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Old 10-11-2009, 04:07 PM
 
12,917 posts, read 20,990,812 times
Reputation: 4076

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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnatl View Post
The block-busting realtors had them and their neighors absolutely terrified of the "impending wave", as they told my Mom. Funny to think how that particular neighorhood has basically gone full circle since then, but of course it is now very integrated.

I blame many of the realtors of that time for fanning the flames of fear.

.
Right on, Brother J!

 
Old 10-11-2009, 05:20 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
3,463 posts, read 4,115,736 times
Reputation: 2162
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheseGoTo11 View Post
look at Portland, they never had white flight, people there still send their kids to city schools, and there's a vibrant downtown

but most people (of all races) there still want single family homes, and will move a good distance to get one they can afford, whether they're black, Vietnamese, white, or otherwise

can also point to places like Charlotte, and the Raleigh/Durham area where white flight wasn't as pronounced because they were less populated in the 60s and 70s, yet people still want single family homes

white flight was really just an acceleration of a trend that started in the 20s with cars, Atlanta would probably be just as sprawling today, although there might be more white people in the south suburbs, either way have a hard time believing lifestyles now would be all that different
You could be right. But still, I'd think that most of the petty stuff that comes out of southern politics like "states rights", the confederate flag, and the back-and-forth struggling over how to properly fund & deal with schools, healthcare, and other various "wedge" issues would be moot and none-existent.

I'm tired of seeing so many in this state fighting the same battles that should have been decided 30, 40, or 140-something years ago. It is standing in the way of tomorrow.
 
Old 10-11-2009, 05:30 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
625 posts, read 911,554 times
Reputation: 227
It would have been the same I think. I'm not sure I believe in white flight, I think that sprawl was more of a seeking the American dream of owning a home. Not everybody wants to live in a city, I'm very thankful I grew up in suburbia where I go anywhere and everywhere I wanted alone with little to worry about. You'd have to be insane to let your kid out in any city alone.

You end up with a lot of fat children like is happening today. They aren't allowed outside because it's too dangerous.
 
Old 10-11-2009, 05:32 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
3,463 posts, read 4,115,736 times
Reputation: 2162
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnatl View Post
Anyway, the people that bought our house were a sweet elderly couple "fleeing" Candler Park. The block-busting realtors had them and their neighors absolutely terrified of the "impending wave", as they told my Mom. Funny to think how that particular neighorhood has basically gone full circle since then, but of course it is now very integrated.

I blame many of the realtors of that time for fanning the flames of fear.
The politicians, various media outlets & powerful leaders in industry, and other "conservative" thought-pushers of that era played a heavy role as well. All too often the popular voices of prejudice on this planet seem to be in high positions of power.
 
Old 10-11-2009, 05:51 PM
 
Location: Gulf Coast
166 posts, read 534,114 times
Reputation: 145
Some people just don't want to live in the city. Is it so wrong that some people like to live in neighborhoods and areas where there are others like themselves? It's all about diversity and political correctness these days, to an insane degree. I have traveled ALL over the country for my job and still do on a routine basis. I've been to big cities and small towns, but you know what, I like living in suburbia. I like having a small yard, and a cookie cutter house. The crime rate is lower here. It's a FACT. The neighbors in this area ARE different. That's a fact. I'm a loner with a few close friends. I have been around people of other cultures and have gotten along with them fine. People CHOOSE to be around those that they want. That's like saying a guy who's into cars like me for a hobby is prejudice against people that play golf because they may not associate with them. There are good and bad of all races. I'm just so sick and tired of this "don't step on anyone's toes" mentality of today...and I'm from this young generation. It's nauseating. If I want to be a static character, then I will be; yet others will say I'm judgmental against others.

Facts are facts. The inner cities do have more crime, although it can happen anywhere. The person that got offended about "hood rats" living in the city needs to realize that it's a FACT. You don't see "hood rats" in upscale suburbs unless they're successful drug dealers. Sure there may be a few here in there but that's not the trend. Sure there are drugs in rich kid suburban schools. Of course; however, lower income fuels the most crime. It has always been that way and always will be. The lower incomes live in the cities because they cannot afford the suburbs, so yes there is more crime in the city. People got sick of the crime, so they left. That's not to say there aren't very wealthy areas in the city; there are. They may be blocks away from a dangerous area. People in general want to be as far away from potential threats as possible, so they just left for the far outskirts of the city. Over time neighborhoods diminish and people move up to bigger and better as they grow, get older, and more advanced in their careers. Lower income families move into those houses, and the remainder of the existing residents move out. It's the nature of the beast.

Sure you can call it sad, racist, whatever, but that's life. Racism comes from all races. You can't pin it on just one. It's the world we live in and this "change the world" mentality will never work. Live with it, deal with it. If you're about diversity, move to a diverse neighborhood and enjoy the freedom of it. If you're a boring person and want to be around other boring people; move to the burbs and live a boring life. What difference does it make?
 
Old 10-11-2009, 06:15 PM
 
Location: Acworth
1,352 posts, read 3,772,059 times
Reputation: 466
for one i doubt there would be daily muggings and assaults and even murders in teh GA tech area
 
Old 10-11-2009, 06:24 PM
 
7,848 posts, read 17,811,701 times
Reputation: 2762
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRA2000TL View Post
Some people just don't want to live in the city. Is it so wrong that some people like to live in neighborhoods and areas where there are others like themselves? It's all about diversity and political correctness these days, to an insane degree. I have traveled ALL over the country for my job and still do on a routine basis. I've been to big cities and small towns, but you know what, I like living in suburbia. I like having a small yard, and a cookie cutter house. The crime rate is lower here. It's a FACT. The neighbors in this area ARE different. That's a fact. I'm a loner with a few close friends. I have been around people of other cultures and have gotten along with them fine. People CHOOSE to be around those that they want. That's like saying a guy who's into cars like me for a hobby is prejudice against people that play golf because they may not associate with them. There are good and bad of all races. I'm just so sick and tired of this "don't step on anyone's toes" mentality of today...and I'm from this young generation. It's nauseating. If I want to be a static character, then I will be; yet others will say I'm judgmental against others.

Facts are facts. The inner cities do have more crime, although it can happen anywhere. The person that got offended about "hood rats" living in the city needs to realize that it's a FACT. You don't see "hood rats" in upscale suburbs unless they're successful drug dealers. Sure there may be a few here in there but that's not the trend. Sure there are drugs in rich kid suburban schools. Of course; however, lower income fuels the most crime. It has always been that way and always will be. The lower incomes live in the cities because they cannot afford the suburbs, so yes there is more crime in the city. People got sick of the crime, so they left. That's not to say there aren't very wealthy areas in the city; there are. They may be blocks away from a dangerous area. People in general want to be as far away from potential threats as possible, so they just left for the far outskirts of the city. Over time neighborhoods diminish and people move up to bigger and better as they grow, get older, and more advanced in their careers. Lower income families move into those houses, and the remainder of the existing residents move out. It's the nature of the beast.

Sure you can call it sad, racist, whatever, but that's life. Racism comes from all races. You can't pin it on just one. It's the world we live in and this "change the world" mentality will never work. Live with it, deal with it. If you're about diversity, move to a diverse neighborhood and enjoy the freedom of it. If you're a boring person and want to be around other boring people; move to the burbs and live a boring life. What difference does it make?
1. People that I match colors with are NOT necessarily "like me". There are more important characteristics that I would identify with besides someone's skin color. I have met MANY people throughout my life that were the same color as me but were nothing at all like me.

2. Hood rats DO often live in the suburbs...in case you haven't noticed, the inner-city hoods have been emptying in favor of the suburbs - I guess we can call that "black flight".

3. I'm not sure what you're trying to say...we all know what white flight was and why it happened. My criticism of it is that, in many cases, people just gave up and left their homes and cities without fighting for them. I don't believe in running away without some kind of attempt to fix things.

4. Sure, racism can be found in any color person. But that's no excuse for it. It's like you're saying "Well, they're racist, so I can be racist too." Two racists don't make it right.
 
Old 10-11-2009, 06:40 PM
 
Location: East Cobb
2,206 posts, read 5,949,137 times
Reputation: 906
Quote:
Originally Posted by blondandfun View Post
It would have been the same I think. I'm not sure I believe in white flight, I think that sprawl was more of a seeking the American dream of owning a home. Not everybody wants to live in a city, I'm very thankful I grew up in suburbia where I go anywhere and everywhere I wanted alone with little to worry about. You'd have to be insane to let your kid out in any city alone.

You end up with a lot of fat children like is happening today. They aren't allowed outside because it's too dangerous.
Medical studies report the opposite of blondandfun's opinion. Among white people, obesity is higher in suburban than urban dwellers. See e.g. Urban Sprawl Linked With Rise in Obesity
 
Old 10-11-2009, 07:34 PM
 
1,498 posts, read 2,546,173 times
Reputation: 550
I think people are using outdated terms in this debate. A lot has changed in the last 20 years or even 10 years in terms of the suburbs. Suburbs does not automatically equal white or middle class anymore, and intown does not equal black or poor anymore. There are definitely some very rough suburbs in terms of crime and poverty.

Things have changed, and are continuing to change, and im pretty sure Atlanta is on the cutting edge of the new trend. I would even say the changes Atlanta is undergoing right before our eyes as more white people move into the city may be as drastic as the changes seen during the "white flight era."

The End of White Flight - WSJ.com

At the same time, the poor people being displaced have no where to go but the suburbs, and some of those suburbs may not come out of this transition period on top. I think the southern suburbs will be the most affected. But the wealthy northern suburbs are going to stay wealthy. Atlanta will look more like a Chicago or NYC as a wealthy core city, instead of a Detroit or Baltimore in terms of racial composition and income.
 
Old 10-11-2009, 08:22 PM
 
1,367 posts, read 1,571,310 times
Reputation: 805
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnatl View Post
It's not really the same as Deacons family, but I remember some things from a little earlier.

We lived here for 18 months in '67-'68. My Dad got transferred every 18 months to four years when we were growing up. Atlanta was a stop between Charlotte and Florida for us.

Anyway, we lived here through the very tumultuous year of '68, the year we lost MLK and Bobby Kennedy. One thing I do remember is that this was the only big city in the country that didn't flare up into riots after Martin was assassinated. BUT, '68 seems to also be the year when white flight really kicked in to hyperdrive in cities all over the country.

We lived in what at that time was considered to be the far fringe of the East Metro, at the intersection of 285 & U.S. 78 - LOL!

Anyway, the people that bought our house were a sweet elderly couple "fleeing" Candler Park. The block-busting realtors had them and their neighors absolutely terrified of the "impending wave", as they told my Mom. Funny to think how that particular neighorhood has basically gone full circle since then, but of course it is now very integrated.

I blame many of the realtors of that time for fanning the flames of fear.

Would we be a different city if white flight never happened? Maybe, maybe not. Atlanta already had a very significant black population back then. I honestly think the massive freeway construction and wholesale clearing of neighborhoods under the guise of "urban renewal" did just as much, if not more to change the city - white flight or not.

Just my personal take.
I recently heard a lecture that touched on "white flight" and some of its causes. One huge factor in the favor of suburbia was that after the war, the US government offered low cost loans for new housing. If you wanted to refurbish an existing home, which was in pretty bad shape after years of war and depression, you were on your own. I'm sure the suburban movement was already inevitable by the time of your story occurred.

The Canadian government offered subsidies for both new homes and home renovations and Canadian cities did not experience the same kind of decline as US cities. I think some cities would have been healthier if the US did the same, but given our love affair with the auto, the suburbs probably would've still boomed. Still, its impossible to say exactly how different our cities would be today.
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