these days on one "average" middle-income salary, have two cars, shop, eat out in nice places, and save money - then $85k isn't as much as what some people think it is. Yes, you CAN do it. No, you may not live it up in Dunwoody with it. That's what I was saying to those people in the other thread that I believe Roslyn was refering to.

And yes, the Aquarium costs too much to get in (to keep it on topic). LOL

[RoslynHolcomb]

I don't think it's a coincidence that most of the people who believe the cost of living here is low are transplants from the northeast. In all likelihood they are still being paid a salary comparable to what they were paid before they moved. (After all, if their employer cut their salary they'd be a lot less likely to move.)

They're from companies that are headquartered in the northeast and are saving money by moving their people here away from the high cost of unions, heating and transportation. So, they can continue to pay high salaries. Those of us from the southeast are most likely working for companies that originated here and are paying typical southeastern salaries.

So, comparing Atlanta to Boston, Philadelphia, NYC, et al, is inaccurate. It would be more reasonable to compare it to Nashville, Memphis, Birmingham, etc... And I can tell you from experience, that it is considerably more expensive to live here than it is in any of those cities. And unless you came here as a northeastern transplant it becomes apparent PDQ.

So, it's not surprising to me that finding finding a native born Atlantan here is becoming rarer and rarer. I think this city will soon be too pricey for anyone other than those who come from places with significantly higher salaries. Atlanta has become little more than yet another northeastern suburb. Good, bad or indifferent, who's to say, but that is the reality.

Actually Greg, it wasn't me who brought up your previous post, it was Rainy, but I certainly agree. Even without having two cars, eating out OR shopping, anything less than $100k doesn't cut it. People need to know that well in advance of moving here.

[atlantagreg30127]

Originally Posted by RoslynHolcomb

So, it's not surprising to me that finding finding a native born Atlantan here is becoming rarer and rarer. I think this city will soon be too pricey for anyone other than those who come from places with significantly higher salaries. Atlanta has become little more than yet another northeastern suburb. Good, bad or indifferent, who's to say, but that is the reality.

Well, eventually the influx of people from higher priced areas WILL have an effect on local real estate prices once the slump is over. Atlanta's days of being "cheap" are slowly coming to an end.

Example: Portland, Oregon. A while back, there was a huge migration of Californians who moved up there, where it was relatively cheaper to live compared to San Francisco and L.A. People in No. and So. Cal were selling their homes for large $$$, then coming up to Portland and paying cash for "a great deal" on homes there. In a relatively short period of time, home prices skyrocketed in the Portland area, since there were more than enough Californians who were willing to pay the prices. The problem? Portland salaries for locals weren't going up. The locals could no longer afford homes in their own areas. Much talk in these and other online forums were devoted to "anti-Californians" who were frankly TICKED about the whole thing.

Example 2: Vegas. Large numbers of migrating folks there caused some home prices to double or even TRIPLE in a short time. Now due to the current slump, prices have dropped a lot, but it was hairy for a while.

Example 3: Boise, Idaho. Yes, Boise, Idaho. Good number of Californians moving out that way and yep - prices are going up.

I have no doubt that Atlanta will be the "Example 4", with the large increase of Northeastern and West Coasters migrating here. Good news for realtors - bad news for longtime locals wanting to afford a place intown or in the closer suburban areas. Give it 5 years - we won't be talking about how "cheap" it is to live here again (and the Aquarium will cost $50 to get in). LOL

[lastminutemom]

Straying way to far off subject, but here goes...

Do you know why all the millionaires are moving to Cody, Wyoming?



Cause only the billionaires can afford Jackson!

[Smokipenelope]

Still off subject - but going with the subject of living in Dunwoody on less than 100K a year - it can be done, I can say this b/c I've been doing so for the past few years (going on year 3). I've lived in Atlanta my entire life so I don't have a "northeast" salary that traveled with me. I don't have a car payment, let alone two, but based on the amount I put in savings each month I could have one car (even two if I really felt the need), assuming I wasn't looking for high end BMW's or Mercedes. I'm able to eat out a fair amount each week, though I don't really shop for clothes unless I need something new or see something I love. Granted, I don't have children so I don't have those expenses, but based on my budget, if it happened I'd be ok on my income alone (assuming I don't go out and buy those two cars).

While Dunwoody can be very expensive (I see the signs for the 500K+ homes every time I drive through a certain area), I wanted to point out that it is doable on a salary less than 100K.

And to keep on the original topic - I agree with everyone that there are much better aquariums out there. Shedd in Chicago comes to mind.

[spacelord75]

Roslyn,
I wonder if your perception of Atlanta metro is skewed by the fact that your moving here coincided with EVERYTHING going up in price across the board, most notably gas and food. I am actually a native Atlantan (actually native Dunwoodian) and have always felt that Atlanta is a pretty affordable city. Even when I was fresh out of school making half what I do now, I still felt that it was very manageable compared to places I would travel for work (including mid-sized cities). But NOW, even with dual incomes and no kids, I am feeling the pinch and really having to cut down on a lot of things b/c it almost seems like breathing is more expensive! Not really driven by the city, but more the economy and impending depression instead.

[jjbradleynyc]

Originally Posted by ellar

Oh my goodness...I'm surprised by this thread. Maybe many people haven't been in Atlanta long enough to see what used to be in the area that now has the park and aquarium. It is such a HUGE improvement that I would think most people would be thankful. We went to the aquarium shortly after it opened and loved it. I don't know what people are expecting--there is only so much you can with an aquarium, and we had no complaints.

It's a HUGE improvement over what was there before--which was what, a parking lot? I remember that area before Centennial Park--so it was desolate and kind of scary after 6pm at night.
Anyway, my sister and her kids have been a couple of times and said the crowds were pretty bad. She said it was a decent aquarium, but not as nice as the one in Chattanooga--in terms of layout and uniqueness.
I always thought it was strange that Atlanta had an aquarium. Why not Savannah? The aquarium should be one that features native fish and aquatic life, in my opinion.
The whole idea and presentation seems forced--very similar to the "arch" recently opened in midtown. Very awkward and forced--not something Atlanta should naturally have, or something that is historical to the city. I think it's another in a long list of Atlanta "identity crisis" attractions.
(I do really like Atlanta, too. I just think it's made some major growing pain missteps in the past 20-30 yrs).